Karcher's Kuan Yin Oracle...

[beithe]

Has anyone read Stephen Karcher's Kuan Yin Oracle? And if so what did you think of it?
I just bought his Total I Ching after reading Hilary's review on the bookself. I know I will use this translation frequently so I am already thinking about the next Karcher book I may purchase.

TIA
beithe

[heylise]

I have it, and my first question was: is this a good oracle for me? I shook the sticks, and nr. 1 tumbled out. Made me smile, was like "simply start using it".

I give the complete answer, then you know how it is, more or less.

1 A lucky fate
Though you have been given a lucky fate, The time is not yet ripe for you.
Kuan Yin wants to say: if you are loyal and true, this fate will soon be yours.

Waxing Moon: Emerging Yang
This is the source of energy and power, the origin of sexual
drives. Use it to unfold your plans. Rouse things, help them
emerge and flower. Free yourself and play.
Season: Spring & the East Element: Wood
Symbols: Thunder, Wind & Wood
Life Cycle: birth & childhood

The time is not ripe, but energy is rising. You will soon emerge from the cocoon.

What Can and Cannot Happen
• Your family and household are in crisis. Get to work and find a solution.
• You can't complain about your business. Next fall and winter you will enjoy an extraordinary success. Creative energy is rising.
• If you want begin a significant relationship, this is the right time.
• If you are expecting a child, it will be a son.
• If you must go to court, have no fear. The judgement will be in your favor.
• If you are sick, don't worry. You will soon be well again.

Advice to the Wayfarer
All the signs are good. Don't let anything get in the way of going through with your plans. You can only win. Be consistent, loyal and true to the Goddess. Think about her qualities constantly!
Dharma: compassion and insight can change the world you live in.

(Many other dharma's are about giving, right time, staying on the way, things like that. Made sense that this one also gave a result: changing my world)

I seldom use it though. I always go first to Yi. If I want a kind of 'color' of the time, I go to the LingQiJing, and this one comes only after that. It hardly ever happens that I need 3 different answers. It would be too confusing anyway. It is more predictive than the Yi is, and even more than the LQJ. Its predictions were not wrong, but I could not find much realization of them either.

It looks very nice, box and sticks. Well-made.

LiSe

[bruce_g]

Its predictions were not wrong, but I could not find much realization of them either.


Interesting statement.

[beithe]

LiSe said
"It is more predictive than the Yi is, and even more than the LQJ. Its predictions were not wrong, but I could not find much realization of them either."


Seems to be a very black or white kind of oracle. I would think that change comes more often in the grey areas of life than not.

Could you give an example of "predictions not wrong/not finding much realization of them"?

thank you
beithe

[heylise]

I will follow all the predictions and advice. Tell if they were to the point or made no sense or in between.

"1 A lucky fate
Though you have been given a lucky fate, The time is not yet ripe for you."
Totally right

"Kuan Yin wants to say: if you are loyal and true, this fate will soon be yours."
Being loyal and true was important, for that fate to become mine, but had nothing at all to do with 'soon'

"The time is not ripe, but energy is rising. You will soon emerge from the cocoon."
Can 'soon' apply to three or four years later?... Oh well, let's be compliant...

"What Can and Cannot Happen
• Your family and household are in crisis. Get to work and find a solution."
Mm, same problem. When something takes many years, can you call that a crisis? Not really I think.

"• You can't complain about your business. Next fall and winter you will enjoy an extraordinary success. Creative energy is rising."
Success not especially, and energy was rather diminishing.

"• If you want begin a significant relationship, this is the right time."
No, was definitely not the right time then. Anyway nobody in sight anywhere, and if there had been, it would have been a bad idea.
Skipped the rest, they did not apply.

"Advice to the Wayfarer
All the signs are good. Don't let anything get in the way of going through with your plans. You can only win. Be consistent, loyal and true to the Goddess. Think about her qualities constantly!"
I had big plans, but I had already realized most of them. Things were still as if I was fighting a mountain. Can still hardly believe I made it. Not as if I had the help of good signs. Unless they were in myself, I was so totally convinced I was going finish this, no matter what, that I did succeed. At least with what I was doing, with me things were not so good back then.

"Dharma: compassion and insight can change the world you live in."
Very true. And very necessary at that time.

There was not much recognition when I got this. Some, kind of vague, and with some help from me. The only thing which made sense is, asking about the oracle itself and getting nr.1: "You want to know? Read the book and start on page one".

LiSe

[beithe]

LOL thank you LiSe. I believe I have the point. Pretty package but rather empty. I suppose you can keep the nice box and the sticks though?

I might like to have it at some point but it does not seem to be quite the thing at this moment.

ty beithe ;)

[boyler]

Has anyone read Stephen Karcher's Kuan Yin Oracle? And if so what did you think of it?
I just bought his Total I Ching after reading Hilary's review on the bookself. I know I will use this translation frequently so I am already thinking about the next Karcher book I may purchase.

Hi beithe,

The oracle belongs to ling qian type, and is devoted to Guan Yin. IMHO the translation is not good. I think there is another one by Kwok Man-Ho, but I didn't read it yet.

--
boyler

[boyler]

Hi LiSe,

Long time no read :)

I seldom use it though. I always go first to Yi. If I want a kind of 'color' of the time, I go to the LingQiJing, and this one comes only after that. It hardly ever happens that I need 3 different answers. It would be too confusing anyway. It is more predictive than the Yi is, and even more than the LQJ. Its predictions were not wrong, but I could not find much realization of them either.

There is a legitimate institution of repeated asking the same question three, and sometimes even up to five times, until one is satisfied with the answer (internal evidences in "Yijing" say the question should be asked only once, and sometimes twice, but the external evidences from the early period in the practice of divination with yarrow stalks and tortoises seems to allow multiple asking the same questions) in all known Chinese oracles, except "Lingqijing", which seems to forbids multiple drawings. I thought you might want to know that, in case you didn't know about it.

Anyway, are you still translating "Yilin"? How it goes on?

It looks very nice, box and sticks. Well-made.

Wait a minute, I didn't received a container with bamboo sticks when I bought the book at Amazon.com a year ago. Is there an edition of the book with the bamboo sticks?

--
boyler

[boyler]

Hi beithe,

Seems to be a very black or white kind of oracle. I would think that change comes more often in the grey areas of life than not.

I think it is B&W as much as the question asked. If someone asks about the questions for which the answers are ready-made, then one reads only the answer to the question one asked. If the question requires the answer out of scope of ready offered answers, then a received poem is read and interpreted. Anyway, the oracle is authentic, legitimate, and traditional, and in cases of ready offered answers to the often asked questions, it is much more popular, clear, and easy to use than, for the ordinary people, perhaps too sophisticated, "Yijing". It is said that all ling qian oracles have its origin in the "Yijing", or lean on it, although they may also draw their inspiration from other ancient sources from popular stories to philosophical works. Also it should be said that ling qian oracles are said to be received, by means of automatic writing, from deities to which they are devoted - in this case from Guan Yin.

--
boyler

[beithe]

Hi boyler :)

you said...internal evidences in "Yijing" say the question should be asked only once, and sometimes twice,

I don't believe I have asked the same question twice although I have wanted to. I guess I just felt that if I did I was second guessing the answer. (?) But I do ask qualifying questions. I had Hex 44 last night with no changing lines so I asked "how does this apply to my question?"
To me the Hex made sense but it didn't make sense.And I am not sure now how much my emotions may have had to do with the outcome. There are times that I do not use any diving instrument whatsoever because the outcome only seems to reflect my screwy emotions at that time.

And thank you for the comment on the Kuan Yin oracle I think it is one that I will pass on for now. I have enough to read at this point and feel the need to give my best attention to something I already trust.

At this point I would probably buy it for the box and sticks. :D

beithe

[bradford]

Hi boyler :) you said...internal evidences in "Yijing" say the question should be asked only once, and sometimes twice, beithe

I'm going to guess that this statement comes from Wilhelm's translation of 08.0 and 04.0.
The first one, though, doesn't fit very well with the Chinese text.

08.0 The Judgement
Holding Together brings good fortune.
Inquire of the oracle once again
Whether you possess sublimity, constancy, and perseverance;
Then there is no blame.
Those who are uncertain gradually join.
Whoever comes too late
Meets with misfortune.


04.0 The Judgement
Youthful Folly has success.
It is not I who seek the young fool;
The young fool seeks me.
At the first oracle I inform him.
If he asks two or three times, it is importunity.
If he importunes, I give him no information.
Perseverance furthers.

[willowfox]

Quote:
Originally Posted by beithe
Hi boyler you said...internal evidences in "Yijing" say the question should be asked only once, and sometimes twice, beithe


Hex 4 "An initial rendering of the yarrow stalks should be told, but a second or a third would result in violation. If there were such a violation, I should not tell him. (The yarrow stalks are things that resolve doubts. The reason why a youth beset by ignorance seeks me is that he wants me to resolve the uncertainties that he has. If I resolve them in more than one way, he will not know which solution to follow and then would be thrown back into uncertainty. This is why an initial rendering of the yarrow stalks should be told, but a second or third would result in violation)." Wang Bi (Richard Lynn)

[wanderer62]

Has anyone read Stephen Karcher's Kuan Yin Oracle? And if so what did you think of it?
I just bought his Total I Ching after reading Hilary's review on the bookself. I know I will use this translation frequently so I am already thinking about the next Karcher book I may purchase.

TIA
beithe

I just found out from Hilary's blog that Stephen Karcher will be answering questions on Greatvessel.com, so you might want to ask him about it personally, so to speak. If he's willing to discuss his work, then we should all try and take advantage of a good opportunity. So stop by Greatvessel.com and show your support.

Kate :bows:

[heylise]

155

[heylise]

Hi Boyler,

Nice to meet once again. Sometimes here, sometimes there.:)

No YiLin lately. Trying to become a (little bit) of a business woman, which I am not at all and will never be. But all the same doing my best. That takes almost all my time. Wondering how people do that, running a BIG business. Even a small one looks to me overwhelming...
But Yi is a great help.

LiSe