anomalous changing lines

[dobro]

Some changing lines seem anomalous, in that they seem to contradict the main message of the hexagram they're contained in. So my question to you is this - is the message of a changing line contained in the context provided by the its hexagram, or is it a 'free agent'?

Although a lot of examples of this can be found throughout the Yi, the example I'm focussed on right now is 9.5, so maybe we can use it for illustration. (Check out the thread about it in the Shared Reading forum, and you'll see what I mean.) Hex 9 is about restraint, but 9.5 talks about a situation in which little or no restraint is present. Which is interesting, considering that the relating hex for 9.5 is 26, a hexagram of great restraint. Even more intereting, considering that the fan yao of 9.5 is 26.5, which is also about strong restraint.

If you don't like 9.5 as an illustration of this, we can talk about 12.4 or 41.6 or any other you can think of.

[trojan]

Hex 9 can't be summed up as only about restraint but about caring for and tending to things in a small way - these small ways may add up to something significant but they don't look that spectacular. In terms of relationships I'd say caring for these small things could mean things like little attentions that matter, sending cards, regular calls and so on . So in the context of that reading in the shared area thats how i saw the emails. I don't see line 5 as anomolous to the theme of the hexagram

[willowfox]

Line 9.5 is not about restraint, it is about sharing and doing your thing with others, this line is in the place of honour, it is different from the rest.

Now, Hex 26, this one advises the querent not to eat at home but to take a chance on doing something, and the case was about sending an email which this hex recommends doing.

[dobro]

Line 9.5 is not about restraint, it is about sharing and doing your thing with others, this line is in the place of honour, it is different from the rest.


Okay, so two questions:

1 If 9.5 isn't about restraint, why is it in the hexagram whose theme is restraint?

2 So, if a line is in the place of honor, do you always view it as being free of the overall theme of the hexagram it's in?

[meng]

I always apply lines to the hexagram context, or else it would be like putting a duck bill on a cow.

9, imo, does restrain, train and refine. Line 5 reminds me of a rope: several strands bound together, the sum of each strength multiplied.

[sparhawk]

Large, healthy animals, need grazing time and space to roam around, before they are penned...

[martin]

Some changing lines seem anomalous, in that they seem to contradict the main message of the hexagram they're contained in. So my question to you is this - is the message of a changing line contained in the context provided by the its hexagram, or is it a 'free agent'?


Well, anyone who tries to find hard and fast rules in the land of the Yi will sooner or later either give up or jump from a skyscraper. :) But the rule in this case seems to be that a line is never a 'free agent'. Its message may contradict the meaning of the hexagram but it is still about the theme of the hexagram.
Every line in hex 9, for instance, is about 'small restraint' (or whatever else you take hex 9 to mean), even if the line doesn't explicitly mention this theme.

[trojan]

Large, healthy animals, need grazing time and space to roam around, before they are penned...

I like that ! Next time I get 9 i'll think of grazing - or Bella grazing

[dobro]

Large, healthy animals, need grazing time and space to roam around, before they are penned...

...and then introduced to Luis.

[sparhawk]

...and then introduced to Luis.

Patiently waiting at the back exit of the corral... :D

[dobro]

Okay, so now I understand why I think Willowfox interprets usefully so very often - she uses a minimalist 'the meaning is in the line' approach, which ignores a lot of the I Ching add-ons. I also understand why I think she gets it wrong occasionally, or at least why her readings differ from my own - she doesn't take hexagram context into account as much as I do. Brilliant.

[urim]

I hope this doesn't wake up that sleeping dragon...
but according to the Palmer/Ramsay I Ching - 'the shamanic oracle of change'--
which is a translation from the orighinal texts-- all the lines were added at a much
LATER date, well after the oracles were written. There is also some suggestion
that the hexagrams were an 'add on' as well.
Assuming this is true then in response to Dobro's original question-- would
this not make the lines a 'free agent'?

Urim

[stewlsa]

If lines seem to conflict with the theme or each other then it could be that choices are shown. If you choose this route then line a is applicable but if you choose that route then line b is applicable. You are the one making the choice so you are in control of the appropriate outcome. Choose whichever route is best in your circumstances.

[dobro]

Yes, or it could mean that the situation has conflicting lines of force in it. I mean, sometimes I have an inner conflict, and one part of me wants this but another part wants that. Situations are similar, with both positive and negative elements. When you draw a hexagram with lines moving in different directions, I think they're showing no more or less than what the situation is composed of, in all of its less-than-satisfying complexity.

The question is, does that complexity resolve itself somehow in the relating hexagram? You know, one reason I used the relating hex as part of the message the Yi was giving me for so many years (aside from the fact that that was how I learned it at the beginning) was cuz it helped overcome the complexity of 'conflicting' lines - it makes it easier to interpret and understand. I'm not convinced that ease of interpretation is necessarily the most accurate way to deal with it, though.