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a distraught non question

lasublime

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Hello Friends,
I didn't really ask a question, just a tearful statement

'I am tired, tired, tired and lonely' and I guess in the back of my mind was a
"WHAT NOW"?
The I Ching gave me 41.1,2,3,4,5 to 36.
Funny, I said I was tired and it agreed, with so many moving lines do I concentrate on the darkening aspect. I always feel the I Ching is advicing me to do what I have ben doing ofr years. Darkening of the light, I have been there for sooooo many years now, so to go from exhaustion to clipped wings yet again.
Se(iously too many lines for me to think and because it wasn't really a question. I feel as if I am being told to pick myself up (one more time) and keep going even though I am tired and lonely and can't see a way out.
Thanks for any help.
Sublime
 

Tohpol

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Hello Friends,
I didn't really ask a question, just a tearful statement

'I am tired, tired, tired and lonely' and I guess in the back of my mind was a
"WHAT NOW"?
The I Ching gave me 41.1,2,3,4,5 to 36.
Funny, I said I was tired and it agreed, with so many moving lines do I concentrate on the darkening aspect. I always feel the I Ching is advicing me to do what I have ben doing ofr years. Darkening of the light, I have been there for sooooo many years now, so to go from exhaustion to clipped wings yet again.
Se(iously too many lines for me to think and because it wasn't really a question. I feel as if I am being told to pick myself up (one more time) and keep going even though I am tired and lonely and can't see a way out.
Thanks for any help.
Sublime

Lasublima,

It's horrible when find ourselves in this state isn't it? I don't know your personal situation of course, but I know what it feels like to down in the pit. Been there too many times to count. I do however think that these things happen for a reason and there are always ways out of the impasse. Ah yes, 41 is very familiar to me!

For me, 41 is an alchemical hex in that we are being asked to conserve and redirect our energies after using them in the wrong way which has led to depletion at various levels. Simplifying and going back to basics is the key. That may mean emotionally and regarding our perception as to how we think things are. Uncomplicating our lives as much as we possibly can - taking out the trash. Defining what exactly is depleting us, exhausting us and how much of it is of our own making is also important I think. 41 suggests that you can really discover this and come out the other side. You can do it.

It's a bit like there's been a trauma and we have to respect the wounded psyche. Know that we are not ready to forge ahead under present circumstances - but we will. There are the cycles and seasons in this Hex which, if we are able to stop and let go of all things we so desperately want and desire we kind fall into their slipstream if you will; we open ourselves to those cycles so that we heal and regulate our energy and eventually those blockages. Rather like a river that has been dammed up by pain and suffering if we step back and try not to allow anymore negative thoughts and feelings to enter the flow of the river it can begin to find it's original course again.

It is like you have to love yourself and decentralise yourself at the same time. Care for yourself like a seed in winter but keep looking around at the world and opportunities to use your energy in productive ways, but to the extent it drains the energy of others or your precious reserves you are building. Small and simple. Step by step.

Above all Lasublima, never give up, never live in the past and keep your eyes fixed on what you can do in the present.

Just a few thoughts for now.

Topal
 

getojack

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Hi Sublime,

41.1,2,3,4,5 doesn't change to 36. It changes to 33.
 

getojack

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The feeling I get from 47 to 36 is that you feel stuck in a situation where you can't see the light. Look inside yourself and you'll find it hidden, but unchanged and beautiful.

47 is saying that there are things that aren't believed. So don't listen to what I say... just seek and you'll find what you need.

36 is saying that even though your light is hidden below the earth, it still shines clearly. Hang in there and persevere through the darkness and things will come around.
 

lasublime

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Topal, thank you for your quick response, though I typed the wrong hexagram.

Getojack, thank you for your very apt interpretation. Yes things aren't believed, like the possibility that there is light at the end of the tunnel (and not another oncoming train ;) ). No, I find it hard to believe, but I needed what you said to remind me of my doubts, and that little encouragement to keep on keeping on, even when I don't know why. Thank You. I look inside again, I will. I always, the eternal optimist, why I don't know!
Sublime
 

willowfox

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Hex 47.1,2,3,4,5 your affairs have supposedly hit rock bottom and you see no way out of your boredom/depression but it is up to you to get rid of those negative thought patterns otherwise life will seem s***. It also seems that you are easily sidetracked, therefore making no recovery. You have to be patient because some people in your circle haven't got a clue what is wrong with you, if anything, since you have all that you need, material wise. Better for you to get yourself involved in some family or community project, then things will improve for you, get yourself involved in anything.

Hex 36 says that you should keep a low profile, don't go moaning and sobbing to all and sundry that life ain't treating you right, otherwise you will annoy a whole bunch of people. When your life and spirit have improved into the positive realm then you can emerged from your darkness. Self control and determination to bring about a change of attitude to your life. You created your own problems, the darkness that now engulfs you, so it is down to you to find the Sun again.
 

lasublime

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Wllowfox,

"...your affairs have supposedly hit rock bottom and you see no way out of your boredom/depression but it is up to you to get rid of those negative thought patterns otherwise life will seem s***"

Absolutely spot on willowfox. Yes sometimes I am sidetracked by depression.

"You have to be patient because some people in your circle haven't got a clue what is wrong with you, if anything, since you have all that you need, material wise."

Do I have all material wise, since I am about to be kicked out of my apartment for non payment of rent, and I don't know how I'll be able to buy food next week, since there is no money coming in, and everything I touch turns to dust? I took 2 weeks holiday this year after four years of none, and so I am regretting because now finances are worse than ever,(It was a stupid idea, I thought I could be like other people) but you reckon I am fine material wise!!! I can't even buy a 4 euro pair of stockings without asking myself should I or shouldn't I. But you are right, I am blessed I just don't see how to access it, and the blessing seems to be having trouble manifesting itself, but I guess that is my fault. I do appreciate your comments, and your good will as well. To a big degree you're right, not in terms of money, but talent, that no one wants. And yes my friends probably don't understand, so talented and yet so incapable of finding work, alll those doors that slam in my face. No money, no material,, the means but not the will, not any more.

"You created your own problems, the darkness that now engulfs you, so it is down to you to find the Sun again."
Is it because I wanted to create problems, did I purposely go out to destroy all my dreams? I am seriously not being flippant, but I have problems understanding how someone purposely goes out to destroy themselves. I would like to think that I wouldn't do that to myself.
Interesting about 36, keeping low until I feel better, doesn't sound as negative as I imagined. But I never moan to people, everyone smiles when they see me, because I amalways soooo happy, so they say to me, 'you bring sunshine into our lives with you yr smile', they say. There are only a couple of friends I speak to, and never really about the depth of my loneliness and despair, that I keep to myself and the walls.

What you have said is interesting, and right to some extent, but now to find the will to do as you advise.
Thank You
 

RindaR

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Sarah Dening says "You must summon up all your resources of determination and will-power. Do not allow yourself to be dragged down by circumstances or wallow in self-pity. Life is not always fair. Yet the show must go on. If you give in to depression you will be the ultimate loser. You owe it to yourself to think positively. Fight your negative thoughts tooth and nail...."

I'd add that trying to fight negative thoughts directly only gives them more power, because they then stay the focus of one's attention. It works better for me when I replace them with an alternative.

for example: One might try to replace "I'm lonely" with "I'm not lonely." Is any part of you going to buy that thought, when your feelings are very intense?

nope.

So try instead to replace that thought with something like "I'm a good person, there are people out there who will like me for who I am, and I'm working on finding them."

It takes a lot of thoughts to change a feeling - like a little gear running around many times to move a big gear, yet it can be very effective. Have to watch the thoughts that try to move it back in the old direction, both feelings and thought-habits will try to keep things going the old way....

Rinda
 

willowfox

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Bad situation but you have two legs, two arms and all your faculties, surely you realized long ago that your job was going awol and your money was disappearing, so this is not like a nasty surprise for you. When I say material 'wise', I mean that you have clothes and shoes etc, you are not completely destitute.

""You created your own problems, the darkness that now engulfs you, so it is down to you to find the Sun again."
Is it because I wanted to create problems, did I purposely go out to destroy all my dreams? I am seriously not being flippant, but I have problems understanding how someone purposely goes out to destroy themselves. I would like to think that I wouldn't do that to myself."

You have not purposely done anything and that is the problem here, the writing was on the wall alongtime ago but you took no heed of it. You could have done lots of things to stem the tide but obviously you got sidetracked once too often for your own good. When you are in a hole you have to take any old job to bail yourself out, it doesn't matter how much talent you have when you are hungry.

I was once in my life in a situation where I had no money for the next day's breakfast( I had been kicked out of the country I had been living in by the authorities with no warning and no money), let alone the rent, plus I was in a foreign country but that afternoon I got my self a job and did fantastically well at it, even learnt some of the language.

When your luck has reached rock bottom, it can't get worse only better. So, it is entirely up to you to go out there and shake, join the community to see what is on offer, put yourself about. Hex 36 just says to be careful and not cause unnecessary problems for yourself. It does not say give up and roll over.

Loneliness is just you closing yourself off, don't do that go out and talk to people, seek their help, I am sure someone will help you if you ask.
 
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jimnammack

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I'm new to the group, so I am supposing that when someone does not indicate which I Ching version that one is using, it means that one is using the Wilhelm translation. If that is incorrect, then I would appreciate someone cluing me in.

Based on that surmise, I will further assume that you are using the Wilhelm translation.

Generally, my take on your situation is that your feelings of helplessness and frustration are unwittingly self-imposed. In other words, you are the one who has pulled the veil over the sunshine of your life. I also think that Rinda and Willowfox offered you good interpretations and advice about your reading.

Let's look at your divination in detail.

Hexagram 47 means oppression. The text says that in this situation, oppression is something that happens by chance. This means that your oppression is not the result of you or someone else trying to oppress you. There is no conscious intent by yourself or others to oppress you. Your oppression is coming about by default. The Judgment for this hexagram says that the great man brings about good fortune. This means that you definitely have the power to turn this particular oppression around. The Judgment also says, Success. Perseverance. This means that you can overcome your oppression though perseverance, by not giving in to it.

In your moving lines, the bottom one indicates that, currently, gloom prevails. It is unclear to you what you should do. You do not know how to handle this situation.

The second line urges you to make a sacrifice of some kind, and warns that going forth without making that sacrifice will only incur more misfortune.

The third line says that one permits oneself to be oppressed by stone, and that one leans on thorns and thistles. This moving line is telling you that there is something you are doing or not doing that is permitting your oppression. In other words, you are bringing it on yourself. The meaning of this moving line makes me think that the sacrifice referred to previously has something to do with your worldview. You need to jettison (sacrifice) parts of your worldview that are resulting in this stagnation.

The fourth moving line indicates that it is through humiliation that you will be able to bring about the termination of your oppression.

The fifth moving line does not offer any new information, but refers to the feelings of helplessness you feel in your current situation.

The information about The Darkening of the Light hexagram means quite plainly that the light is not extinguished, just veiled over by something. The text refers to the sun going down below the horizon. The sun symbolizes your life. Your life, in other words, has all the energy and power it needs to grandly overcome your situation. The powerful, magnificent sun is not extinguished, just hidden. The Judgment for this hexagram says that in adversity it is beneficial to be persevering.

I would strongly encourage you to do a divination each and every day asking this question: What do I need to sacrifice in order to become the most joyous and fulfilled person on earth?

Quite often you will not understand exactly what it is in your life that the divination is referring to. That is fine. Your unconscious mind will understand perfectly every time, and that all the understanding you need. Through this daily exercise, you will find yourself, little by little, day by day, becoming closer and closer in harmony with the person you really are. This means that little by little, day by day, you will be removing the veil that is now covering up the brilliant sunshine that is your life.

I concur wholeheartedly with what Rinda said to you about what you focus on. The more you focus on your current frustrations, the more of the same you will inadvertently attract to yourself. I would encourage you to focus on what kind of beautiful future you want for yourself, and to focus on that to the exclusion of all other things. Then, those things will be what you attract to yourself.
 
B

bruce_g

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I'm new to the group, so I am supposing that when someone does not indicate which I Ching version that one is using, it means that one is using the Wilhelm translation. If that is incorrect, then I would appreciate someone cluing me in.

I believe you'll find quite a variety of translations/editions being used here, including those of our own members, i.e. LiSe http://www.yijing.nl/i_ching/index.html Bradford Hatcher http://www.hermetica.info/ and Ewald's recently released translation http://www.eclecticenergies.com/iching/ . Naturally Wilhelm is a staple for some, but so is Steven Karcher. Many, such as myself, do not restrict themselves to one version, and rely as much on personal experience as on published work.
 

lasublime

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jimnammack,
Sorry for the tardy response but I found myself busy. Yes it is Wilhelm I generally refer, although I am aware of others, I just don't have the books.
Your line by line interpretation was very very welcome. It helped a lot, and you really seem to have understood the situation, with a wonderful ability to beclear without making me feel like an incapable fool, which I am prone to do. Thank You.

Line 2, the sacrifice maybe is my feeling of being unloved, hard done by, the one who's carried every one and now everyone seems to have turned their back on the one who was always there. Of course it is not true, when I think about it I know that, all I have ot do is ask, but my heart is so heavy. And those recurring dreams of me being left alone in the house as a kid '[I was part human and part animal in the dream] when the floods came, and my parents packed up everyone but me. (This never happened of, why this dream I don't know)
But Your reply did me a world of good.Allowing my self to be oppressed, right again, because I told myself I was too tired to go on. I told myself 'no, enough', that I had done enough I said to myself. But I must realise that I don't run this jump, and maybe the universe has a plan and a lesson for me, I should learn to embrace it.
Humiliation - Pride always gets in the way doesn't it!!!
Yesterday evening, after a day of blindingly calling me and every one else, particularly the universe, out of their name, at 22h00 I got up out of bed, put ice packs on my eyes to reduce the swelling of all day crying, went out, and you know what, I found 2 gigs, and the almost sure promise of another. And that was before I read your reply, just after willowfox and Rhinda and getojack. Your respon,se was the cream on the cake. Plus 2 goooood contacts, they came to me, not me to them!!!!!!! I was just there.
Thank you all again for putting up with my aching heart.
Sublime
 

lasublime

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just did a reading on your question, just this minute:

What do I need to sacrifice in order to become the most joyous and fulfilled person on earth?
answer
9,1> 57;
Haven't thought about it yet, but 'return to the path' uhm
 

willowfox

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What do I need to sacrifice in order to become the most joyous and fulfilled person on earth?
answer
9,1> 57;

Hex 9.1 basically this says that although you want to change the way things are, you cannot for the moment, just stay where you are and be patient, your luck will change just give it time.

Hex 57 says that there is not alot you can do at the moment but you can decide what your goal is to be and follow that star, this is about adapting your life to whatever confronts you, not trying to fight the problems head on, that would only be counter productive. It will take time and time needs patience to have the effect that you want on your life. This hex says for you to be like the wind, gentle but constant, never giving up. The sacrifice you have to make is to be patient and wait, your time has not arrived yet.
 

heylise

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A "non-question", I think it is one of the best ways to ask. Just pouring out your heart, and not narrowing it in form. I usually ask that way.

Very happy for you!! Two gigs, great!

LiSe
 
J

jimnammack

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Lasublima:

Thank you for your kind words. You made my day. Really.

According to the Wilhelm translation, Hexagram 9 is The Taming Power of the Small. The Judgment says, "The the taming power of the small has success. Dense clouds, no rain from our western region." The Commentary on the Decision indicates this means that you make progress step-by-step, in small increments. No rain from our western region means that you are yet to see total fulfillment. The Image for this hexagram says, "Thus the superior man refines the outward aspect of his nature."

Basically, Hexagram 9 seems to be telling you that, for now, you can expect to make small, incremental, step-by-step progress. In my view, that is amazingly great. Congratulations.

The bottom moving line tells you to return to the way, and that this bodes well for you. In the context of your previous reading, the meaning of this moving line seems to mean that you need to get in alignment with your Inner Being, and that you will definitely succeed in doing so.

Hexagram 57, The Gentle, means penetrating in the way that a wind gently spreads its influence. In the Appended Judgments for this hexagram, it says, "Through The Gentle one is able to take special circumstances into account." The text that follows states, "Gentle penetration makes the character capable of influencing the outside world and gaining control over it." The Judgment for this hexagram says, "The Gentle. Success through what is small. It furthers one to have somewhere to go. It furthers one to see the great man."

This hexagram, it seems to me, is telling that you are starting to make some incremental progress, which is excellent, but that you still have a lot of ground to cover in that endeavor. "It furthers one to have somewhere to go" could mean for you that you need to make some long-range goals for yourself. "It furthers one to see the great man" could mean that you would be well served to frequently consult the I Ching about this and related matters.

I would encourage you to do some I Ching readings about the dreams you spoke of. Your dreams sound positive to me, not negative. Record those readings in your journal and refer to them from time to time. Keep in mind that dreams are always symbolic, not representational. For example, if you have a dream about someone you know, the dream is not about that person, but is about the attributes you associate with that person. Usually, the other people that appear to us in our dreams symbolize different aspects of our own lives. Anyway, you don't have to worry about all that. Just record your dreams and your divinations about them, and this will serve as additional fuel for you to find your way back to what makes you really fulfilled and ecstatic in your life.

You said that maybe the Universe has a plan and a lesson for you. If the Universe has a plan for you, I would think that plan would be for you to awaken to the limitless power you have within yourself to do whatever you want. In my view, the more we try to be in accord with the expectations of others or other outside forces, the more powerless we make ourselves. This includes trying to figure out our "mission in life." Personally, I would encourage you to allow yourself to flow in the direction of those things that simply make you feel good. If you continually try to attune yourself to those things, I think you will steadily find yourself getting in better alignment with the basic talents, strengths, and proclivities you were born with.

Jim
 

mudpie

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Lasublima:

Personally, I would encourage you to allow yourself to flow in the direction of those things that simply make you feel good.
Jim

I second that emotion.;)

Lasublima,
If you watch children, skipping is one of their natural pasttimes. It is sublime.
YOur home work is to find a place where no one is looking and to skip for 10 minutes a day.... and sing, girl, sing to the stars. God blessed you with that voice and that alone is reason to rejoice. You are not alone in this world.
And it is never too late to have a happy childhood.
 

lasublime

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Dear all, sorry for the silence, Soon after my last post I fell ill (unusual for me) and was in bed for 5 days. I have now recovered and have been busying myself.

Willowfox:
Yes I saw the writing on the wall. But I have workedd all my life, and I have ignored my talent ALL my life. It is only 5 years ago that I decided to take this gift god gave me and try to fulfill a dream. I have cleaned toilets, washed dishes in restaurants and hotels, flipped hamburgers, been a cook, accountant (both self-taught), sang to the aged and disabled, pushed leaflets through post boxes,etc., and when I didn't have money to catch a metro to work, I walked, all 4 miles carrying my hope and trust that I could do it. I'm just tired and the thought and doing that kind of work all over again made me sad, that my effort to be a musician could have failed made me sad. Work is not a problem with me, when you're poor you do anything, and I have. I too have slept on park benches, wandering the streets carrying only a back pack and hope with me. I am not a delicate diva, I have never had the chance to be one. I just don't want to go back I want to go forward. When you are rock bottom you can only go up, that is what everyone says, but long, how many years and years must one be rock bottom. I would like to experience, for once in my life before I die, how it feels not to be secure and steady. I have put myself put and been rejected and that hurts. Trying depression comes from trying all those things that you suggested and not succeeding. I am not a Diva. Been there done it. But, I'm still here keeping on keeping on. As LISTENER said, god blessed me with this voice and I can't stop no matter what I say. I just don't understand that's all. Willowfox thank you ever so much for your strength and wise words. I will try to be patient, I feel as if I have been but maybe in truth I haven't because I have been so anxious.

Listener I haven't been skipping rope because i haven't bought or found a rope yet, but I have been dancing, thank you.

jimnammack:
You like willowfox and listener are basically saying very similar things, I am trying to flow, it's not that easy is it? Hee-Hee. Flow baby flow/

Secon round of "What do I need to sacrifice in order to become the most joyous and fulfilled person on earth?"
33,5,6>62
There's a song called "The Peacocks" towards the end of the song the words are
and that is what I thought of immediately when I got this reading, and also after readig Lise interpretation on her site. This is hard worked!!!!!!!!! Too many years of self doubt and loathing, but like I said I am a soldier marching.
Love and lots of bisous
Sublima
'find a quiet place inside where you can listen to what your heart is saying'
 
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jimnammack

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Hey, lasublima:

You got Hexagram 33, Retreat, which obviously means that you should withdraw from something.

Moving line 5 speaks of retreating while at the same time not giving up.

Moving line 6 says that this strategy works out really well for you.

All that brings about Hexagram 62, Preponderance of the Small. Basically, this hexagram signifies a transition, that you should set something different in motion.

My take on this is that you are being advised to stop asking what you need to sacrifice, and to ask some other divinatory question on a frequent basis. You have already laid the foundation with that particular question, and now is the time to refine your strategy.

I will throw some ideas out for you to spark your own imaginative insightfulness. "What do I need to understand today?" "What changes do I need to make in myself to become a more productive and happier person?" "What should be my goal for the next few days?" "What improvement in my daily life should I try to make today?"

Good luck.

Jim
 

lasublime

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Funny Jim you zeroed in on my feelings for this having to sacrifice, when I think/feel I have already. Maybe I haven't, I'm confused I admit, and fragile, but I need another word rather than sacrigfice all the time. Doggone!!! Thanks and I have been taking your advise and thanks for the ideas, i need them. Sometimes it comes to a point where you just don't know what to do anymore, a blindness descends and you feel 'What am I supposed to do now'!!??

bisous
 

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