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11 dangerous??

persephone

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Thanks to this wonderful forum I'm learning new things everyday, thank you all! :)

Recently an old friend appeared in my life which is wonderful, but when I ask the i-ching about it it seems to warn me. I get lots of 44 and 29.

Since it puzzled me (it is a really nice friendship) I asked the i-ching what the danger is about and I got 11 unchanged! :confused:

I've read several explanations of hex 11 but it seems like such a positive hex. This really puzzles me: what could be 'dangerous' about 11? Any thoughts on this?
 

chingching

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Danger of letting it stagnate from over confidence in its reliability which arises from the balanced flowing. All relationships need to be tended much like a garden. Currently my garden is so well established I dont need to water it much so I had confidence that it was all in balance, then I looked at it today and the vines are growing over neighbouring trees, weeds are shooting up everywhere etc. etc. still nothing is in danger of dying ..... yet.

11 is a good time to deepen a relationship wether it be a friendship , siblingship, marriage, etc. Take the moment of flowing to open up. There is always more to give and take.

Anyway the memorizing threads are really good for extra understanding, and quite helpful for unchanging hexs.
 

Trojina

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Thanks to this wonderful forum I'm learning new things everyday, thank you all! :)

Recently an old friend appeared in my life which is wonderful, but when I ask the i-ching about it it seems to warn me. I get lots of 44 and 29.

Since it puzzled me (it is a really nice friendship) I asked the i-ching what the danger is about and I got 11 unchanged! :confused:

I've read several explanations of hex 11 but it seems like such a positive hex. This really puzzles me: what could be 'dangerous' about 11? Any thoughts on this?

Well was there really anything dangerous about 29 or 44. Don't get too hung up on one word in a hexagram title.

I can't see what the 11 is saying here...except that sometimes I think perhaps 11 might carry you along in its wake, the flow being strong so to speak...but going back to the 44 and the 29s you had perhaps you need to keep an eye out for self serving tendencies in this friends reconnection with you.

I think 29 often refers to repeated mistakes and pitfalls. If this person ever let you down before then this whole pattern could be repeated so once more you relearn about handling someone who treats you that way. 44 too can be very much about someones short term interest for their own gain. For example if someone goes to a place where they don't know anyone...and they see one person they do know they may attach themselves to them as a way of mingling, getting by...but they don't value the relationship itself.

Also whatever is going down with 44 it can be very beguiling and lead you to feel this is a 'very important thing' that you have to make way for......but don't be beguiled with ideas of permanence of this and don't try to adapt too much to make space for it.

It may have its value, 44 is oft seen as akind of 'jump start' perhaps it invigorates you to do different things etc....but don't think you can 'grasp the maiden' by which is meant you can't hold onto this...or really direct it, so depending on how you feel about it hold your own space...don't be too pushed around or beguiled


so maybe there is no danger as such except the danger you may invest too much in the person or they may repeat past patterns. Maybe 11 is saying its okay, part of your lifes flow to be in that situation with this person right now...but just be aware of the 29 and 44

Actually I feel 29 can often signify some degree of deception...or something that endangers your integrity. But remember to scale your answer to the size of the question, it may be something quite minor like being unreliable....or making unkept promises and so on.

You can't take the danger literally here I think it is more danger in terms of danger to your heart, your feelings and your trust...but still scale that word 'danger' down....
 

arabella

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For fear of having said something about this too many times this week -- the recent webinar on Clarity brought up an lot of interesting ideas on Hexagram 44 -- interesting to me at least. For me, there was always that feeling from Hex 44 of something unacceptable -- don't take this woman, don't grab onto her -- a sense of unreliability or seductiveness. But what became apparent in the explanation was that this Hexagram is more about something very outstanding, someone you don't just crudely "grab" because they are of high calibre and standing. This was about queens, empresses, ladies of rank, which puts a whole different spin on the idea. That the person in question will respond best, and you will both benefit most, if there is consideration given to the quality, the power, they represent. This is a person of substance.

So if you consider that meaning, then move along to Hexagram 29, you are encountering the concept that a relationship is going to take the form you cast it in. Again, that the relationship will respond to the way you visualise and treat it. In your deepest self --- the Pit -- you are formulating how you intend to see it, whether you are conscious of that forumulation or ideal or not. So treat this friendship with consideration and care. Whatever you do is going to come back to you.

To think of Hexagram 11 as the "danger" is interesting. I think this is, again, manifesting. Ask and it will be given. Which is always a type of danger -- you will get what you want so what do you want? A big dilemma in life can be getting what you ask for and wishing you'd thought it through better.

Having said that, this friendship has huge expansive ability; it is pliable and yet solid, you can rely upon it and the only "danger" perhaps is that you take it for granted or don't give the attention it deserves. I'd imagine it can take many forms if it is carefully developed and nurtured. Lucky you!
 

Trojina

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For fear of having said something about this too many times this week -- the recent webinar on Clarity brought up an lot of interesting ideas on Hexagram 44 -- interesting to me at least. For me, there was always that feeling from Hex 44 of something unacceptable -- don't take this woman, don't grab onto her -- a sense of unreliability or seductiveness. But what became apparent in the explanation was that this Hexagram is more about something very outstanding, someone you don't just crudely "grab" because they are of high calibre and standing. This was about queens, empresses, ladies of rank, which puts a whole different spin on the idea. That the person in question will respond best, and you will both benefit most, if there is consideration given to the quality, the power, they represent. This is a person of substance.

So if you consider that meaning, then move along to Hexagram 29, you are encountering the concept that a relationship is going to take the form you cast it in. Again, that the relationship will respond to the way you visualise and treat it. In your deepest self --- the Pit -- you are formulating how you intend to see it, whether you are conscious of that forumulation or ideal or not. So treat this friendship with consideration and care. Whatever you do is going to come back to you.

To think of Hexagram 11 as the "danger" is interesting. I think this is, again, manifesting. Ask and it will be given. Which is always a type of danger -- you will get what you want so what do you want? A big dilemma in life can be getting what you ask for and wishing you'd thought it through better.

Having said that, this friendship has huge expansive ability; it is pliable and yet solid, you can rely upon it and the only "danger" perhaps is that you take it for granted or don't give the attention it deserves. I'd imagine it can take many forms if it is carefully developed and nurtured. Lucky you!

what recent webinar was that ? Do you mean on Change Circle, whatever it was I missed it..and i don't think I'd miss it if i was on there :confused:

44 has always had much contention about its meaning...and I feel this whole thing about her being a woman of worth you can't grab is pretty academic. Not once have I ever seen that in any of my own readings at least. The point is you can grab her or she can grab you but you can't marry her.

Actually I suppose theres no quantifying...'she' whatever the woman in 44 is in your reading...and it won't always be a woman afterall, could be a 'woman' of worth...or an opportunity of worth or not but whatever she is you can't marry her, join with her....and she can undermine your larger purpose if you allow her too much room.
 

arabella

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Hi Trojan! Yes, it was a webinar that was offered with Margaret Pearson. Maybe still available on here as well. I found it fascinating and just loved what she said about Hex 44 because, in my experience anyway, it often didn't fit, this idea of avoiding a "woman" -- and as you say it could be anybody not necessarily female but a presence in the situation. She had done a great deal of research that defined quite differently the six lines and what they mean historically and, therefore, practically in interpretation. It was quite an eye-opener for me and I much preferred the interpretation she presented. To me, it was far more constructive and valid, both now and in relation to its original context.

The idea of "grabbing" or holding this "woman" was quite different and came, not with a caution to think of this as impermanent or harmful, but with a caution to proceed carefully and treat the person or situation with an attitude that recognised their position, their weight and importance. And I'd imagine that includes their importance in the world, the situation, and to YOU as the querent.

In some ways, maybe it's a subtle difference, but where it differentiates the implications expand along an axis that could have enormous consequences so I was pleased to have this interpretation that Margaret gave and that I found more believable.
 

persephone

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Actually I feel 29 can often signify some degree of deception...or something that endangers your integrity.

All of you have said some very very interesting things but this struck me the most. My friend is a happily married man and admitted he used to have a crush on me. Now I'm thinking: that is it! :duh: It makes much sense now. Isn't 11 not yin and yang in perfect harmony meeting eachother in the middle? The meeting of the two?

So maybe Yi is telling me to be careful that we might like eachother too much? Could it be he has *ulterior* motives for wanting my friendship?
 

arabella

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Yes, and I repeat:

To think of Hexagram 11 as the "danger" is interesting. I think this is, again, manifesting. Ask and it will be given. Which is always a type of danger -- you will get what you want so what do you want? A big dilemma in life can be getting what you ask for and wishing you'd thought it through better.

Fine interpreting Trojan, spot on!
 
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arabella

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OH, I don't know what happened. I pressed a button to Thank the post that Soooo had registered. It didn't post. Then the entire POST disappeared. Oh dear. Sorry Soooo. I hope it reappears, whatever went wrong.
 

chingching

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well yes, but what are you putting out there?...takes two to tango, I dont mean that badly but it is always good to refocus on yourself, after all a yi reading most often refers to the querent and their state state of mind.

I've not had one friendship with a male that didnt have undertones...not one...I have successfully re-balanced such friendships, I've also had to say goodbye to 3 of them, and that wasnt easy. Now thats simply my experience.

11 is a good hex, but if things just stayed in that state things would fester. Thats what I was trying to say above. The advice for 11 is great though, do something... doesnt have to be big and then a lot comes.... and well if you are feeling things arent purely platonic, then maybe thats the danger too...
 

chingching

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arabella, posting red text makes it seem like you are angry
 

Trojina

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Hi Trojan! Yes, it was a webinar that was offered with Margaret Pearson. Maybe still available on here as well. I found it fascinating and just loved what she said about Hex 44 because, in my experience anyway, it often didn't fit, this idea of avoiding a "woman" -- and as you say it could be anybody not necessarily female but a presence in the situation. She had done a great deal of research that defined quite differently the six lines and what they mean historically and, therefore, practically in interpretation. It was quite an eye-opener for me and I much preferred the interpretation she presented. To me, it was far more constructive and valid, both now and in relation to its original context.

The idea of "grabbing" or holding this "woman" was quite different and came, not with a caution to think of this as impermanent or harmful, but with a caution to proceed carefully and treat the person or situation with an attitude that recognised their position, their weight and importance. And I'd imagine that includes their importance in the world, the situation, and to YOU as the querent.

In some ways, maybe it's a subtle difference, but where it differentiates the implications expand along an axis that could have enormous consequences so I was pleased to have this interpretation that Margaret gave and that I found more believable.

I know the one you mean, I've heard it, its been here for some time. Yes interesting but seems to me what lines mean historically is not hard fact and very much down to the writer.

I pretty much reject her ideas though they were interesting becasue i found they had no basis in experience. Too often 44 is not some glamourous royal figure you have to treat carefully but some demand or pressure from out of the blue, suddenly demanding attention. There often is a short term demand situation going on with 44.

But we will agree to disagree...noone ever did agree much about 44 :D
 

persephone

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well yes, but what are you putting out there?...takes two to tango, I dont mean that badly but it is always good to refocus on yourself, after all a yi reading most often refers to the querent and their state state of mind.

I've not had one friendship with a male that didnt have undertones...not one...I have successfully re-balanced such friendships, I've also had to say goodbye to 3 of them, and that wasnt easy. Now thats simply my experience.

11 is a good hex, but if things just stayed in that state things would fester. Thats what I was trying to say above. The advice for 11 is great though, do something... doesnt have to be big and then a lot comes.... and well if you are feeling things arent purely platonic, then maybe thats the danger too...

And 'balance' is also a word I immediately associate with hex 11.
I think you made a good point ('it takes two...') I think Yi is telling me that in this case I should be careful about what message I am putting out. My natural care-free flirting habits may not be so appropriate in this situation. :rolleyes:

I like how Yi is always giving me a mirror and tells me to look at myself!

@Trojan: now I see the situation in a different light I get every word you wrote. I got goosebumps reading it again: so accurate.
Thank you everyone for your insight, so so helpful!
 

chingching

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I agree trojan, my first yi reading turned up 44 and it was about what my driving test would be like. My examiner turned out to be well know for failing everyone , regardless, as I found out afterwards. She was cold and had traffic traps set up all over (long story) and she terminated the test half way with an immediate fail becasue I waited too long to turn off a busy four laned road ( I was waiting until I felt safe). At the end she belittled me and walked off with $180.

After the test I looked her up and many people had written complaints about her. Wish I had done that before the test.

I was inexperienced with the I Ching at the time so didnt understand the reading. Now I still compare all hex 44 readings to that experience.
 

arabella

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arabella, posting red text makes it seem like you are angry

Oh, sorry, no. It just jumped out at me suddenly what was being said and struck me how the two things were related. A Hex 51 moment, if you wil. No, not angry, just excited to see the correlation! :)

PS, tried to edit the colour -- it won't change for some reason. There's a weird vibe on that page I think. See my other post about "thanking" Soooo and everything going kaplooey.
 

chingching

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lol....sorry, I'm sensitive ;)

persephone...
flirting, ah yes.... but the rules are you cant flirt with married men (or men in a relationship), not even harmless flirting, I've paid the price for that before, thankfully nothing too bad though.
 

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29 isn't really about danger so much as risk. And exposure. Being in a situation where you respond or react to the environment without intermediaries like thoughts and plans and safety margins. Direct experience. Opening your heart to someone would qualify.
 

bamboo

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I have seen 29 refer to falling in love as well, with the risks being what they are. but i have always felt that 44 consistently advises shrewdness and lots of caution...temptation can be your undoing. if the man is married, makes perfect sense, though, right?

someone named Jesed on this forum once wrote that 11 unchanging was not a positive answer to a question... but i could never find the thread again and hence have never understood what he based that on
 

chingching

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i think maybe something like that is mention in the memorizing thread on 11, and if you do hex search I've seen this opinion a few times in various threads.
 

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