53.2,4 > 44

Not promising - bordering ominous. Would you agree?

Thanks in anticipation :bows:

53 is the waterfowl who flies to an unusual place, and in turn attempts to land on the branch of a tree, must like women who go to strange places to marry. It is fortune that is gradually opening up and getting better. For women, it can mean a joyful event is about to happen. But nothing must be rashly and impetuously. I assume that this is about a possible lover. He wants gradual progress with you, but it ends in 44, coming to meet or intercourse, physical contact, pairing off. It is also the decline of good fortune. So, it would appear to me that the man wants that kind of progress that leads to sex, but the problem is that you are both incompatible and he probably is not sincere in any professions of love or perhaps you are not.

Thank you Icastes for your reply.

He is just a friend. With my question, I was merely looking to know how I come across to him and was surprised to get two hexes with clear references to love / sex. I wonder if this is the way he actually sees me - a potential love interest, but a controversial one.

My take for 53.2.4>44 would be similar to icastes.

changing lines in Hexagram 53 relates to the current situation, where things should not be done in a rush. It is a gradual progress of a friendship that may lead to a relationship.

As for the resultant hexagram, I would take it as a consequence of being impatient or rushing things to conclusion.

In general I think the cast suggests you should learn more about the person.

Hope it helps!

line 2 of 53, shows that you are not seeing him as a friend but as potential partner,
line 2 is a feminine line. in the question context he percive that you are collecting info about him.... info used to please him in a way.

line 4 of 53 show that he sees a submissivenes from your part, he could use this attitude while looking for a better alternative.

also he think that you are in the steps or you'll be in the steps to try an aproach with him.

i don't see friendship in no one of you.

I appreciate your response Tifa.

I am however still unclear about the meaning of the reading. I did not ask about the situation, or its possible development. I asked how this person perceives me. Simply based on the actual text, my take would be that he could initially see me as a potential love interest and would try to get closer step by step in a friendly way ("Eating and drinking in peace and concord"), but he thinks I'm too yang for us to be compatible so will not proceed. This would appear confirmed by the steps of change, hexes 57 (The Gentle) and 33 (Retreat). Interestingly enough the anti-hex of 44 is 24, Return... our old friendship will not be re-established.

Now all this sounds just too litteral so I may well be completely off track. In addition, as I said before, I was looking to have an image of his impressions of me as a person rather than his potential intentions.

cris said:

I appreciate your response Tifa.

I am however still unclear about the meaning of the reading. I did not ask about the situation, or its possible development. I asked how this person perceives me. Simply based on the actual text, my take would be that he could initially see me as a potential love interest and would try to get closer step by step in a friendly way ("Eating and drinking in peace and concord"), but he thinks I'm too yang for us to be compatible so will not proceed. This would appear confirmed by the steps of change, hexes 57 (The Gentle) and 33 (Retreat). Interestingly enough the anti-hex of 44 is 24, Return... our old friendship will not be re-established.

Now all this sounds just too litteral so I may well be completely off track. In addition, as I said before, I was looking to have an image of his impressions of me as a person rather than his potential intentions.

Click to expand...

thats why you are unclear about the reading, becasue of the question. Its anyones guess how hes perceived you isn't it and none of them may be right or some of them may be right Probably the answer is about the development of the situation since thats your direct concern whereas his private thoughts may not be

If you haven't already seen this it might help http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=12642

if you already saw it please ignore this post

It seems that you are looking for a particular answer, which is fine I guess. However, I do think that how he **perceives** you will be shaped by his intentions about the two of you. Additionally, you did respond at the beginning with "promising, but ominous" or "see me as a potential love interest", which I would interpret as about the two of you, not about you specifically. I digress, but perhaps not.

how does he perceive me? 53. 2, 4> 44
- Perhaps how he sees you as embodied by the 44 (strong woman, with strength being somewhat double edged), which is perhaps the context of the answer. How he perceives you (in his life) is harmonious relations where the small things (meals, simple togetherness) mean lot (53.2),and with slow, adaptable, and discerning growth like a tree growing on a mountain. LISE's 53.4: "Connect yourself to the values of your life, not to its facts ... You pick up every small chance for improvement". In order to get its needs met, the tree has to adapt to its less than ideal circumstance to make things work; however, it does and grows big and strong. Thus, there is a lot of small successes, and adaptability and flexibility to make things work, which they do and this enables growth and progress.

Not sure, but I would hazard a guess that the answer is informing about how he perceives you and how he perceives you in his life. Whether geese finding rest after a long flight or a tree growing on a mountain-side, things are made to work in sometimes challenging but often workable circumstances. They do it through small and flexible progress; the geese and trees have to be flexible in inflexible circumstances. The 53 tells of the harmonious and enduring togetherness, and slow and graduate growth that he perceives. The 44 might shine light on some of circumstance/context he might perceive. Just my intuition. Not sure.

Thanks for your reply, Trojan. I had not seen the post, yet now that I have I still think my question stands.

I have not asked how he feels; I've asked how he perceives me i.e. how I come across to him. This has to do with me more than with his thoughts or feelings. I was interested in understanding what image he had grasped of me.

A while ago, I cast a reading asking how people in general perceive me. The answer I received was enlightening, also thanks to the contributions of clarity users. I was after a similar insight, only relating to a specific person acting in this case as a specimen due to circumstances I have not shared on here.

Whatever the Yi has answered - whether my intended question or anything else - it's given me (as usual) very precious clues...

There is apparently some confusion - maybe due to the briefness of my opening post.
My comment about the reading being "ominous" was referring to Hex 44 and his reference to the strong woman. It sounded like a clear response to my question - one I did not particularly appreciate. The "potential love interest" I quoted in my second post was a reference to Icastes' reply, in an attempt to put it into perspective within my question - and I tried again with the other insights, restating anyway that I was after a different reply. Love or sex or feelings were not what I was intending to know about - in that case I would have asked a direct question.

Interesting point you make, Ace, about perception being shaped by intention; there is certainly a mutual influence between the two, which sheds another light on the reading - making it, I have to admit, less interesting. I guess that's the Yi's lesson for today, and quite a brilliant one. Thanks for your intuition.

Cris ... with every entry you post here, I experience your strength, your determination, your quest about how you need this answer to be in order for you to value it or see its truth. I appreciate and honour your struggle here with our answers to your question. I wonder however if the solidity of your vision for this answer might result in the dismissal of Yi's vision for this answer, what each of us in our own little way is trying to approximate. I don't often argue or fuss about the inquirer's take or interpretation-- it is afterall your journey. I am however willing to encourage you to look further into this answer ... I humbly suggest you have not yet seen its lesson, and I intuit it is an important one for this relationship, and for you. I wonder if this is less a daily lesson, but a life lesson ...

I ponder what Yi is trying to get you to perceive about you through Yi's answer of what your friend might perceive. This only my ponderance, and I have barked up many a wrong tree.

May you have much success on this path of self understanding ...

Bowing deeply ...

Oh no Ace... don't get me wrong... the lesson I was referring to is definitely not just the flavour of the day. I never dismiss any insight, as remote as it may be from the context of my original question. Each input is food for thought. This is exactly how the Yi keeps calling me back, every time my rationalism gets a hold on me: it is so multifaceted and multilayered that its castings always answer my questions, on different levels and in different directions, even when there seems to be no apparent connection with the situation I'm inquiring about. It just sparks so many links... I'm sure you know what I'm talking about.

The way I phrased my question, the casting, the insights I received on here, my objectives as opposed to the results: this thread has been a learning experience. And maybe, the response I have found - one of the many - is how I come across to you, Ace, rather than my friend. And it's not at all less valuable to me.

"And maybe, the response I have found - one of the many - is how I come across to you, Ace, rather than my friend."

53.2,4, > 44 might apply to perceptions in different life contexts (e.g., your friend's and my experience of these posts, et etc). Ergo, my comment about life lesson.

And, I fully embrace my opportunity to be wrong ...

Hello Cris

I see nothing at all wrong with giving Yi the chance to tell us about any potential blind spots in the way we come across; it's just a way of getting a 'reality check' and building awareness of our impact on the environment and the people and other living beings within it.

I noticed from your previous threads that you've asked this same question before in different circumstances/times and in those threads your words about 'how am I perceived' were intended in the sense of 'how am I coming across', which is what you're saying here. When genuinely intended in this way, I don't see it as an attempt to 'mind read' or bypass direct communication, or anything like that.

Hexagram 53 is about interactions between people which require a great deal of patience, because they are so bit-by-bit in their progress, it can be like waiting for the mountain to move. Hexagram 44 is about a strong person who should not and cannot be pushed around (perhaps in this case it should be seen as someone who cannot be hurried along).

The lines of 53 are about temporary resting places for feasting etc, that are not ideal but will very much suffice for now and can be very enjoyable in their own right as long as the overall context is one of progress rather than stoppage or neglect.

To me it suggests that you're being perceived as someone who takes quite some time to arrange get togethers, that your pace is in charge of the interaction and the other person feels like they have to slow down a great deal to synchronise with you, and maybe that's sometimes frustrating for them, despite the other person enjoying your company. Worst case scenario: maybe it seems to the other person like it takes forever and a day to arrange just the smallest thing with you, and the enjoyment pay-off might sometimes seem relatively meagre compared to the energy input required for lift-off, and compared to what they'd like to have with you (I don't see anything in either the hexagrams or the lines to suggest that they dislike you; on the contrary).

I don't think romantic or sexual issues are implied, just that you might be being perceived as someone whose schedule must be fit into, or else nothing will result. Again, worst case: control freakery, 'my way or the highway'.

I also think that hexagram 44 as the 'relating hexagram' could well reflect that you're worried about your impact on this person, a bit concerned about your own power.

Of course, it doesn't mean that the perception is correct, just that the issue IMO with hexagram 53 is that the progress has to be there and despite being incremental it nevertheless has to be substantial enough otherwise things don't seem worthwhile or else they grind to a halt.

Regards

Nebu

i think that ignoring the fact that the answer is made by hex 53-> 44 is very strange.

in both case the hexes speak about "merriage"... to get 2 one of 4096 possible combinations that talk about isn't a case

since for sure this is the first time that this question was asked about this person.. as i say there is no simple friendship feeling as base... but a relationship interest. ignoring this doesn't mean that it isn't.

asking the yi for advice and ignoring the nature of the answer haven't much sense
:bows:

Hello Patro

The hexagrams speak about wild geese and in some views a dangerously tempting femme fatale as well but as far as we know there's no bestiality involved lol

If you look in the hexagram search section you'll find lots of examples where hexagrams 53,44, 54 etc come up for people where there is no relevance to romantic and/or sexual relationships.

As well as receiving them for non-romantic/sexual relationships, these hexagrams are regularly received for solitary pursuits too. Health, court cases, writing books, friendships, running projects, finding places to live, you name it.

With respect, I don't think accusing the original poster of lying is a good idea lol

There is no 'ignoring' or 'strange' going on. Exactly the opposite, in fact.

Regards

Nebu

cris said:

Thanks for your reply, Trojan. I had not seen the post, yet now that I have I still think my question stands.

I have not asked how he feels; I've asked how he perceives me i.e. how I come across to him. This has to do with me more than with his thoughts or feelings. I was interested in understanding what image he had grasped of me.
A while ago, I cast a reading asking how people in general perceive me. The answer I received was enlightening, also thanks to the contributions of clarity users. I was after a similar insight, only relating to a specific person acting in this case as a specimen due to circumstances I have not shared on here.

Whatever the Yi has answered - whether my intended question or anything else - it's given me (as usual) very precious clues...

Click to expand...

if you ask about his perceptions you are asking about whats in his head not your own.

Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to dictate to you here on what you should ask..infact I got this very same combination a few days back about a relationship of my own so I am very interested to read the replies and hope they keep coming. You decided to stick with the question which is fair enough except noone can actually give you any kind of answer that is remotely verifiable . Nevertheless you say you have learned much from the thread. I'd be interested to hear what you have deduced from the thread, genuinely because of my same casting



Looking at your answer its not at all clear to me how he perceives you. Is the 53>44 meant to be the image of how he sees you ?

Anyway generally I would see it at least as a pretty temporary thing. In 53.2 the geese rest happily, but they are on a journey elsewhere, its just a respite. And in 53.4 the goose perches in the brances of a tree which is a most uncomfortable and odd place for a goose to perch so there is somehting awkward about the relationship. It has its uses but its no place to stay. 44 seems to echo that.

As far as I am concerned translating that to his perception is pretty much hit and miss, taking your pick on which answer suits you most doesn't get you much nearer knowing his perceptions IMO

Thats my opinion. I do respect your choice to ask what you like though

nebu said:

Hello Patro

The hexagrams speak about wild geese and in some views a dangerously tempting femme fatale as well but as far as we know there's no bestiality involved lol

If you look in the hexagram search section you'll find lots of examples where hexagrams 53,44, 54 etc come up for people where there is no relevance to romantic and/or sexual relationships.

As well as receiving them for non-romantic/sexual relationships, these hexagrams are regularly received for solitary pursuits too. Health, court cases, writing books, friendships, running projects, finding places to live, you name it.

With respect, I don't think accusing the original poster of lying is a good idea lol

There is no 'ignoring' or 'strange' going on. Exactly the opposite, in fact.

Regards

Nebu

Click to expand...

hi Nebu,

what for a funny post is your....
geese... bestiality and more..... 53 talk about something else, the geese are the image used to explain the evolutions steps.

i'm not acusing the topic starter to lie... but just that 53 and 54 talk about something else here discussed. btw don't forget the question while analizing and answering.
how does he perceive me?... so what Cris has in mind isn't important... the yi refers to him about her

also... i think you forget the most important info here about the book of changes... in ancient china... like mostly also today... mariage and love are 2 differents thing.
one must not go with the other... both aren't linked

take in mind that getting 53 and 44 in a question related to personal relations have it's meaning... like every thing else have when talking about Yi.

Hello All,

I've been out of town for a few days without having the opportunity to reply to the last posts. A big thank you to each contributor for taking the time to analyse my reading.

Patro, as you correctly say my question was about his perceptions, not mine. I consequently doubt the Yi is saying I have a relationship interest in this person, as you stated in your first post. It could well be that he has an interest of this sort, or he believes there is one on my part.

Nebu, among the different insights given yours is objectively the closest to home. The person in question has directly experienced that my schedule requires a lot of waiting for people to fit in... The reference to time is also extremely interesting because the recent contact between us has occurred after a very long iatus.

Trojan, your attempt to read the casting as an image of how he sees me resonates as well. As I mentioned in previous posts, there are many specific circumstances that make the situation between me and this person litterally unique - the very circumstances which prompted me to ask the question in the first place - and objectively a little awkward...

Your help has been much appreciated
Cris

cris said:

Patro I consequently doubt the Yi is saying I have a relationship interest in this person, as you stated in your first post.

Click to expand...

i've explained why i stated this way...
and any way, you are part of the question.... so you can't be taken a part while answering.

he perceive you as a wild goose

You are more correct than you think

there's indeed a connection, albeit remote... wild geese here may represent a specific area of my life this person has shown significant interest in.

IMO He sees you as someone who is looking for a life partner and not just sex or a good time.