So a musician friend is currently on tour in Brazil (the lucky duck), and she's asked me to do something which is illegal while shes away. We are both on the dole here and her payment is due in tomorrow. She won't be here to pick it up and as such she wants me to walk into the post office and pretend to be her, forge her signature and collect her money.

There's a huge crackdown here on false claims when it comes to state money ( cos irelands so broke, like the rest of the world, thanks to stupid banks in america and their stock market) (grr) so i'm in two minds about doing it. If i get caught there'd be some serious repurcussions for the pair of us.

I asked the Yi and it gave me 4 UC. I haven't asked about this before, so the oracle isnt talking about asking too many times in this case. Inexperience...maybe its telling me not to be foolish...in other words, don't do it?

Because i wasn't sure how to take that, i asked 'what would happen if i collect x's money?' and i got 42 1.5> 23 , which seems really positive. so now I'm really confused.

any ideas?


Thanks

Yx

I'm going with the first one you received, assuming you asked the same question twice completely ignoring:

It is not I who seek the young fool;
The young fool seeks me.
At the first oracle I inform him.
If he asks two or three times, it is importunity.
If he importunes, I give him no information.

Click to expand...

#4 does not mean "try again" in any sense. It means Youthful Folly, Foolishness, or Youth, like you said. The image is that of a spring at the foot of a mountain. The true self wears a mask of inexperience. You've never done this before, or not enough times to be comfortable with it, I'm assuming. Thus the situation is very dangerous. This is a pretty clear no, don't do it, to me. Even in your second reading the hexagram turns to "Splitting Apart". Not good either way really...

you should "foster [your] character by thoroughness in all that [you do]". This can also mean, "don't go ahead with things that you won't be able to do thoroughly".

I'm not morally opposed to doing some illegal things every now and then, so I'd tell you if the reading was affirmative. But I really think it's telling you, "the outcome will probably be bad"

thanks a million Mr You. I thought as much. By the way I really regard your interpretations! Thank you!

I would say even without the I Ching reading, you should not do it. Why risk so much to do a favor like that for a friend, surely the money can sit until her return or perhaps be sent to her by the officials?

I would agree that 42.1.5 in itself sounds really positive, such as line 1 indicating that this is the time to make a great movement, and line 5 indicating that kindness is your virtue, and that you should have no doubt about it. But even not looking to the bad H23, I have found that sometimes the Yi Jing is simply saying, "This is how YOU see it. This is the idealized view. But look closer! Is it really true?" (for instance I have asked sometimes about some plan I had, spending money I could not really afford, and the Yi Jing will encourage me, but I am on to its tricks! )

So a musician friend is currently on tour in Brazil (the lucky duck), and she's asked me to do something which is illegal while shes away. We are both on the dole here and her payment is due in tomorrow. She won't be here to pick it up and as such she wants me to walk into the post office and pretend to be her, forge her signature and collect her money.

There's a huge crackdown here on false claims when it comes to state money ( cos irelands so broke, like the rest of the world, thanks to stupid banks in america and their stock market) (grr) so i'm in two minds about doing it. If i get caught there'd be some serious repurcussions for the pair of us.

I asked the Yi and it gave me 4 UC. I haven't asked about this before, so the oracle isnt talking about asking too many times in this case. Inexperience...maybe its telling me not to be foolish...in other words, don't do it?

Click to expand...

I didn't think anyone still physically picked up benefits money anymore. All she had to do was ask them to pay it into her bank account and then she wouldn't have needed to make such a daft request of you. Even dafter is that she is entitled to go on holiday without them stopping her money so she could just tell the benefits agancy shes away and she could get the money when she gets back.

But what a great answer ! So succinct. You have to put it in wiki as one meaning of hex 4 UC. Yi said " dur of course not airhead !" only it was more poilte and said it was foolish/naive. For the sake of a small amount of money she wanted to potentially cause you both alot of trouble and maybe even affect your future long term

Because i wasn't sure how to take that, i asked 'what would happen if i collect x's money?' and i got 42 1.5> 23 , which seems really positive. so now I'm really confused.

any ideas?


Thanks

Yx

Click to expand...

I think this addresses your motive...which was to help her. Perhaps your helpfulness may have been your undoing (hex 23). Even if they didn't catch you at the time something could come out at a later date...so you could be on edge about it for some time to come. Especially as they have hidden cameras everywhere these days...you collecting the money may be be on video camera. Plus if she was questioned re anything,...I mean hypothetically suppose she died in Brazil.,....then there may be a question about how she still managed to collect her benefits. The benefits aganecy would have to have date of death.

A far out example...but I'm just saying things can out of your control.


I'm not against breaking the law now and then either, for the right reasons...so I'm not saying it because of that....its just a profoundly naive stupid idea.

Geeze I just re read your initial post...she actually wanted you to forge her signature.....what an eejit (thats an Irish word isn't it...I quite like it)


I guess the whole question is based on complete naiveity.....which fits hex 4. I think it may just have been possible back in the 70s or 80s....but now its far too risky. Tell her to 'wake up and smell the coffee', there should be plenty in Brazil

thanks foxx n tro,

Its a wierd system here- some ppl get paid into their bank account, others don't. There's a lot of fraud surrounding the dole here lately, they're bringing in ID Card checks because of it too...we actually have a very high unemployment payment compared to other EU states, (i think we're second highest or something) (but maybe not anymore, its been cut by 80 euro in the past 2 yrs..( FUUUU GOLDMAN SACHS!)) but for a time ireland was well-rich, or we thought we were. the rise of the middle class, celtic tiger n all that..as a result Ireland in the past 5 years became a hub for immigrants (oh how times change!) and some right wing newspapers blame these 'foreigners' for coming over to mooch off of our system.(yawn)

But to defend my mate it's not unheard of for people to do this sorta thing. It was much more common in the 80's recession but some people still do it.

But having said that, my mate is a 6ft blond amazon, she belongs in brazil! and she was trying to convince me that this small post office wouldnt recognise the difference. Pfft. she cant walk out her front door without attracting attention.

the eejit.



Yeah i knew it was a bad idea, i draw 42.5 loads. Maybe i'm a bit of a pushover.

Thanks chaps!

Yx

please dont do it - noone should forge a signature for any reason.
i think no true friend would ask you to do it
they hit you harder for fraud than murder so......
4 is clearly that you are being foolish youths - it is the folly of youth
but with the growth of the big brother state anything can be tracked.

back in the ub40 days people swung such things - we only had telephone
boxes and no cctv - today dont even think about it

your friend is a numpty not to have it put direct into account - it has made
her compromise another human being ----- 23 telling me you could have your
Bens stopped (stripped)

yep, true that.

but we cant choose how we collect our payments, they decide if it goes into a bank account or not.

BUT she couldve organised it. your allowed to take 2 weeks holiday and collect your money after that...but shes been touring alot this year with the band...so maybe she already used up her 2 weeks holiday (think she has)

Thanks Hopex