Will D. work with me again?

Usually avoid yes no questions, but I needed a short cut here...

Is the reading obvious? Does it mean simply keep clear of the evil influences which you should have done some time ago (line 1) and literally that there is no future in this relationship and give it up, move on? (line 6)

or are we talking simply about disengaging possibly temporarily?

I got 33.16> 49 RETREAT> RADICAL CHANGE

I would be very grateful for any interpretations on this.

Is there any ambiguity here, or lesser levels than absolute good bye....? Am I just kidding myself
in imagining there might still be scope for this connection?

It looks to me like a Retreat, a going away from, and a long term one at that.
(Line 6: retiring after the work is done.)

My sympathies if you wanted otherwise.

Moss Elk said:

It looks to me like a Retreat, a going away from, and a long term one at that.
(Line 6: retiring after the work is done.)

My sympathies if you wanted otherwise.

Click to expand...

I am confused about this reading - I have done a number and had even been given cause for hope, yet this is devastating.

Dont be devastated,
Breathe.

When i focus on what someone else is doing i can sometimes get all worked up or distressed in some way.
(My mother's shocking behaviours for example)
when i focus on what i am doing i can find the right way/thing to be/do.

Please, is this a romantic relationship, financial, artistic, counseling?
Dont be ashamed to spill your guts because you have on other posts already.
And honesty is nothing to be ashamed of, in fact it is very admirable and courageous.

But if you'd rather not, i will respect that.

Moss Elk said:

Dont be devastated,
Breathe.

When i focus on what someone else is doing i can sometimes get all worked up or distressed in some way.
(My mother's shocking behaviours for example)
when i focus on what i am doing i can find the right way/thing to be/do.

Please, is this a romantic relationship, financial, artistic, counseling?
Dont be ashamed to spill your guts because you have on other posts already.
And honesty is nothing to be ashamed of, in fact it is very admirable and courageous.

But if you'd rather not, i will respect that.

Click to expand...

It's a therapist ---and a long tale, as all my tales are. Not 'tails' as in line 1 of 33 either! Anyway....I have just written her a letter, heartfelt, very sincere...and asked I-Ching what if I send, and got Hex 8. I will send.

Decisive action, good.

I just wanted to add that the lines of trust and communication you built with D
can be built with someone else.

Good luck.

Will D return to me?
33.1.6 > 49

D finds you overwhelming and had withdrawn to protect his/her self. There are changes you have wished to make. Why not begin them now?

pocossin said:

Will D return to me?
33.1.6 > 49

D finds you overwhelming and had withdrawn to protect his/her self. There are changes you have wished to make. Why not begin them now?

Click to expand...

Yes, that makes sense Pocossin. My letter to D. expresses that and I hope she will respond positively but getting 8 Union seems to me could go any which way and so I have to be prepared for that. I have had ect treatment in the past as well as all sorts of complicated mental health struggles.....and once before I had a very strong urge to rise above all this mire, and did for a while at any rate. It is now time to do so again. The will will find a way, or this time I am truly done for.

Moss Elk said:

Decisive action, good.

I just wanted to add that the lines of trust and communication you built with D
can be built with someone else.

Good luck.

Click to expand...

Yes, but I do not think I want any more therapists! I have had my fill! If D. will not resume work, then I feel that is it now.

Kind, Elk, thank you.

Well if D is a therapist/psychiatrist in the NHS this cannot possibly happen ;

D finds you overwhelming and had withdrawn to protect his/her self.

Click to expand...

People in this role can't really withdraw just because someone overwhelms them. it is their paid job so the decisions made will be on a professional basis, an assessment of the needs of the paitient and resources available, not on how they feel.

Lines 1 and 6 move so the situation passes through quite quickly and also when 1 and 6 change I see the relating hexagram as kind of 'busting through' the first. It is that hexagram that generally materialises throough the window frame of the primary. So in a situation of withdrawal (33) a revolution, a change happens, whereby either the thing seemingly completely disappears and returns in another form (49).

This could mean you restart with the same person butin a wholly different set up or way OR you do the whole thing an entirely different way ie another approach.


I think what is confusing, that isn't explicit in these threads for Americans, is this is not a private therapist who can choose to withdraw or not. This is someone appointed within our national health system....they can't just wake up one day and say "well I am not going to see her because she overwhelms me'.

Also wisewoman you seem to take it as his or her choice but it won't be entirely their choice will it ?

Yes, that makes sense Pocossin. My letter to D. expresses that and I hope she will respond positively but getting 8 Union seems to me could go any which way and so I have to be prepared for that. I have had ect treatment in the past as well as all sorts of complicated mental health struggles.....and once before I had a very strong urge to rise above all this mire, and did for a while at any rate. It is now time to do so again. The will will find a way, or this time I am truly done for.

Click to expand...

Well no you're not 'done for'. You aren't going to die and it's not going to be the end of the world. Sounds like you have mightily transferred/attached to the person so naturally you will feel your life is hanging on it...but it isn't. I think it's quite a good reading 33.1.6>49 there's a big change there..so if it resumes it may be on a different footing.

or are we talking simply about disengaging possibly temporarily?

I got 33.16> 49 RETREAT> RADICAL CHANGE

I would be very grateful for any interpretations on this.

Is there any ambiguity here, or lesser levels than absolute good bye....? Am I just kidding myself
in imagining there might still be scope for this connection?

Click to expand...

I think it may be only disengaging temporarily....I see the 49 as the 'outcome' here...but it's not definite as it could be you finding a whole new way in another way. Either way when lines 1 and 6 move situations tend to work themselves out fairly rapidly. The whole situation is done in one go, one episode.

trojan said:

Well if D is a therapist/psychiatrist in the NHS this cannot possibly happen ;





People in this role can't really withdraw just because someone overwhelms them. it is their paid job so the decisions made will be on a professional basis, an assessment of the needs of the paitient and resources available, not on how they feel.

Lines 1 and 6 move so the situation passes through quite quickly and also when 1 and 6 change I see the relating hexagram as kind of 'busting through' the first. It is that hexagram that generally materialises throough the window frame of the primary. So in a situation of withdrawal (33) a revolution, a change happens, whereby either the thing seemingly completely disappears and returns in another form (49).

This could mean you restart with the same person butin a wholly different set up or way OR you do the whole thing an entirely different way ie another approach.


I think what is confusing, that isn't explicit in these threads for Americans, is this is not a private therapist who can choose to withdraw or not. This is someone appointed within our national health system....they can't just wake up one day and say "well I am not going to see her because she overwhelms me'.

Also wisewoman you seem to take it as his or her choice but it won't be entirely their choice will it ?



Well no you're not 'done for'. You aren't going to die and it's not going to be the end of the world. Sounds like you have mightily transferred/attached to the person so naturally you will feel your life is hanging on it...but it isn't. I think it's quite a good reading 33.1.6>49 there's a big change there..so if it resumes it may be on a different footing.




I think it may be only disengaging temporarily....I see the 49 as the 'outcome' here...but it's not definite as it could be you finding a whole new way in another way. Either way when lines 1 and 6 move situations tend to work themselves out fairly rapidly. The whole situation is done in one go, one episode.

Click to expand...

Thanks Trojan.

Well the situation is rather complex but there is to be a meeting of relevant clinicians on Monday to discuss 'options'. but my sense (rightly or wrongly) is that more psychotherapy might be ruled out. The way this has happened is a bit strange, but I have had numerous contradictory 'assessments' for therapy over a life time which has resulted in long term supportive/relatively brief, to none at all being suitable. ~This particular one did two and half years with me, discharged to care of psychiatrist and cpn with a view to reviewing between 2-6 months & repeatedly expressed this sentiment following her discharge... After 6 months I enquired of psychiatrist about therapy review and was told no never, you're too vulnerable. ..followed by my endless questioning as to whose decision this was, and why no proper, formal re-evaluation by psychotherapist...and no meaningful answer to this question from anyone. Therapist not responding to advocate who has enquired for several weeks, and now executive involved.
hence meeting of clinicians on Monday - to which I am not invited, and once more planning over my head....?
That is the situation basically. All very complicated, mysterious and frustrating. Lots of cock ups and contradictions.

Well I do see 33.1.6>49 as a fairly quick resolution....this isn't going to drag on I don't think. Also I like the reading. Often in 49 things and people appear to disappear entirely only to reappear in a whole new 'skin', in a different way a little while later. 49 looks like a whole new appraisal of the situation...and in 49 it is a change that is needed so I think you should have some faith now even if things don't look good. You may well even end up better off than before this mess up.

Wow! I hope you are right Trojan! If so,

33.1.6. to 49 Relationship

出生时间：年　性别：女　起卦方式：直接指定
起卦时间：2014年03月12日12时06分
起卦农历：甲午年二月十二日午时
神煞：天乙—卯巳　福星—卯　日禄—亥　羊刃—子　驿马—申　桃花—卯　华盖—戌
干支：甲午年　丁卯月　壬午日　丙午时
旬空：辰巳　　戌亥　　申酉　　寅卯


六神　 伏神 　　　乾宫：天山遯　　　　　　　　　　坎宫：泽火革
　　　　　　　　　【本　卦】　　　　　　　　　　　【变　卦】
白虎　　　　　　　▅▅▅▅▅　父母壬戌土　　○→　▅▅　▅▅　父母丁未土　　
滕蛇　　　　　　　▅▅▅▅▅　兄弟壬申金　应　　　▅▅▅▅▅　兄弟丁酉金　　
勾陈　　　　　　　▅▅▅▅▅　官鬼壬午火　　　　　▅▅▅▅▅　子孙丁亥水　世
朱雀　　　　　　　▅▅▅▅▅　兄弟丙申金　　　　　▅▅▅▅▅　子孙己亥水　　
青龙　妻财甲寅木　▅▅　▅▅　官鬼丙午火　世　　　▅▅　▅▅　父母己丑土　　
玄武　子孙甲子水　▅▅　▅▅　父母丙辰土　　×→　▅▅▅▅▅　妻财己卯木　应

Relationship lines are 33.1 chen earth, 33.6 xu earth, 49.2 chou earth, 49.6 wei earth.

The complete picture is earth (grave yard) for the relationship. It set off vibrations and boundary for your question, but nothing is really happening.

33.6 becomes 49.6 means moving backwards in the relationship (xu earth to wei earth).

Xu earth is coupled to your house of marriage mao wood (day of reading), wie earth is coupled to your house of spouse wu fire. It tells me that you cannot let go of the relationship in your heart.

Line 33.1 means that D sets your free because the change line is female mao wood. This 49.1 can recouple to line 33.6 a pair. You cannot let go, but this is the change line.

Line 33.2 is you with D in mind as wu fire (ideal candidate). However, behind D there is a female yin wood line. He is not available to you.

49.3 and 49.4 are child line that couples to the hidden 33.2 line. This means either children are involved or assets are involved with the other female.

Line 33.5 is a person shen metal who conflicts with this female yin wood. Since this is the guest line, this is what bothers “D”.

Both 33.5 third party shen metal and 33.6 yao metal are the empty element under your house of spouse. This third party will not enter your house of spouse.

Line 49.6 produces line 49.5, this relationship is out of reach for you. Other parties are the main players.

Hexagram 49 means that it is time for a change. Hexagram 33 means retreat. When used combined, this means there is no chance for you with “D”.

49.1

Nine at the beginning means:
Wrapped in the hide of a yellow cow.

Changes ought to be undertaken only when there is nothing else to be done. Therefore at first the utmost restraint is necessary. One must becomes firm in one's mind, control oneself-yellow is the color of the means, and the cow is the symbol of docility-and refrain from doing anything for the time being,
because any premature offensive will bring evil results.

49.6
Six at the top means:
The superior man changes like a panther.
The inferior man molts in the face.
Starting brings misfortune.
To remain persevering brings good fortune.

After the large and fundamental problems are settled, certain minor reforms, and elaborations of these, are necessary. These detailed reforms may be likened to the equally distinct but relatively small marks of the panther's coat. As a consequence, a change also takes place among the inferior people. In
conformity with the new order, they likewise "molt." This molting, it is true, does not go very deep, but that is not to be expected. We must be satisfied with the attainable. If we should go too far and try to achieve too much, it would lead to unrest and misfortune. For the object of a great revolution is
the attainment of clarified, secure conditions ensuring a general stabilization on the basis of what is possible at the moment.

Both reading confirms the six line method analysis of this relationship.

Hexagram 4 9 = 10 of wands in Tarot
Quote
Interpretations
In upright position, Ten of Wands talks of too much to do. For a relationship this can either mean positive or negative. If there is good amount of love in the relationship then Ten of Wands signals that the two lovers are doing everything to keep each other happy. Now let’s see the negative side of this tarot card. Does your relationship come across as too much problem? If your answer is yes then Ten of Wands says that both you and your partner needs to work a little bit more to make things okay in the relationship.

For feelings, this tarot card says that your lover is thinking that he is doing everything to keep you happy, but you are not really appreciating it at all. So he is somewhat tired with you. In some cases, the appearance of this tarot card also signals that your lover feels that being in a relationship with you means he is stuck with responsibilities that he hates to fulfill.

Love: The appearance of the 10 usually signifies a hard place in a relationship. It can be that your beloved is undergoing a rough time that has nothing to do with your relationship but needs your support. Most often, however, it indicates that there is something in the relationship which needs to be examined, looked at, and considered. You will not gain by pretending that there are no problems. If you're in the market for love, do not despair. Your time will eventually come, but perhaps now is a good time to halt your search and just take some time for rest and reflection.

If related to relationships The Ten of Wands may suggest that you are taking the full responsibility for its continuing success. One partner makes all the effort while the other makes none. You could be working hard all day and then have to come home to housework, cooking and screaming children, while your partner sails in the door and puts their feet up. You are tired and frazzled with no time to yourself. In your relationship, things may be very different behind closed doors than they are in the open. You may be concealing problems, incidents or issues from friends and families. Your partner may also be hiding something from you. Then again, your partner may have upped and gone, leaving you holding the baby and having to go it alone.

There is a tendency also for one to take all the blame in a relationship should it fail. You could be guilty of being too busy with work or your business to have time for relationships, or to concentrate on the one you have. You may be very ambitious and chasing success at any cost, causing a lack of connection and intimacy in your relationship.

Your relationship may feel like hard work and effort rather than something you should be enjoying. As a couple you may be carrying several burdens and finding it all a bit of a struggle. There may be worries over money, work, family or health and certainly you have much to deal with at present. If you are both in this together then you should weather the storm and be confident that life will improve in the near future.

Unquote

Conclusion: Game over. Time to move on. It is time for a change, you cannot marry to D.
You will be wasting your youth in all this.

Long Yi this is a question about a psychiatrist/therapist in the National Health Service in the UK. In fact I have the idea the therapist is female.

You have assumed this is a man/woman romance ? Why ?

Line 33.2 is you with D in mind as wu fire (ideal candidate). However, behind D there is a female yin wood line. He is not available to you.

49.3 and 49.4 are child line that couples to the hidden 33.2 line. This means either children are involved or assets are involved with the other female.

Click to expand...

Have you read any of this thread ? It isn't about a marriage partner so this is not in any way applicable

well not unless ww is planning on marrying her psychiatrist

Conclusion: Game over. Time to move on. It is time for a change, you cannot marry to D.
You will be wasting your youth in all this.

Click to expand...

Read the thread.

trojan said:

Long Yi this is a question about a psychiatrist/therapist in the National Health Service in the UK. In fact I have the idea the therapist is female.

You have assumed this is a man/woman romance ? Why ?




Have you read any of this thread ? It isn't about a marriage partner so this is not in any way applicable

well not unless ww is planning on marrying her psychiatrist





Read the thread.

Click to expand...

To clarify, no, I have absolutely no intention of marrying my psychotherapist! All can say is that my feelings are intense and I am finding it almost impossible to let go. Feelings of abandonment have been overwhelming me. This happens to me repeatedly throughout my life, with therapists and relationships in general.

A NHS clinicians meeting is happening on Monday and I am expecting some kind of developments then...something of a crunch time maybe.

I am living in hope whilst preparing for death. Ugh.

I think whatever appears to happen next week you should retain some faith things are working out for the best. This is not a worrying reading but a reading that contains a transformation (49) at the heart of or within the framework of withdrawal (hex 33). There is no disaster indicated here.

The very nature of the reading is that things disappear to be transformed, they always do, they have to.

I see the reading this way...supposing it were about an old friend. The relationship was out of date, you were both holding to old patterns that weren't progressive and the relationship, your way of relating within the relationship needed a deep change. You could not say to your friend "let's change how we do this". It wouldn't work because you would be sitting there with exactly the same view of each other.

You know what needs to happen for real change to be allowed in ? You need to lower the curtain on this scene of the play so the backdrop and the scenery can be altered. The scenery is not usually altered in full view of everyone...so the audience 'withdraws' in order to allow the change and the change is shielded by a curtain. That is your reading.

You are in the audience going "OMG what is going on behind that curtain and what is it going to look like and will I be 'done for'?" Nope you won't be done for whatever happens. But none of us know what is happening behind those curtains whilst the scenery is being re arranged and we don't have much idea of what is coming next.

This is how I see 33.1.6>49. If it were a friendship whose patterns needed to change I think you would have to fall out of touch for a while....to allow the changes to happen.


If you get what you see as bad news I would suggest you bear in mind it is necessary for the transformation to happen. If you get what you see as good news also bear in mind all this trouble and time of concealment was needed for the transformation to happen. In fact 49 talks of how people won't believe in a change until it has happened.

Thank you Trojan. I am intending (trying, but need to actually DO, I know..) to disengage from all this worrying. Atm it is hard to think in terms of more expansive picture because it feels like I am 'out on my ear'...or something...& it all feels awfully like threat of abandonment..
I really must find out how to change my name on here. 'Wisewoman' was never appropriate but was a quick and easy name option to sign up with on Clarity... Quite daft.

You can just make a new account.

Hilary posted:
(remember, that's no problem at all provided you completely stop using the old username).

I think it is hard to change names properly. I want to be Trojina but I think I shall have a long wait. Apparently Hilary waits till a bunch of people want a name change then does it all together