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Blog post: More on hexagram 44

hilary

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Hexagram 44 is – famously – a tricky one.
‘Coupling, the woman is powerful.
Do not take this woman.’
That’s all it says – which is more than enough to give rise to all kinds of ideas. The traditional one is that the woman represents something malevolent, the seductress, power-grabbing – a distraction, a disruption,*to be resisted (like temptation) and excluded.
Margaret Pearson initiated a challenge to this (at least, as far as I know this idea started with her): the woman is powerful because she is a queen and gives birth to the heir. That she should not be ‘taken’ she should not be*seized; she is not for ordinary men to control. Stephen Karcher picked this idea up and ran with it: she is royal, she goes to the king, let her through.
The oracle, of course, says neither: neither that you should shut her out because she is evil, nor that you should let her pass*out of respect, but only that there’s a powerful woman and you shouldn’t marry her. (What I’ve translated ‘take the woman’, to leave both options open, is actually a quite ordinary expression for ‘marry the woman’, though the character also means ‘seize’.) The commentary (Tuanzhuan) is helpful here, adding that marriage with her could not last. That’s often the case: you can encounter, make contact, but it can’t last.
I try to steer between these two points of view and respect the essential neutrality of the oracle. There is something powerful. That something cannot be ‘married’ – that is, it cannot be brought into relationship or into your way of life or under your control *in the way you might think/want.
(A lot of the power and energy in the situation actually seems to come from a persistent desire to achieve the impossible*and make a ‘marriage’ work. Perhaps that’s 44’s ‘seductive’ power – the little voice that says, ‘If I just try this one more thing, if I just*extend myself and give of myself a bit more… and a little more, and a little*more…*then surely it has to work out.’)
Where to look for the powerful woman? Sometimes it’s part*of your own character – maybe something irrepressible and unmanageable about you. Sometimes it’s another person – maybe one who can’t be reasoned with or befriended, no matter how hard you try. Or simply an idea, one that doesn’t fit with your regular way of thinking and tends to*undermine it.
What will contact with this power do? Only one thing is sure: it will not ‘fit in': it will not support your plans or intentions. They will be undermined, disrupted, transformed or wrecked.*Is that a bad thing? It*depends on the value of your plans!**The ‘powerful woman’ can be a storm that wrecks your boat, but she can also be an oracle that disturbs your*rational*idea of how things work. Muse or Lorelei. The aftermath of the encounter with her might be pure wreckage, or a remade world – which may not feel like much compensation.
44fishprocessed.jpg
(What a wonderful new home for the fish!)

This doesn’t mean the storm is malevolent*(or the idea is wrong, or the part of your character is evil, or the person is actively seeking to harm you) – only that it has its own power and its own reasons, which are*not compatible with yours.
‘The woman is powerful. Don’t take the woman.’ You don’t need to know why not, or what her agenda is; you just need to*stop trying to marry her. (Perhaps this is not such a tricky hexagram after all.)
In readings, you would look to the moving lines to find what this storm-woman brings and how – or whether – it might be good to engage with her. I’m also getting the impression – so far this is just a provisional idea to try out in future readings – that the relating hexagram might embody*those plans and intentions of yours.
 
S

sooo

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Hexagram 44 is – famously – a tricky one.
She soitantly is.

Since odds are that males receive it as often as females, it logically does not (always) pertain to a literal woman, but more as a counterpart to a male archetypal figure, one of a few in the IC lineup. I think women, literal woman that is, take an unnecessary amount of heat on this one. Marrying is taking onboard someone or something that typically is not part of your natural being, more appropriately depicted as 54.

When I receive 44, I'm usually trying to force something. That force isn't necessarily a bad influence, just an insistent one. Not useful to become permanently attached to that influence, which may just be a cranky or stubborn mood, but sometimes "she" is just the influence needed to move me in a daring way, which I may ordinarily be too timid or insecure to do. Usually not a good way to become popular but a good way to get some risky things said and done.

I think too much is made of her as this seducing, haughty female. People don't make this fuss over 29, though he is a symbol of danger; not the kind of guy I'd approve of my daughter marrying, for sure; yet he is known for lessons learned through repetition and going out to the edge, also a daring and bold image. So why doesn't the Yi say not to marry him? A lot of gals are attracted to the bad boy image. Could there be some old time female discrimination going on here? Boys will be boys but girls can be sluts? I'm hardly a feminist, but I think females get a raw deal here, in 44.

29 and 44 riding off into the desert on a Harley is the stuff of romantic adventure movies. Doubtful their intent is to marry though.
 

hilary

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I think we just have to get used to the way marriage was when the book was written: she went to his house and became part of his household. So that's how the imagery works: if you're like the woman marrying it means one thing; if you're like the man marrying it means something else. And in divination it is so 'equal opportunity' with its genders that this can be quite funny. The last couple of times I've seen 44, the 'powerful woman' has been male, and I've needed to avoid marrying her/him/it. Makes me wonder if maybe gender was just less central to identity then. You can’t imagine creating an oracle now in which the user would be expected to go through such mental leaps - alpha male identifying with marrying maiden, for instance.
 
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sooo

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Yes, and it's hard to find comparative words today without being compared to new age or Jungian psychology. I'm of the school of thought which easily can make Jungian symbolism work here since I see Jung as drawing his analogies either directly from the IC, or at least being inspired by the male/female duality within each individual. It can as well be called yang and yin, unless one gets all wrapped up in the Zhouyi timeline correctness and such. It can also be called Soul (or spirit) and body, or mind and body - however one divides the nature of a person into opposites.

As your first sentence said, "the way marriage was when the book was written" - but, interpreted symbolically, metaphysically, psychologically: within the individual. Sure it can some also be very literally interpreted, but when there is no other but oneself the Book speaks to, where else can this duality exist but within ones own self? I'd bet the ranch that this is how the origin of the IC was intended. That's how it "reads our mind" and how our mind is intended to read it - 20.5,6.

It's frustrating trying to offer interpretations to querants who can not identify these various figures within themselves. And I believe learning should begin at the trigram level for that reason. Identifying the eight trigrams within our own nature. Without this essential preliminary understanding one might as well just buy a bag of fortune cookies.

Hexagram 44
Coupling, the woman is powerful.
Do not take this woman.’

This idea of mind/spirit leading and the physical body following is the order referred to. If the strong woman leads, the order is incorrect, I believe is the intended application. Do not marry this woman, this flesh, these passions within. It sounds so chauvinist, but not when this order is intended as our own, within ourselves. Know her, yes; befriend her, yes; sometimes be influenced by her, yes; just don't marry her. Let the Spirit lead, and marry 54, the one with her eyes on the long run.
 

rosada

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I think it's useful to consider that 1.1 leads to 44:

1.1 Hidden dragon. Do not act.

The image of 44 is of wind blowing about the heavens, a feeling of traveling, seeing everything, but not coming to a resting place.

Together the message seems to be that hex 1. action, creative intention, leads to an impossible wild goose chase, hex 44. (note the lines of 44 are all about trying to catch things in a net)

Another thought. As "woman" is frequently used as a symbol of receptivity as in the male being the initiator and the female being the responder, it suggests to me that the warning here is that one should be careful not to engage because there could be a response one didn't anticipate as in, "Be careful what you wish for, you're liable to get it."

rosada
 
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rosada

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Further thoughts:

The image for the hexagrams often tells what the appropriate action to take given the circumstances outlined in the judgement. In 44 the image describes a ruler spreading his words all over the land. Perhaps the advice here is to remember to keep moving, to not become too engaged and get stuck in one place when the times call for travel. Don't impregnate some native woman and be forced to stay in some far off land.
 

canislulu

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The image of 44 is of wind blowing about the heavens, a feeling of traveling, seeing everything, but not coming to a resting place. --- originally posted by Rosada

Yes.
and..

The lower trigram is wind. But it is also wood. And so the image of 44 is also of heaven taking root and gently penetrating through the soil.
 

canislulu

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Originally posted by sooo...
This idea of mind/spirit leading and the physical body following is the order referred to.

Yes.
This morning I was thinking of the 5th changing line of hexagram 44.
With that change in the outer trigram the yang center "softens" and becomes yin --- receptive to what can "tumble down from heaven."

I read somewhere in these forums that the 5th changing line was the line of action. Is that true for all hexagrams? In this case, i.e., hexagram 44, the text seems to indicate that the action comes from "heaven" rather than from the individual.

But what is "heaven" and how do we define it? Perhaps people use that same word with different meanings intended. When we turn things into language something is limited. "A picture is worth a thousand words." Which is one of the things I love about the I Ching. It is fundamentally (? originally) based in images rather than words. And also what I love about Hilary's first post initiating this thread. It has a wonderful fish image.
 
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sooo

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This morning I was thinking of the 5th changing line of hexagram 44.
With that change in the outer trigram the yang center "softens" and becomes yin --- receptive to what can "tumble down from heaven."

The Prince (spokesman for the King - 'in the beginning was the word') gives his commands to the four winds (wind being the strong woman); it is not the strong woman who gives those commands. But when the strength of the woman is demonstrated in line 5 as 'soft', she becomes an asset to heaven, a gateway, an enabler, as it were, for the fruit of heaven to fall, and she protected them. The finest and most powerful strength of the woman is her softness. Not to say she's a softy, but one might regard her soft spot as her heart?

A little related sidetrack here. I had a dream a couple of nights ago, wherein was a 'strong woman' who was a peer but later "had to" work under my management. In reality she was not at all happy about this change of our respective status. This decision, one might say, came down from above. When the time came for setting individual sales goals, she was stunned that I let her (and the other sales people) determine their own goals. She thought I was nuts, and did not hesitate to tell me so! I told her my reasoning was that she demanded more from herself than I would (being a strong woman). After setting her sales goal, I asked, what other goals would you like to have? Finally, she said she'd really like to take off for a couple hours each Wednesday afternoon to attend her son's baseball game. She was a workaholic, and as a result, she had a habit of starting fires just so she could put them out. It drove all the support staff crazy. Once it became part of her job performance to attend her son's ball game, her sales performance skyrocketed and she gradually relaxed and eased her tendency to start and put out fires and work weekends etc. But she remained a strong woman.

Back to the dream. I met her in some casual setting, and she was affectionate, soft and kind - kind of like line 5. For the first time, I became extremely attracted to her. Now, I doubt this woman became as I saw her in my dream. But what she represented was 44 in me, and this surprising softness caused my heart to open up and my affection to rain down upon her. Then I awoke.... damn it. I could not take the woman :mad:.
 

canislulu

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H 44.1.2.3.4.5 < 27

http://hiding.wimp.com/cat-hiding/?utm_source=facebook.com&utm_medium=social&utm_campaign=video/


Coming to Meet's Nourishment

While I feel nourished in a way by this forum, practical considerations in my life would indicate that it is time for me to attend to other things for a bit. And so I may disappear for a while if I am able to keep my resolve to study for my professional boards. (So far I have been unable to do so.)

Anyway, I thought butterfly spider's experience of H 44 as being connected to breast feeding deserved mention on this thread.

:bows:
 
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canislulu

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Inscription on the Plastron

One more thing... in case Pocossin doesn't chime in here...

And what about the H 44 as the "Inscription on the Plastron" ?

Do I understand correctly that the inscription will either say, "yes" or "no" regarding whether or not it is time for the King to enter his Temple?

Perhaps someone will quote what Wikiwing has to say about the Sequence of 44 to 45.

(My intention is for my Exploring Divination fast to start on June 1st. Somehow I have doubts about my resolve. What if Yi tells me it is not time to fast? Do I dare ask?)
 

rosada

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Dear Jumping Mouse,

Hex.44 is THE WORST hexagram to focus on if you're wanting to go on a divination fast.

Hex.44 threads are notorious for going on and on and on. Always one more comment. Always one more question, A living example of the wind blowing all about the four quarters of the earth and never coming to a resting place.

The hexagram is powerful! One should not align with such a hexagram! ;)

rosada
 
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canislulu

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Rosada,

Fortunately I have not received hexagram 44 as an answer to a query for quite some time now. In March or April a couple of years ago I received H 44.1 < 1. And I remember a prior experience of H 44.6 < 28.

This morning I was thinking of an experience I had that I think was a 44.3.5 < 64 time that turned into a 44.5 < 50 moment. But that was a few years before I had encountered Yi and I hadn't asked. So my understanding of the experiences is based on remembering what happened and then imagining which hexagram might have applied. I thought I could write about it on the current Shared Readings H 44.3.5 < 64 thread but there has already been wisdom posted there. I am not sure my experience would add much.

Yesterday some part of me resolved not to sign onto this website until I had done at least an hour of study for my exam. Then some other part of me thought, "just 5 minutes". Is this what happens to people who have substance addictions?

Anyway, yesterday I asked, "Advise for the remainder of the weekend?" And I received H 45.2.5 < 40.

So I guess I am in a time of 44:45 :eek: ... and hence my post about 44 -----> 45.

But I really didn't need to ask Yi what to do this weekend. I know what is undone and what needs to be done if I want to continue to afford organic produce from the farmer's market. :blush:

Thank you for your reminder not to align with 44,
:bows:
 
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Extremely interesting thread about this tricky hexagram.
Thank you Hilary, it is one of the missing hexagrams here : )

I got a 44 reading this morning (44.4.6>48). Long time since I got 44 and never with 4th and 6th lines before.

I'm surprised about how the lines are modulating the general 44 meaning.
Both 4th and 6th seem to warn against being too defensive or cautious about this attractive force involved in 44.
The 4th seems to say "don't be so unapproachable"
The 6th seems to say "protect yourself but be careful rejecting too hard" Maybe also advising against a bitter attitude?

I liked this interpretation of the 4th line:
"When one is too unapproachable one makes the arrival of creativity in life impossible. It is not for nothing that the artist seeks the seamy side of life. Too much distance causes sterility. Give everything in life a chance to be met, just examine it's value. Often a mixture of mutually incompatible things brings about creativity."

looks like it shows 44 as an uncontrollable force that will unleash creativity (maybe that's one of the meanings of the "wild intercourse" or coupling suggested by 44)

.
 
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hilary

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I should update my 'hexagrams' page, shouldn't I? ;)

About 44.4.6 to 48 - the last time I had that one, I felt quite strongly warned off trying to reach a potential (48) that wasn't really there. I was doing lots of industrious well-digging, but in the wrong place.

Line 4 - no fish in the trap, which could mean you're not available/approachable for other people, but can certainly mean that the connection you're looking for from others is not available. A fish in the trap would be a good omen for marriage and - obviously - fertility. No fish, nothing doing; go fishing somewhere else.

Line 6 - coupling/ encountering with your horns - that always seems to me like trying to make the best of a bad job. OK, so I can't marry this influence, but maybe I can still get to grips with it like this. It's clumsy and awkward, but probably the best I can do. But I see what you mean - normally 'coming to meet with the horns' would suggest warding something off.
 
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thanks for your interpretation Hilary

It is surprising to me the contrast between the main character or direction of this hexagram and those two lines (4 and 6) which seem like inhibiting the main point of 44... as if the occasion of taking or rejecting that strong and imposing energy (the "strong woman approaching") is not even reached...

or I may be missing something of course
 

hilary

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I think it's a safe bet that we are all missing something, not least with this hexagram! My feeling is that the hexagram's whole big question is, 'What are you going to do with this powerful woman?' (or energy or desire... etc...)
 
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in my experience (and ignorance : ) I get 44 when I tend towards something/someone that will put in danger my integrity, balance, emotional independence.
No matter if it's the thing/person or the fact that I tend to it which is potentially dangerous to me.
 

hilary

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Mm. Brad, if you felt like elaborating at all...?
 

charly

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Hi, Jumpingmouse:

I wonder if it is the DOG that gives its name to H.44 in the Mawangdui manuscript.

Don't tell me that it's a SHE. Where is the father?

Hildaterryteena.jpg


(to be continued)

Yours,

Charly
 

charly

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Jumpingmouse and Topal:

Only one line of H.44 uses the word LUCKY or auspicious depending from one condition: 44.1, that says:


繫于金柅貞吉
xi4 yu2 jin1 ni3 zhen1 ji2
TIED TO GOLDEN STOP OMEN LUCKY. (1)
Tied to a golden rule, previsibly lucky.
Following the law of nature will be fortunate.

有攸往見凶
you3 you1 wang3 jian4 xiong1
HAVING FAR TO GO OMEN HORRIBLE!
If having to go far (from the rule or from home), there will be misfortune

羸豕孚蹢躅。
lei2 shi3 fu2 zhi2 zhu2
LEAN SWINE CAUGHT SH! SH!... (2)
The captive thin pig, don't we speak about...


The character , here translated STOP, has many meanings, but all converge at one clear sense: a line of behavior, a rule, a limit but following on's own nature. Celebration of life and wisdom, not mere exhibition of force.

In a fanciful etymology , ni3, has three components:

  • At the left a TREE, life but also stiffness (limit, restraining).
  • At the center posterior look of a human body, buttocks, childbirth position(?).
  • At the right a spoon, a dagger or a sitting person, maybe a baby, the heir (?).

Maybe the mother of the heir carrying out her destiny.

And procaiming it to the four winds, as said in the great image.

I believe that the , gou4, was a female ruler, a QUEEN, a PRINCESS, an ANCESTRESS, that the radical WOMAN was drop at the left of HOU, ruler, because the word HOU, used in the great image, was gender neutral.

Time passed, and the word , gou4, became disreputable because of the yangization process of the imperial ideology.

If you don't trust me, see Lise (3) or Harmen.

All the best,


Charly
___________________________________________
(1) SIZE=4]柅[/SIZE], ni3:
  • A hard wooden tree with a fruit like a pear /
  • To stop / A chock for stopping a carriage /
  • Flourishing / luxuriant / fruitful /
  • A kind of festival / To investigate /
Source: CJKV-English Dictionary

2) The tinny pig is of course a metaphor, maybe a phallic one. I stands out of both positive and negative conditions. Maybe somebody beyond good and evil. But that's another story.

3) See the thread of Heylise (LISE) The Melons of 44.5
http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?4443-The-melons-of-44-5

Img249225043.jpg


Ch.
 
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peter2610

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A somewhat confusing array of outcomes can and do spring from 44 but nearly all these outcomes originate in the same underlying process - doubt and uncertainty in one's path and direction.
1st yin: A situation that appears harmless and innocent will develop into one of danger and misfortune if provoked - if your doubt and uncertainty lead you to interfere. The line resultant, Hex 1 Ch'ien, is urging you to have sufficient strength to resist your emerging doubt.

2nd yang: Fish in the tank: A situation containing negative or inferior qualities should be contained and not revealed to anyone not directly involved (the guests). The line resultant (bian zhan) Hex 33, Tun, emphasises the need to withdraw from any feelings that you need to intervene.

3rd yang: You are doubting your path and direction (often given previously by the Yi Jing). Your doubt is leading you to added difficulty and a refusal to accept the Yi Jing's counsel, resulting in periods of self-conflict (Hex 6)

4th yang: No fish in the tank. Misfortune: The inferior element (in yourself or others) that you were advised to contain in the tank in line 2 has escaped confinement and will now lead to misfortune. You are advised to take a gentle, non-assertive approach (Line Resultant Hex 57, Sun) to those who now reject you.

5th yang: A melon covered with willow leaves ... The will does not give up what has been ordained.
Here, at last, we have the fulfilment of the difficult process in which you have been involved. In overcoming doubt, uncertainty, conflict and fear you have enabled the ongoing hidden process to fulfil and fully reveal itself. In Taoist teaching the line resultant, Hex 50, The Caldron. fire above wood, represents the refinement of understanding that occurs at this point, the stabilisation of one's position and standpoint. Having overcome the many negative aspects presented by this hexagram and witnessed the culmination of one's faith and conviction one can now reflect on the stability and insight this has brought.

Top yang: He comes to meet with his horns. (Line resultant - Hex 28, Great Excess)
Here one applies the yang process to an excessive degree - abandoning the careful blending of yin and yang that ensures success one here creates his own downfall.
 

charly

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A somewhat confusing array of outcomes can and do spring from 44 but nearly all these outcomes originate in the same underlying process - doubt and uncertainty in one's path and direction...
Hi, Peter:

I would say even more: DOUBT AND UNCERTAINTY ABOUT MALE STRENGHT which leads to abhor female strenght.

H.44: Commentary on the Judgments
Gou [Encounter] means "to meet"; here the soft and weak meets the hard and strong. {When we apply Encounter to humankind, it refers to a woman meeting men. Here there is but one woman, yet she meets five men, which signifies utmost strength; thus one must not marry her.} "It would not do to marry this woman," for one could not stay with her long

Richard John Lynn: The Classic of Changes. A New Translation of the I Ching as Interpreted by Wang Bi

Of course, H.44 is not the only hexagram with five entire (male) lines and only one broken (female). But being the female line at the base, when all the five male lines will have dissapeared, the female line will be at the summit.(1)

Say, only one woman is here stronger thant five men. Paraphrasing the Brave Little Tailor: FIVE AT ONE BLOW !!!

Facing such a troubling image, commentarits said: IT CANNOT LAST TOO MUCH!. Polygamists cannot accept even the idea of polyandry. They cannot even imagine a woman favouring five men, if not being a prostitute. But it exists and it lasts.

wife19n-1-web.jpg


Rajo Verma has five husbands who are all brothers – and she sleeps with a different one every night...

Source: Daily News
Link: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/world/northern-india-woman-marries-brothers-article-1.1291875

Here we see five men going after the wife and the heir.
Said in the Changes: AFTER A HUSBAND, HORRIBLE!

Of course, I believe that H.44 is not about polyandry but about the possibility, at least for some women, to rule by her own right, to be a QUEEN or a PRINCESS not by marrying a king. Much time passed between first Zhou kings and the begining of Empire and that possibility became not well seen.

Sexuality remained at the base of H.44 mataphor, but that´s another story.

All the best,


Charly
_______________________________________
P.D.:
1) It is implicit in many commentaries that there is a movement from the base to the summit, something like that the base line goes pulling the upper forcing each one to jump out after reaching the higher position. It's the movement of the Combinatory Wheel or De Bruijn Sequence described here:

http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?10608-The-Changes-and-the-Bruijn-sequence

Ch.
 
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peter2610

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Thank you Charly for a very interesting reply. I think it is the gender interplay in Hex 44 that leads to such a plethora of possible outcomes. We have positive and negative yin qualities meeting positive and negative yang qualities but I don't believe the situation is calling for a supreme alpha male or supreme alpha female - rather it calls for a blending of yin and yang qualities that will produce the correct response in each situation. The various lines don't necessarily call for an overwhelming, overpowering sweeping victory but rather for a very accurate assessment of the forces involved and the most appropriate response. This calls for an equal distribution of yin and yang.

I have rarely met an external situation that closely resembled the setting of Hex 44 but I have frequently come across situations in which my positive resolve and determination were undermined by the encroachment of growing doubt and uncertainty, forcing me to carefully rebuild my position. The victory to be gained here is available to male or female and consists of remaining consistent and resilient in the face of repeated challenges upon one's resolve.
 

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