TRICK QUESTION

claire · Jun 18, 2003

Hello,
I have a virtual relationship with a man and asked the IChing if I am the only one he has, at least virtually.
I know this kind of question is a trick one but I can only count on the IChing and the good will of people who will feel able to help me on this.

The answer I got is:
Hexagram 56 - changing line 3
Hexagram 35

What do you have to tell me about this? Can I trust this man as I have always had?

Thank you.

tashiiij · Jun 19, 2003

wow i have received this same configuration regarding a critical situation. I was flumoxxed!

On one hand, one has lost all, and then the next hexagram is about promotion!

Could it be about burning bridges in order to make progress?

It seems to be a complex answer.

It will be good to see other responces....

lenardthefast · Jun 19, 2003

Hi Claire,

Is it possible that you made a mistake when you were constructing the hexagram? I am asking this question because, to my mind at least, there seems to be so little relevance between your question and the resulting primary hexagram,its' changing line AND the secondary hexagram. If I had received this answer regarding the question you asked, I would be inclined to ask the same question a second time.

Sorry to be of so little help, but, this is a perplexing situation. Hopefully, some of the other members will have another perspective to share.

Good luck and best wishes!

Namaste,
Leonard

tashiiij · Jun 19, 2003

hmmmm. been thinking about it for a while...and, this is just an intuition, but i wonder if the hexagram indicates that you should protect yourself......

best wishes.

tashiiij

gene · Jun 19, 2003

Hi Claire

I didn't respond to this at first because I thought the question was a little confusing. I think we need to take a look at a couple things. First, you asked if you were the only one at least virtually. Let's consider this question. The first step of analysis is, why at least virtually? If he is not faithful or loyal to you, then he isn't whether virtual or otherwise. It is an/either or situation. And the question boils down to, does he care enough about me to stay aloof from others?

The answer in this is a little tricky. (Kind of like you said, tricky). First off, it needs to be determined if you really do have enough of an involvement to expect him to be faithful. If not, then the I Ching is likely telling you, back off, the line is a little gruff, and overbearing, which causes his misfortune. But let's say you can rightfully expect this man to be faithful. Then we have a problem. The changing line is line 3. The commentary doesn't help us a lot, but this is in the hexagram of "The Wanderer." Now, what do we say of a man who is not faithful? He wanders. In the hexagram, line 3 is yang. The third line is by nature, yang. And here the line is yang so it is correct. Now, by the law of correspondence, the third line should correspond with the sixth. But the sixth line is incorrect because it is a yang line, so the third line and sixth line do not connect. By the law of correspondence, the secondary relationship is the third line with the fourth. But the fourth is yang also, therefore incorrect. So the third line cannot find a mate in the fourth line. So what does he do? He wanders. He can try the fifth line, because the fifth line is yin, but by the law of correspondence he is not related to the fifth line. So he might try the second, or the first. But none of these lines are his proper mate. Therefore, as a wanderer, he is removed from his proper mate. As such he looks elsewhere.

This is the way I see this in terms of the question being asked. However, as I said, there may be more to this than I am aware of. You will have to decide whether it makes sense to you.

Gene

martin · Jun 19, 2003

Hello Claire,

I'm not too sure about this (I would need to know more about the circumstances) but my first impression is that the oracle asks you a question in return:
Is it essential for you that you are the only one? Can you also have a good relationship with him if you are not the only one?
After all, a traveller (hex 56) meets many people ...

Hope this helps,

Martin

candid · Jun 19, 2003

An online domain (or relationship) isn?t a permanent abiding place, but if one knows how to adapt themselves and remain in the company of good people, they may find a trustworthy companion. If, however, one demands things from another online, which are not suitable for online relationships, one looses their resting place and strays from their own inner home, and from real life.

The best way to make progress in an online relationship is to brighten your virtue and remain in touch with attainable achievements. The time of Progress lends the tools (arrows) to accomplish something if you clarify the relationship and its limitations. Clarity can be difficult to maintain if you are ill prepared or expect more than the other person has to give.

cal val · Jun 23, 2003

Hi Claire...

You asked about the man's relationship(s), and the Yi told you. He's a travelling stranger in your life and in partnerships in general. And I do believe the nine in the third place is telling you he's a Lothario. Don't be surprised. There are many on the net. They feel protected by the anonymity of the net, and give little thought (as the wanderer who does not know how to behave properly) to their impact on others' lives.

Cheerio the noo,

Val

cal val · Jun 23, 2003

Tashjii...

35 is about progress in a partnership..."an elightened ruler and an obedient servant"...a creative artist and a savvy businessman...a husband who thinks of grand plans and a wife who executes them. It's about progress in a partnership where each other's strengths and weaknesses complement. "This is the condition on which great progress depends."

Claire's internet friend travels...wanders through partnerships.

tashiiij · Jun 23, 2003

Val,

Thanks for that! Hmmmmm......very illuminating. Your insight into the partnership aspect of 35 is really changing the stalemate i had reached (about the critical situation i had thrown the change for....)

Maybe needs a bit of re-thinking.

Thanks again.

claire · Jun 25, 2003

Well I am now sure he is loyal to me in our virtual relationship because I got material proof but I wonder why the IChing showed something quite different from reality. Is it possible that my stormy state of mind when I asked the oracle affected the answer? If I assume the Val's insight, is it possible that if he 'wanders' he found something in this relationship and had finally committed himself or made any good and serious change inside???

Anyway, I asked about the relationship future or potential and the answer is:
hexagram 14 - changing lines 3, 4 and 6
hexagram 193

Any insight?

gene · Jun 25, 2003

Claire

If you've got some method of getting material proof of someone's faithfulness on the internet. I suggest you sell that secret. You'll make a fortune. I am sure there are ten million men and women out there that would like to know how to do that. Well, good luck in your ongoing relationship.

Gene

claire · Jun 25, 2003

Gene, I got material proof because of a friend that is there on the same country that my lover is. I will not make a fortune for sure, I guarantee. The faithful issue is closed and I feel lucky for it.
Although it was a private thing I thought you all would feel glad to hear about the outcome.
I am here to share my experiences with you all while I look for some help of the IChing and all the experts who are willing to share their insights to me.
If any one of you have something to say about the last question I asked to the Oracle, I would be extremelly grateful and happy for that.

God bless.

gene · Jun 25, 2003

Claire

I think we are all glad to hear the outcome. This is one I didn't really want to get involved with at first, there are several ways to read the I Ching, and as I said, you are closer to it than I am. I do want to say though, I fail to see how knowing someone who lives in the same country, the same state, the same city or right next door constitutes any proof of any kind. In your case, perhaps it does. But to me that kind of proof wouldn't mean a thing. I'm just hoping you don't delude yourself. And maybe your not. I wish you the best.

Gene

s_dandy · Jun 26, 2003

Hellooo Claire and everybody at Clarity,

Hmm, as far as what I receive from the new casting 14 talks of favorable proceedings as long as you do not allow for any changes in your attitude towards things. It starts off like the guy probably has various associations (56), but as you seek to gain a sole place at his side the proper opportunity brings itself about (35) for you to express your need to be the only one. With that done, there seems to be the possibility that he?ll try to be the man you?d want him to be, cutting down on other attention distractions and focusing more on you. Possible happiness for some time (19), but eventually if being a wanderer is his true nature then he may have to tend to his calling, maybe not in the intense sense, but as one who needs to tend to those that were forgotten, ?I wonder how so and so is doing?? ; Or ?There can?t be any harm in wishing a happy birthday.? it may seem innocent enough, but once started it probably wont stop. Your reaction to this determines the outcome, being true to yourself works both ways as you can see; if you stick to your guns, I can see him using the innocence (If his nature is to wander and burn; how is he wrong?) of the situation to protect the relationships (minor or major) he has with whoever. If things get too volatile there could be a chance he could ?turn and burn? in response to your demands. And of course if you give in to his playground your head may spin like a merry-go-round; now, will that make you happy?

All that goes with the idea that his desire to wander is stronger than his desire to be true in a relationship, I think that difference is for you to gauge. I just went into both of the readings you got and received my explanation, right now I can?t elaborate on sequences or line relations, but I hope this helps.

-Here?s to Intuition and a whole lotta guesswork-

claire · Jun 28, 2003

Thanks for all your insights.
You are all great and I truly understand all points of view, specially because people have inner natures and we are in different parts of the world.
Anyway, I love him and want to make it better and better and I feel there is really a true receptivity on his part for it. Since we started our love he is showing real and good beneficial changes on his side and we have been adjusting pretty well.
Although people has their own essence, I feel he is really and truly connected to me in many ways and honestly I am not deluding myself. It is hard though to not ask and think because of the distance so I am always trying to understand things better and the IChing and you all have helped me a lot.
Long distance relationships are hard to deal with so my search of insights and tips to help me to make this a real good one.
I dont really feel by any moment that I am a past-time, but in order to get some more info from the IChing, and because you all were so obvious about it and I really respect your insights and expertise, I decided to ask the IChing if I am just a past-time for him to see what the oracle and you all can tell about it, like if one reading can complement the other, you know?
The answer I got is Hexagram 61, no changing lines.
Any insights?
Love,
Claire.

cal val · Jun 28, 2003

Hello again Claire...

The title of Hexagram 61 pretty much says it all...INNER TRUTH. That "I am just a past-time for him" is the inner truth.

It also says, in so many words, that our outer self, our conscious self, often times has great difficulty accepting what our inner self, our unconscious self, knows to be true. That happens for all of us...to one degree or another...about one thing or another. When we discover this ourselves, or are shown by the Yi, we are provided with an opportunity for self-discovery, and self-discovery is the way to true joy and peace. The Yi has provided you with an opportunity for self-discovery.

If you think about it for a minute you will realize that virtually everything in existence is transitory...just passing through...not permanent, but temporary.

Stars burn out over time. River rocks become pebbles as water and time wear them down. Mountains become hills. One of my favorite transitions is that of hot lava...it's heat burns and destroys everything in its path. Once it has interacted with air and water and become cool as the earth's surface, and then with plant life that breaks it down, it becomes rich nourishing soil.

Life itself is transitory. We are born. We live briefly. We die. The people in our lives are, in reality, just passing through. Some soon move on to other people and places, some move on later, and some pass out of our lives through death.

And while they are in our lives, they are continually growing and changing, so that our relationships with them are continually growing and changing...always transiting.

Changes in relationships and loss through those changes are inevitable...and so is the pain that we all feel about loss. We may not like it, but we have to accept it. It's part of life and must be experienced to experience life to its fullest.

So, as S Dandy explained in his response to you, how we handle the transitory nature of life, how we feel ourselves and our capacity to love and be loved...are the important considerations here. Relationships with others, whether they are our children, our elders, our friends, our lovers, provide us with many opportunities to feel joy and to love and be loved.

You have at least three options here, Claire...more if you really sit down and imagine them. One is to stay in the here-and-now in your relationship with this man. Enjoy each moment of joy and loving and being loved the present time brings you without thought to the loss and pain that are inevitable somewhere out there in future time.

Another option would be to end the relationship now while the pain is still small compared to what it will be if you allow your love to grow.

And another would be to focus your thoughts on aspects of his life that do not impact yours or on the pain of loss that is inevitable somewhere out there in future time and live in fear of that pain, thereby missing the opportunities for joy in present time.

The choice is yours. No doubt you'll make the "right" one...for yourself.

Cheerio the noo,

Val

claire · Jun 29, 2003

Thanks for your insight, it is really interesting.
But if I have to believe in predictions I prefer to believe in what the Oracle tells me so I asked what is the future of this relationship and got
Hexagram 38, changing line 4th.

Any insights about the IChing's prediction?

hilary · Jun 30, 2003

Michael sent this to me by mistake - here's his post:

Hi there,

This may help - or not.

Michael.

Hex 38 (Relationships)

<FONT COLOR="ff6000">Relationships: In intimate relationships, there is opposition at this time. This too is a lesson. Remain calm and support your partner. Any influence that you can bring to bear must be small and gentle. In doing this the relationship will be stronger when this time has passed, as it must.

Line 4: SOMEONE ELSE LIKE YOU - TRUST BRINGS SUCCESS. You feel isolated, but you will find another person who is going through the same difficulties as you. Possibility even a subordinate. Join together quietly and you will feel less isolated and you will achieve a successful outcome together.</FONT>

However, Hex 38 line 4 leads to 41 'Decrease'.

This may suggest that the relationship has been based on ego needs - which is not a good place to be.

Hex 41 (Relationships)

<FONT COLOR="ff6000">Relationships: Your personal, and especially your intimate relationships, will also go through a period of Decrease. Passion and communication will die down. Your partner may find new interests. Don't allow jealousy to raise its ugly head. You may find new interests. If your partner shows any signs of anxiety at this, offer loving reassurance, but keep it low key, in accord with the times. Allow the relationship to settle into a simpler form. There is still much joy to be had at this level, and remember, the pendulum will swing back, and if you have acted in accordance with the advice given, there will be no need for remorse.</FONT>

claire · Jun 30, 2003

Ok, Michael!!!
Thank you so much!!!!
Claire.

frandoch · Jun 30, 2003

Hi Hilary,

My apologies for the error - this is my first time on your site.

Regards,

Michael (Frandoch)

kiya · Jun 30, 2003

Hello Michael

I was very impressed by the lucid interpretation of Claire's hexagram you posted. I'm not sure, but it looks as if it came from a book??? If so, would you be willing to provide the title and author?

If it's your own interpretation, you have a remarkable gift of clarity and you should write a book yourself!

K

claire · Jun 30, 2003

I agree that your are very much gifted, Michael!
Thanks again.
Claire.

frandoch · Jun 30, 2003

Hello Kiya,

Thank you for your comments - yes, it was from a book, as yet unpublished - which I wrote.

The reason why I wrote it is a long story, which I am prepared to share, if anyone is interested.

Michael.

hilary · Jun 30, 2003

More from Michael:

"Hello Kiya,

Thank you for your comments - yes, it was from a book, as yet unpublished - which I wrote.

The reason why I wrote it is a long story, which I am prepared to share, if anyone is interested.

Michael."

Yes please, I'm interested!

(By the way - I'm afraid you can't reply to email notifications from this board by email, it just doesn't work. You have to follow the link at the end of the message, and post! Not to worry, lots of people do it

)

kiya · Jun 30, 2003

Hello Michael

I'm interested, too. And I'll bet many others are, as well. (In the story AND the book, that is!)

K

Sparhawk · Jun 30, 2003

Me three Michael!

What you are doing is very creative.

Cheers,

Luis

heylise · Jun 30, 2003

And one more -LiSe

claire · Jun 30, 2003

I am interested too, Michael!
You have a very refreshing and exciting way to interpret the Oracle and I loved it.
Your answer is simple and straight, very much focused on what is being asked and not based on self beliefs.
I am interested in your book and in your story.
Please share it with us.
Claire.

claire · Jun 30, 2003

By the way, when you say
'Allow the relationship to settle into a simpler form. There is still much joy to be had at this level, and remember, the pendulum will swing back, and if you have acted in accordance with the advice given, there will be no need for remorse.',
are you saying that if I understand the ups and downs of any relationship, including mine, and keep the faith and patience, things will be ok and will be good or what exactly do you mean by your so interesting and kind words?

TRICK QUESTION

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(deceased)

candid

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Administrator

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One of those men your mother warned you about...

Supporter

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