Hello Friends,

I am new to this board and come with a question regarding a reading. Hoping you can help me interpret ?the truth?, as it is always evading me.

Brief background: I began dating a gentleman late last December. In April things came to a halt. He showed me more interest over the summer, then I asked him whether we were friends or something more in early September and his words were ?I don?t know, I haven?t decided yet myself, probably just friends for now, what do you think?? He then disappeared aside from weekly phonecalls.

I use the word ?Gentleman? not lightly because he was the first serious, straightforward man (as he seemed to me) that I have met in a long time. Our relationship has never been very clear, although it is clearer now than before (just friends). In addition to trying to heal a very broken heart, I am trying to understand what about this situation I did not see before. His friends and those who know me also do not understand his behavior. (It would be too long to list everything that happened so I?ll leave it at that). I thought he was scared of commitment or a relationship; now I think perhaps he is just a player. I don?t know if I should maintain friendship with him bc I honestly don?t know if his motives are or were sincere. I?m hoping to reveal that as well.

I asked the oracle ?what do I mean to him? and I got 17 Following, no changing lines, *twice*.
I understand that I myself now am following the situation, the course of events ? ie I?m not calling or pursuing him or a relationship with him, I?m taking what comes, and if he disappears, so be it. But I asked ?what do I mean to him?? How does this hexagram relate to how he would see me? What I am trying to reveal is very simple: is this man a very good con artist, or is he, was he truly looking for a serious relationship with someone and it just wasn?t with me? I want to know the truth, I thought I Ching could help.

I then posed the question ?What lies at the root of his behavior?? And I got 42 Increase (changing lines #1 and #5) to 23 Splitting apart (no changing lines). From this I surmise that it benefits him to pursue women, like me?to increase his circle of friends/acquaintances, to try to find a partner of some sort? but that inside he ends up splitting apart, and the relationship doesn?t go anywhere (as it did not with me). I can throw in that he has a very overbearing mother and is being pressured to find a wife. He says he has never had a long term relationship.

If anyone can help shed some light on what the oracle is telling me, that would be helpful. A week ago I had asked what this man is to me, and it told me that I am sincere, but I am being blocked/obstructed by him, and that I need to continue on the right path. I?ve taken that to mean stepping back. But I?m curious why all this happened.
Many thanks,
Elizabeth

When there are no change lines looking at the order of the hexagrams can give some insight. Consider that 15 suggests everything is going along smoothly. This can make you very happy, 16,Enthusiasm. But this very enthusiasm warns you've gotten a head of yourself, maybe moving ahead of the flow . So 17, Following, means getting back into the flow. In your relationship it sounds like you got ahead of yourself by asking your friend where this was all going rather than letting The Truth be self evident. 42-23 also seems to confirm that too much of an increase caused him to split. So it sounds like he is super sensitive to any Enthusiasm Increase, in relationships in general.

i think your decision to "step back" fits perfectly with 17!

Myhumbleopinion,
Rosada

Rosada, thank you. Unfortunately I fear he has split for good now. And I am wondering if there was anything (if there IS anything) i can do to bring him back. You are bang on, that he is super sensitive to any enthusiasm increase in general. The problem is, I can't undo the past... :-(.

I maintain that he isn't looking for a serious relationship and is incapable of meaningful relationships (which would mean he split to avoid seriousness, not splitting bc i was enthusiastic).

I just asked the oracle if he is capable of feeling love. Perhaps it is a strange question but I'm trying to learn more about him, the things that are not visible. It gave me:
24.1.5 and then 8 unchanging.

THis I dont understand. 24
"Return. Success.
Going out and coming in without error.
Friends come without blame.
To and Fro goes the way.
On the seventh day comes return.
It furthers one to have somewhere to go."

He is returning to himself? He has appeared and disappeared from my life several times but how does this relate to his capacity for love? It furthers him to have some"one" to go to? perhaps?


THe first line, "Return from a short distance.
No need for remorse.
Great good fortune." I cant equate this with the context of the question either...

8 speaks of union... Is this saying he is going thru a transformation or transition and afterwards (when he gets to 8) he will have a union with someone?

Hi Elizabeth:

17 is about adapting.

Here's a quote:
"When Adapting occurs in a static form, it implies, without question, that no growth or progress can take place until the demands of the time are met."

Can the demands be - knowing who you're dealing with and being appropriate to that.
So - you have a man who is right now - lukewarm and not committed to the relationship with you.

To continue with the quote...
"No situation can become favorable now until you are a part of it."

Perhaps that's about - he cannot sustain his relationship with you when he is apart from you and that he has difficulties with attachments and maintaining the bonding (for whatever reason).

To continue...
"The nature of the time suggests that you cannot rule a situation until you serve it. Do not struggle. Relax and adapt."
------------------
Elizabeth:

I agree with Rosada - step back.
When you're with someone who isn't reciprocating -love or in friendship then it's best to go with the flow and adapt/follow.

One of the things I'm suggesting - because it's a pitfall of mine also - is not to try to figure out what's going on with him. It doesn't matter.
It's about you and doing what's appropriate and best for you and learning from it.
The trying to figure it out seems like it's useful and getting you somewhere, but it really won't.

Hope that helps.
Rosalie

Elizabeth:

We crossed posts.

I would look at the question resulting in 24 as relating to you.
In my experience, Yi answers to what is going on with ourselves - no matter what the question really is!

Just superficially -
24 is about returning to yourself, perhaps this man is a pattern, another cycle of same old thing you've experienced before - men who you get excited about who aren't worthy of your devotion and 8 is about you holding on to yourself - holding together...


Just a thought.
Rosalie

Rosalie,

Wow, thank you. So i have to adapt to the situation - he isnt calling/asking me out -- and deal with it. Got it. It is very hard to not get caught up in what is going on with him and why. But I will try.

24 makes sense now -- I have lost quite a bit of faith in myself and my self-worth due to all this and i need to go inwards and regroup. I will try to do 8 and hold onto myself.

Our posts crossed again -- I just asked the oracle if I can hope for a future of love with this man. The oracle answered, although I know it generally will not speak of the future. IT gave me again part of myself back: 19 with line 1 changing, and then 7. I take from this that i desire to approach him, but i need to not act as if small contacts/hints from him indicate big commitments; (I desire approach but should not do it), and that perseverance in doing my own thing and not bugging him will bring good fortune; that more time is needed; and this is the time to set foundations and do work on myself. Inner work.

For 7, i understand i need inner reserves of strength and self discipline. I need to return to myself (like with 8).

Immense Immense thanks,
Elizabeth

Just for the record and those who may be studying these posts years from now, I'd like to revise what I said about 17. Although I said in this instance it can be seen as "slow down", or stepping back, as Rosalie pointed out it fundamentally means "adapting", as in, if your 16. Enthusiasm has somehow gotten you out of the flow you can now 17. Syncronize With The Flow by slowing down or speeding up, or whatever is required by conditions as they are now. Basically I think 17 encourages us to focus on what is working in our lives and from that perspective you'll then find a fresh viewpoint that allows you to see how you can 18. Work on what needs fixing..

15. Being one with Tao...

gives you..

16. A strong alighnment of energy...

which may give your personal desires more emphasis than the Time can accomodate so you,,

17. Adapt to the Time/situation as it is...

and as you find yourself once again back in sync with the flow...

18. All seeming mistakes are resolved or simply no longer exist.

elizabeth, although i just gave rosalie a lecture on another post about not therapizing the yi, i am now going to offer you some feedback that is based solely on my experience living in the world, and not based upon interpretation of yi at all. if you do not welcome such feedback, of course i encourage you to ignore what i offer:

why give him the power to define the relationship? what do you want? you are 50% and it's not up to him to decide how this develops. however, if you have been loosely dating him since december, and it's now 11 months later, i would say it's not really going anywhere. accept that and move on. do not wait for him. do not ponder his capacity for committment. do not ask yi to explain him to you. (yi can't tell you about others, anyway!) if he is giving mixed messages, he is not that interested. (read the book titled, "he's just not that into you") if he were ready, wiling and able, then you would know it because he would be there 100%. and you deserve no less than someone who is really excited about you and shows it. hanging out with a guy like this, in my opinion, isn't going to help you over a broken heart. it's only going to make you feel undesireable and unlovable, which isn't true. don't you deserve to be with someone crazy about you? settle for no less. cut ties with anyone who doesn't step up. if you have never experienced what it's like when someone is totally emotionally available and into you, then what i write might sound strange. but i gaurantee you it's possible to have that kind of relationship and you won't understand why you settled for anything less once you've had it.

now, going back to yi for a moment:
17 is about adapting to a situation. the situation is, he's not that into you. (for whatever reason, it doesn't matter why!!!) adapt by honoring yourself, your needs, your wants, your self-respect, and do not expect anything more from the situation other than what it is right at this moment. do not set yourself up for disappointment or feeling bad about you.

24 is all about you. it's about returning to your core, your inner sense of yourself. it's about being connected to YOU as your primary source for knowledge and information. (e.g. not conecting to others outside yourself for answers.) so, in your effort to create a union (8) you are being told by yi that it all starts with first having a relationship with yourself.

questions to yi about other people, in my opinion, only produce answers that are about the person asking the question.

Millie,

By all means, your non-Yi (and Yi) interpretation are both useful and appreciated. I have been looking for where I made mistakes in this process and worrying that, had I done something differently (not asked for clarification for example) if things would be better. It is extremely hard for me to accept something without understanding why it happened and what role i played. It's also hard not to blame myself. And finally, hard to get rid of this vicious sense of hope that he might "come round"...That i scared him off and he will come back in the future...

I asked the oracle a follow up question last night again. I thought -- in my "search" for union, what am I doing wrong? Maybe that is the question I should be asking myself. So i inquired "In my search for a mate, how am I sabatoging myself?" and i got 12-Standstill/Stagnation, twice, unchanging.

I would assume this means since I have been hung up on this guy, i haven't been open (heartwise, emotionally, mentally) to other men -- that i'm "stagnating". But I'm curious why it came up twice--does that portend more stagnation in the future? The first reply to my message notes that when you get a double hex unchanging to refer to the context, which would be hex 11 Peace, and 13, Fellowship with men. I assume it just means that you have to get out of stagnation in order to interact with other men (literally)?

elizabeth, i trust your intuition about the meaning of 12 unchanging. that is the point of yi afterall, to help us tune into our own selves. i would add, assuming that yi has given you a direct answer to your question (and i believe that is what yi does) that "what you are doing wrong" is that you are "doing nothing." you are in a stagnant place in terms of your search. and yes, it certainly sounds as though you are staying unavailable by being attached to someone unavailable.

the truth is, there is nothing you could do that would change the outcome with this guy. it's not you who is the problem here. he isn't that into you. the "reason" he isn't that into you has nothing to do with anything you've done or said. it's just the way it is. you might want to consider accepting that you have no control over who likes you and who doesn't. there is chemistry or there isn't. what creates that chemistry is complicated and nothing that any one person has the power to control. you do not have the power to change his interest. you only have the power to change what you find attractive. why do you find someone who isn't very interested in you attractive? my hunch is that you've never experienced the alternative. once you do, there will be no turning back. and you will experience this alternative as soon as you stop yearning for people who are unreachable.

if it's not working after a couple dates, MOVE ON.

hi Millie,
Thank you. The problem is, in spending time with this man on and off, I've developed feelings for him and I dont remember what it was like before I cared for him. I realize he isn't interested and isn't giving me what I need...but my feelings seem separate from that somehow. They haven't died out as they should have, despite the irreciprocity of the situation.

Throughout the time we went out, he was on a dating site. I assumed he was still "deciding" about me but I believe now that he simply doesnt want a girlfriend or commitment at this point; I believe he is into the chase and that his attention span maybe wears off or, once he knows the girl is interested, he himself stops chasing and loses interest. It is possible he is looking to court and conquer and then rinse repeat. I believe he wants to meet, date, and not have anything serious. I assume, but could be wrong.

The fact he has disappeared after I asked if we were friends or something more is also strange to me. If we were really friends, I'm not sure he would disappear. And it makes no sense why a person would do this. He realized he can't string me along any more, that i wanted yes or no? I can't think of what else it would be. My question scared him out of friendship even? I dont know.


As far as the stagnancy of my search, I too am on the site and have been trying to go "out" to meet new people. Nothing is happening. I have a singles event planned, I get together with girlfriends...but still, nothing. I am putting in effort and getting no return and not quite sure why. Is it only bc I'm "hung up mentally" on this man? I am not so sure, I should be getting some return on my efforts/attentions directed elsewhere. I realize too that we have to start by going thru the motions and then later it will kick in. I have been trying to "get over him" since early september (ugh) and dont know why it is taking me so long.

Again, I appreciate your post. I wish there was a magic potion for this sort of situation. A "move on" potion that worked instantly!

-Elizabeth

elizabeth, STOP!!! stop thinking about him. stop trying to figure him out. stop going into your head to make up ideas and stories about his inner life. it isn't worth it. the only magic potion you need is to STOP. and you can make the decision right here and now to stop. i would suggest that you do not have feelings for him at all, but only think you do because you want a relationshp so badly. you must look at him as a whole person. splitting him into two parts: the guy who isn't there for you, and they guy you have feelings for, isn't real. he is both of these people. when you put these two halfs together, i'm going to guess you'll see they don't add up and he isn't worth the time of day. HE WAS ON A DATING SITE WHILE YOU WERE DATING HIM? takcy. tacky. disrespectful. hurtful. how can you like a guy who treated you so badly? how can you want to be with someone who treats you so badly? what can possibly be attractive about this? i also suggest you read, "a general theory of love" and you will get your answer. somehow you learned "love" means being treated poorly. this is what you need to un-learn. you need a new definition of love. this will come through learning to love yourself.

Oy Millie, thank you...

Yes he was on the site...not daily but once every week or two--but we weren't exclusive so how could I say something about that? I had a right to date others at the time, as did he... I totally agree it is hurtful but, without an exclusive rel'ship what could i say?

I wonder who authored the "General Theory of Love"? I haven't heard of that book, although I do have the other one (He's just not that into you). I will hunt for GTL online/on Amazon.

You're right and I'm not hiding the fact that I want a relationship. Years ago i was happy in my singledom, but not any more. I want to share my life with someone and wanted that someone to be him, or the him that was into me at the very beginning.

I do need a new definition of love and more faith in myself but how to GET to that place... I dont know. Apologies incidentally to straying a bit from the Yi topic here in the last few posts.

I appreciate your supportive advice.
-Elizabeth