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1.4 and 49.1.3.5 > 16

redoleander

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I asked "What is right for me" and received 1.4

I love this line and receive it a lot. I think I have even received it in early question I asked related to my calling and purpose in life. I have found Bradford Hatcher's interpretation most useful although everything I've read has benefitted my understanding of this one I think. It's still pretty mysterious, by nature...

I asked "What facilitates 1.4" and received 49.1.3.5 > 16


This is kind of beautiful! It goes through the stages of clinging, considering change and waiting for the right moment, and then believing/being believed. 49 > 16 enthusiastically/riskily choosing radical change
 

Matali

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Hello,

What is right for you : what pleases your soul? What life are you made for? What is the job best suited to you, to your body, to your mind? Do you have a passion, a strong desire for a long time, or a new passion?
1.4: you hesitate to throw yourself into change, to take the plunge, but no blame for this hesitation! 49.1.3.5 – 16: Keep excited and prepare for transformation.
Line 3 also evokes hesitations... You will come back to the subject again and again before taking the plunge.
Lines 1 and 5 are ready for action when the time comes...
 

dfreed

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I asked "What facilitates 1.4" and received 49.1.3.5 > 16
What do you mean by 'what facilitates'? The definition of 'facilitate' I read says it's about "what makes an action or process easy or easier". Also there's the idea of 'facilitation' which can be similar to moderation or mediation. So, I don't understand how you are applying or using these words?

Are you taking about what brings about 1.4 (a precursor to it?), or how you might or can manifest 1.4, or something else?
 

marybluesky

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Hello,

1.4 shows a transition that takes a while, "dancing through the abyss", hence the resulting 9th hexagram. I like Bradford's take of it, too.

49.1.3.5> 16, too, shows the a transformation's steps: in first line it's too early, in the third the call for revolution is heard but you can't expect the change to come before the third call, while the fifth line indicates trust in the radical change even before the augury.

I find the two readings perfectly in line with each other.
 

my_key

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I asked "What facilitates 1.4" and received 49.1.3.5 > 16

This is kind of beautiful! It goes through the stages of clinging, considering change and waiting for the right moment, and then believing/being believed. 49 > 16 enthusiastically/riskily choosing radical change
I agree. This is a really cool consultation that resonates for me too. It is certainly paints a sensitive emotional picture of the stages of personal development that result from the playfulness of dancing around in the Primal Abyss. Stages that when embraced tend towards a situation where you are advancing without fault.
Huang calls Hex 49 'Abolishing the Old' and Hex 16 'Delight' both I think add another gleeful layer of prosaic beauty to the wonder of 1.4 that is being expressed in your consultation. 1.4 carries a charge of celebration I fancy.

49 meaning ' the grounds for grief and dissention are departing'
16 meaning 'the joyous response

Nuclear 44 which blows the deep winds of flexibility that need to meld with a fulsome back bone. This meeting of strength and flexibility will help you embrace the inherent challenge that is being offered in 1.4 i.e of accepting the new mandate and broadcasting to all the lands.

Thank you for posting.

Good Luck
 

redoleander

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Hello,

What is right for you : what pleases your soul? What life are you made for? What is the job best suited to you, to your body, to your mind? Do you have a passion, a strong desire for a long time, or a new passion?
1.4: you hesitate to throw yourself into change, to take the plunge, but no blame for this hesitation! 49.1.3.5 – 16: Keep excited and prepare for transformation.
Line 3 also evokes hesitations... You will come back to the subject again and again before taking the plunge.
Lines 1 and 5 are ready for action when the time comes...
Thank you for this! It’s really clear and helpful. The hesitation and seeking the right moment, testing the waters makes sense too. Not blaming is helpful. It’s hard for me how much hesitation I have. But when it’s time to leap, leap 💫
 
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redoleander

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What do you mean by 'what facilitates'? The definition of 'facilitate' I read says it's about "what makes an action or process easy or easier". Also there's the idea of 'facilitation' which can be similar to moderation or mediation. So, I don't understand how you are applying or using these words?

Are you taking about what brings about 1.4 (a precursor to it?), or how you might or can manifest 1.4, or something else?
Yes, I meant it in the sense of what makes 1.4 possible. Since 1.4 doesn’t really explain (to me, at least) how you go from the anxious 1.3 to dancing in the abyss. So, if it’s hard to leap into the abyss, what makes 1.4 possible. In some ways the answer might just say “you do it!” I’m not sure. So I was curious how others might read it.
 

redoleander

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Hello,

1.4 shows a transition that takes a while, "dancing through the abyss", hence the resulting 9th hexagram. I like Bradford's take of it, too.

49.1.3.5> 16, too, shows the a transformation's steps: in first line it's too early, in the third the call for revolution is heard but you can't expect the change to come before the third call, while the fifth line indicates trust in the radical change even before the augury.

I find the two readings perfectly in line with each other.
Thank you, marybluesky! You broke it down in a way that’s really helpful for me. It makes sense that it isn’t perpetually the right moment to leap into the abyss but that staying by sensitive to when that moment comes and then really choosing it/knowing it.
 
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redoleander

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I agree. This is a really cool consultation that resonates for me too. It is certainly paints a sensitive emotional picture of the stages of personal development that result from the playfulness of dancing around in the Primal Abyss. Stages that when embraced tend towards a situation where you are advancing without fault.
Huang calls Hex 49 'Abolishing the Old' and Hex 16 'Delight' both I think add another gleeful layer of prosaic beauty to the wonder of 1.4 that is being expressed in your consultation. 1.4 carries a charge of celebration I fancy.

49 meaning ' the grounds for grief and dissention are departing'
16 meaning 'the joyous response

Nuclear 44 which blows the deep winds of flexibility that need to meld with a fulsome back bone. This meeting of strength and flexibility will help you embrace the inherent challenge that is being offered in 1.4 i.e of accepting the new mandate and broadcasting to all the lands.

Thank you for posting.

Good Luck
Ah thank you for this! It’s beautiful. “Gleeful” really adds a feeling I actually wasn’t really associating. As much of an abyss leaper as I am and have had to be, I have a sensitive stomach 🤣 That drop into the abyss isn’t actually really done joyfully always. This helps me think about delighting in change and delighting in the fall, like someone having a great time skydiving or something. And maybe some of that glee is necessary for leaping in the first place. Otherwise why would you? Haha. Accepting the new mandate and broadcasting to all the lands is a much more inspiring sentiment than “oh no I’m being pushed off a cliff again”. Lots to think about. The nuclear 44 is interesting; I’ll really have to read and think more about that because some of the background of the situation does involve a very difficult relationship I’d been in, too, so maybe good for me to think on the connection. I need to use the nuclears more so I can understand them better!
 

redoleander

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Hm I wonder if 49.5 is also about being it. Like there’s a time to be stuck as you were, a time to consider and discuss, and then it’s time to actually embody it. Maybe full embodiment (or surrender might fit better) is 1.4
 

my_key

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Ah thank you for this! It’s beautiful. “Gleeful” really adds a feeling I actually wasn’t really associating. As much of an abyss leaper as I am and have had to be, I have a sensitive stomach 🤣 That drop into the abyss isn’t actually really done joyfully always. This helps me think about delighting in change and delighting in the fall, like someone having a great time skydiving or something. And maybe some of that glee is necessary for leaping in the first place. Otherwise why would you? Haha. Accepting the new mandate and broadcasting to all the lands is a much more inspiring sentiment than “oh no I’m being pushed off a cliff again”. Lots to think about. The nuclear 44 is interesting; I’ll really have to read and think more about that because some of the background of the situation does involve a very difficult relationship I’d been in, too, so maybe good for me to think on the connection. I need to use the nuclears more so I can understand them better!
The Abyss has had a lot of bad press over the years. It really isn't as bad as portrayed
The drop into the Abyss may not be joyfully done, if ever, but while you are there beas joyful in what is going on as you can. Some dances just have a different feel to them than others: every dance carries it's own beauty though.

The nuclear is, as Karcher says, where the hidden possibilities reside. And to get the 'goodie bag' you have to recognise, accept, face and meet the the challenge that is being offered to you in that dance.
 

redoleander

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The Abyss has had a lot of bad press over the years. It really isn't as bad as portrayed
The drop into the Abyss may not be joyfully done, if ever, but while you are there beas joyful in what is going on as you can. Some dances just have a different feel to them than others: every dance carries it's own beauty though.

The nuclear is, as Karcher says, where the hidden possibilities reside. And to get the 'goodie bag' you have to recognise, accept, face and meet the the challenge that is being offered to you in that dance.
"but while you are there be as joyful in what is going on as you can". this is very good advice

very cool info about the nuclear; I read a bunch of Karcher when I first started learning and a lot was over my head because I didn't have enough of a base so this is a nice little push to revisit. And oof 44 really is a complicated goodie bag eh. That feels very aligned with the reading actually, to me, not that I totally have my head around it but a lot of 44 seems to be accepting the gift and letting it go (that it stops being a gift when you don't let it go)... that might be overly simplistic; it does feel 'abyss' related though somehow.
 

dfreed

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I asked "What is right for me": 1.4 - and what makes this possible: 49.1.3.5 > 16

1.4 - some possibilities:

The dragon in Hexagram 1 may have had its 'roots' / origins in the Azure Dragon, an asterism, a group of stars from different constellations. One idea is that 'Qian' shows us the journey of the Dragon as it moves across the sky throughout the year.

Hex. 1.4 - "Now it springs up from the deep. No harm ... ": the ancient Chinese believed their world - the habitable world - was surround by water, and here the Azure Dragon is rising from these waters in springtime, the beginning of the new year.

Building on this - and playing a bit with the trigrams: I can see 'dragon-springs-up-from-the depths' as being about one's creative, inner world (lower trigram heaven) giving rise to a world of possibilities that you 'rise up' (or awaken?) to gently explore (Wind, hex. 9's upper trigram).

And similarly - in the Houtian Bagua (trigram) Circle: Heaven represents late fall, the pre-cursor to Winter; whereas 'Dragon-awakening-thunder-like-in-Spring' is the pre-cursor to Wind, late Spring: this is a time when Wind scatters seeds and pollen and the Dragons play in the heavens and drip their blood and sweat down to fertilize the plowed fields.

And what makes this possible? 49.1.3.5

49 is 'Molting' - it's springtime, and it's a time for lions and tigers, and bear (oh my!) and dogs, snakes, humans .... to shed their fur and skins, and winter coats. You are starting out in a safe, protected place (lower trigram Light), one that has served you, but it now feels like you are 'bound up with the hide of a yellow ox' (49.1) ....

You want to shed your skin so, so badly, as if you'd be willing to fight to do this - 'an attack will bring misfortune' (49.3), but there is a process here and patience is needed, since the 'change [will only be] complete after three ...."

And then step 3 ... 'the great one dons the tiger change' (49.5).

There is a progression (along with process):
>>> 49's lower trigram Flame gives rise to Earth (16's lower); and upper trigram Lake gives rise to Thunder:

Inwardly: starting at home, tending to the hearth - Flame,
>>>> allows you to care for others, and to be 'of this Earth' ....
>>>>>>>> Outwardly: flame and earth below give rise to
>>>>>>>>>>>> Joy - Lake, which gives rise to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Joyful Action - Thunder

Best, D
 
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redoleander

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@dfreed wow I especially love this information about the dragons and their habits/seasons. I'm looking forward to reading more about this. I have been playing a lot (in the context of western astrology) with the idea that autumn has much to do with Spring because it's immediately after most of the harvest and the way we prep for winter defines winter and what's cooking inside in that time, which then that inward winter time, in turn, defines what will actually blossom in the spring. So there's something precious in this time of autumn, deciding what to nurture through the winter so that spring brings the type of aliveness we want... I feel like a lot of what you shared makes me think about similar things and how to prepare for spring or what we want spring to mean and so forth
 

dfreed

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I have been playing a lot (in the context of western astrology) with the idea that autumn has much to do with Spring because it's immediately after most of the harvest ...

I have taken Harmen Mesker's Hexagrams / Trigrams course, and in it he covers the Houtian - or 'later heaven' Bagua (trigram) Circle.

I don't know if you're familiar with it, but it arranges the eight trigrams around a circle (like compass points) and each represents a season, and a time of day, a direction (i.e. west, southeasst ....), and each carries associated meanings and imagery - and I have added my own associations and stories / myths for each. Two in particular:

* Trigram Thunder - Spring - in the east, at the beginning of the day, and the beginning of the year: when thunder arises from the earth - a time of new beginnings.

* Trigram Lake - Fall - in the west, early evening; the time of the fall harvest, when people can start to relax and enjoy the bounties of their labor. And as the days grow shorter, people gather in the evenings and drink and eat, and sing and talk together - joy and communication being two of the associated meanings for trigram Dui, Lake.

Interestingly, maps in early China had south at the top, and this is true of the Houtian bagua circle: Thunder, East is at the left side of the circle; Lake, west is on the right, etc. Some of us whom are used to 'north-at-the-top' of maps, legends, and compasses might feel this is confusing, but the 'solution' is simple: just turn so you're facing south, and everything is as it should be!

Best, D
 
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