24.6 -› 27: Brexit, Ireland and the British Border

[EmMacha]

Here is a cast about the Brexit issue as it relates to the whole island of Ireland and the British Border (which will need huge financial, military and customs resources to be maintained).
I was also thinking about the sacred, mythical and archaeological landscapes in this Land, and in Scotland, Wales, and England, and the freedom for all to visit these ancient ancestral temples and sacred places .

I have not looked at news or media about this in a few days, but I have a sense that something crazy & shocking and deep is going to come up early next week, kiboshing what has already been discussed, and weakening Johnson & co even more

The cast: Hexagram 24.6 -- 24
(Using LiSe excellent online yarrow stalk casting tool. Thank you LiSe )

Primary hexagram: 24 Fù, Recover, turningpoint

Gua Poem:
Recovering - expansion. Going out and coming in without affliction. Friends come without fault. Going to and fro on one's road, a seven-day cycle. Fruitful to proceed probing.

The great image says: Thunder in the center of the earth: return. The first kings closed the frontiers at sun solstice, peddlers did not travel, the empress did not leave the region.

Fù: the ideogram and the story. What does it mean for your question?
This hexagram is complementary to hex.44. I changed the name, because 'return' sounds like going back. Fu is again, turn around, but also recover, answer, restore. Much more than going back.

Hopefully, this means that people will still be coming and going across the 'border', in peace, and we will still have many of Northern sisters, brothers and cousins living and visiting and sharing in community with us. It has been wonderful to meet so many people from the six counties, poets, musicians, artists, engineers, singers, doctors, carers, friends, helpers, healers, wise ones...

Of course, this is the issue, or question, free movement of people throughout the whole island, and both islands.
All the ordinary people, happy with peace, that is who I am thinking of here.

"... closed the frontiers at sun-solstice... the empress did not leave the region"

I wonder what this means?
Does it mean that the UK and the Crown will become protectionist, close borders? (Peddlers, ie traders).
Or that something will happen in midwinter, around the Winter Solstice?

The changing line:

Top 6: Losing the way at recovering, pitfall. There are calamities and mistakes. To set the army marching ends in a great defeat, causing the country ruler a pitfall. For 10 years incapable of a rectifying expedition.
One feels the right Way deep down inside, in one's bones. If there are other things overruling this primitive knowledge, even if they are rational, of common sense, or things people "approve" of, then the results of one's actions, even one's entire life, will be a big disaster.
(Changes to hex.27) Mirror

Ooooh - this seems to me like the resources for manning the border, sending the army or constabulary in is going to be a big problem for the crown!
And, also, mistakes that take '10 years' to rectify - the 'deal' being made for the border, backstop etc is going to be mired, and problematic?
Could this also show problems for the 'hard men' on both sides that everyone fears will come out and get aggressive with a military presence on the border again? That they too will face difficulties in mobilizing or 'organising'?
They don't have the same 'support'/ fear based domination of the ordinary people.

Relating hexagram: 27 Yí, jaws
Gua poem:
Jaws, determination auspicious. Contemplating the jaws is the origin of seeking real substance for the mouth.

The great image says: Thunder at the foot of the mountain: jaws. The noble one uses cautious language and limited food and drink.

Now this is interesting, the background issue here is food; those dairy or "londondairy" cows that have been moving freely back & forth across the border; milk, butter, all the other food crossing the border that will now have custom tariffs and taxes on it.

Cautious language and limited food and drink: Is this for the UK, with no more easy access to EU food, wine, fruit etc...???

 

[Trojina]

Is there any chance you'd give a brief summary of what Brexit means for Ireland in your opinion.

I should be clear living in the UK but I'm not. Also I'm not clear what the actual question is ?

24.6 generally indicates it is too late to try to make repair or that making repair will be far more trouble than it's worth. It's better to let something die than to try to prop it up, if you try to prop it up it's disastrous.

 

[Freedda]

Here is a cast about the Brexit issue as it relates to the whole island of Ireland and the British Border (which will need huge financial, military and customs resources to be maintained). I was also thinking about the sacred, mythical and archaeological landscapes in this Land, and in Scotland, Wales, and England, and the freedom for all to visit these ancient ancestral temples and sacred places.

Reading your multiple concerns here made me wonder what your actual query was? Was it a more general, 'tell me about brexit,' or something more specific?

Overall, 24.6 seems rather ominous, but is it a reflection of your own thoughts and feelings about the situation, or a failure to implement it, or it being a failure once it's implemented? I can't really say.

From what I know - which is very little - I think being able to freely visit sacred sites will not be endangered. I expect that what is more 'ominous' are the N. Ireland Unionists' fears and rage that they will no longer be part of England. Maybe that's what the Yi's answer is talking about?

From NY Times 24 Oct.

While unionist representatives said they were committed to a peaceful solution and would pursue political and legal means to frustrate any new Brexit arrangements, some expressed fears that the deal could result in tumult and a resurgence of violence. “Nobody wants to see violence, and nobody wants to go back to conflict,” Mr. Bryson said. “But people are being pushed into a corner ....

That feels very 24.6-ish to me.

D.

 

[EmMacha]

Hi Trojina 7 Freedda
The question was about the effect of Brexit and what is going to happen around the British border over the next few months for ordinary people.
I was asking Yi for images to describe the effects, how it's going to play out, or what might manifest.

I was thinking particularly about the border when I cast.
The issue about sacred sites, well, you know the way other things are in the back of your mind, and can just pop out of the imagery at the end? It was in the back of my mind.

As for what Brexit means for Ireland, well, there are so many levels to it, from politics, to economy, to culture and friendships, communities, etc

Apparently, a 7% drop in our economy (Ireland, 36 counties) is expected.

The anxieties over the Troubles beginning again are increasing, and there are already more police on the border on both sides, more 'agitation'. Mental Health and other Trauma services have experienced huge increases in people seeking help.

It had been wonderful to just drive up, cross the border, visit places and people for me, but also to meet people here who have come from the 6 counties. Peace has been wonderful for so many.

Culturally it has been very healing for all of us.

Personally, it is going to affect friends of mine, it's going to affect my country, my land.
There is a fear of innocent people dying, the Troubles again...
The hardliner unionists are pretty bad, but so are the 'hard men' on the other side...

I would like to think it that it means that anyone trying to 'solve' the issue through force of arms will be mired, tied up for years, unable to cause trouble.

27 as relating hexagram, well these are the issues involved, the free transport of good, products etc across the border. Much food, and cows have been freely moving, this will obviously be curtailed or cut back somewhat, as farmers in the 36 counties sell to other markets?

Yi, i think, is positioning the issue of my question, the border and what will happen to it, against the background of the wider agricultural import / export issue.

So I see, I read it as: return back to your own path, people will still freely move around, friends will still connect & visit. Officially, there will be a 'closing of the passes'.
There will be mistakes made in trying to return to *something* - perhaps May's original plans?
Sending armies, police etc in will be difficult, as will sending other kinds of armies, eurocrats, burocrats, legal armies? Big mistakes made, difficult to fix, for the governments?

 

[Trojina]

Hi Trojina 7 Freedda
The question was about the effect of Brexit and what is going to happen around the British border over the next few months for ordinary people.
I was asking Yi for images to describe the effects, how it's going to play out, or what might manifest.

The thing is it's not certain Brexit will even happen, there may be a second referendum. So if it isn't certain it's going to happen how can Yi describe what is going to happen around the british border ?

24.6 is a line of disaster except sometimes disaster can just mean you don't need to go chasing remedies as it is what it is. It's better to accept you missed the return than to run about trying ot make the return happen.

I have no idea what that would mean for Ireland. I guess if Brexit happens it's pretty tough on Ireland and it can't go back to where it was ? Terribly ignorant re Ireland sorry

 

[EmMacha]

The thing is it's not certain Brexit will even happen, there may be a second referendum. So if it isn't certain it's going to happen how can Yi describe what is going to happen around the british border ?

24.6 is a line of disaster except sometimes disaster can just mean you don't need to go chasing remedies as it is what it is. It's better to accept you missed the return than to run about trying ot make the return happen.

I have no idea what that would mean for Ireland. I guess if Brexit happens it's pretty tough on Ireland and it can't go back to where it was ? Terribly ignorant re Ireland sorry

Yes I understand that Brexit may not happen, it is certainly dragging out! I have received many hexagram 5 casts about it!

Perhaps Yi is also saying that it won't happen, because it is disastrous for the movement of cattle and food goods easily across the border?
Here are 2 articles that explain the trade issues simply, and might help with understanding how Im interpreting the cast:

Brexit Archives - Irish Farmers' Association

www.ifa.ie

FactCheck: Is 90% of Ireland's trade with the UK, as a former British trade minister claimed?

Digby Jones made the claim on Twitter at the weekend when discussing the impact of a no deal Brexit.

www.thejournal.ie

 

[Liselle]

there may be a second referendum

May I ask a question? (Not meant only for Trojina.)

Why do you think it is that the U.K. decides things like this via public referendum? In the U.S. we don't ever have votes on such matters. They'd be decided by Congress.

 

[Liselle]

Not saying we don't ever have public referendums, but I see them mostly for local issues within a municipality. Maybe state issues. I definitely don't know everything, so I don't want to get too detailed about it, but I've never heard of anything resembling a referendum on whether the U.S. should or shouldn't enter into this-or-that trade agreement, for instance, or join or leave the United Nations, or whatnot.

 

[Trojina]

May I ask a question? (Not meant only for Trojina.)

Why do you think it is that the U.K. decides things like this via public referendum? In the U.S. we don't ever have votes on such matters. They'd be decided by Congress.

I don't know I'm extremely ignorant on politics. But it is for the people to decide if they want to be in the EU or not. I don't know what the criteria are for a referendum. I don't know what 'congress' is that's how bad I am at politics.

There are big differences between UK and US political systems therefore there is no reason UK should be like US.




Problem is I learned to switch off any time politics was on TV or radio as a kid and unfortunately it's hard to get out of the habit. I think they should teach basic politics in school then we might know what we are doing. As it is most people follow their family's political orientation or no orientation. This is one good reason for a second referendum as in the first people didn't even know WTF they were effectively voting for and now many are dismayed and want to change their minds.


Anyway for the differences between UK and US political systems you have come to entirely the wrong person, you may have to Google. Here we are

 

[Freedda]

The thing is it's not certain Brexit will even happen, there may be a second referendum. So if it isn't certain it's going to happen how can Yi describe what is going to happen around the british border ?

I agree, which is why I said, in part:

'(maybe) ... it's a reflection of your own thoughts and feelings about the situation ...?'

I don't usually - hardly ever - think of the Yi as a means of prognostication (the action of foretelling or prophesying future events) but many people do. I'd guess that this reading is likely describing the current situation of uncertainty and people's concerns and fears, and that it's less about an eventual outcome. Or, maybe it's about how Em Macha might preceive it, or maybe something they might glean/learn from what's happening?

Or maybe ....?

Best, D.

 

[Liselle]

I don't know
[...]
Anyway for the differences between UK and US political systems you have come to entirely the wrong person, you may have to Google. Here we are

Thanks for the link. It turns out Brexit was only the third time this has been done, which I didn't know.

Congress is like your Parliament.

 

[Liselle]

Oh, about 24.6, I think sometimes it could be seen as just saying someone or something is confused or deluded, and then what happens if you use confusion/delusion as a basis for proceeding (a.k.a. as nourishment, zhi gua 27?):

'Confused return, pitfall. There is calamity and blunder.
Using this to mobilise the armies: in the end there is great defeat.
For your state’s leader, disaster.
For ten years, incapable of marching out.'

I think I've had readings where that fits, though I can't come up with an example this instant.

It's a bit less scorched-earth than concluding that whenever you get this line it's too late, or will be too late very soon. (I think I've had it that way, too, though.)

 

[Liselle]

So in this case, Yi might be saying, "Things are at a turning point, and also are very confused right now. If matters proceed on that basis, bad things will happen that might be hard to fix."

Or variations thereof. I have no feel for this situation, of course, since I don't live there.

 

[EmMacha]

I agree, which is why I said, in part:

'(maybe) ... it's a reflection of your own thoughts and feelings about the situation ...?'

I don't usually - hardly ever - think of the Yi as a means of prognostication (the action of foretelling or prophesying future events) but many people do. I'd guess that this reading is likely describing the current situation of uncertainty and people's concerns and fears, and that it's less about an eventual outcome

Yes, I think that's it, it is describing the situation as it is, but I do think it is also showing how the situation is playing out, according to Yi, not prognostication, but an idea of how the situation is moving, above that it would be disastrous to 'send armies '

 

[EmMacha]

So in this case, Yi might be saying, "Things are at a turning point, and also are very confused right now. If matters proceed on that basis, bad things will happen that might be hard to fix."

24.6, I think sometimes it could be seen as just saying someone or something is confused or deluded, and then what happens if you use confusion/delusion as a basis for proceeding (a.k.a. as nourishment, zhi gua 27?):

Yes I think this is it... very succinct Liselle, thank you.
I think the language of the cast & changing line also indicates that it's bad for trade, bad for "armies", but the ordinary people will still 'come and go'