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hilary said:Since I share Ewald's weird and irrational conviction that divination works, I found the list of threads very interesting. (And why didn't I think of doing that? ) There are some very 59-ish themes coming out there - the loss of a place to live, a refusal to abide by the unwritten communication rules any more, the breakdown of a relationship that's gone beyond its boundaries of 'friendship'. And with 59.2, Yi seems to be observing that things have come apart and encouraging people to acknowledge their need for security and concentrate on what's solid, instead of clutching for handfuls of waves and wind.
hilary said:Chris, if you're developing an interest in the meanings of ancient Chinese characters, the Eranos edition is not the best authority. But I'm sure someone would be willing to help you out with recommended dictionaries.
hilary said:Yi seems to be observing that things have come apart and encouraging people to acknowledge their need for security and concentrate on what's solid, instead of clutching for handfuls of waves and wind.
In theory, there is no difference between practice and theory, but in practice, there is.lightofreason said:IMHO your conclusion are rushed ;-) a need for instant gratification perhaps? ;-)
heylise said:
hilary said:If it has to do with flooding, then running for the stairs makes a great deal of sense. Is this a legitimate possible 'ancient' meaning?
heylise said:
dobro said:"the Species I Ching qualities are NOT derived from Ancient China etc"
Well not in so many words, maybe. But if the guys who put the Yi together knew as much about the patterns in things as they obviously appear to, then they had a knowledge of the general just as basic to our species as the one you describe.
dobro said:I've thought of somebody re-writing the Yi for a modern world, using modern symbols. Not concepts as you do, but symbols.
dobro said:It would go further even than the way you bring emotion into the picture when you interpet hexagram meanings. It wouldn't be limited to just thoughts and emotions. But what a lot of work! I haven't seen the Yi I talk about. If it appeared, it would have almost as much trouble as your own Yi at first. But people who understand symbols would immediately recognize its value as soon as they put it to use. Cuz oracles with symbols work.
dobro said:I've thought of somebody re-writing the Yi for a modern world, using modern symbols. Not concepts as you do, but symbols. It would go further even than the way you bring emotion into the picture when you interpet hexagram meanings.
dobro said:But there's something else too: there's a kind of control which permeates things when you access a higher mind (and I think that the 9/11 people you described were accessing a higher state, triggered by their imminent mortality) which requires you to do nothing - you're only the witness. This witnessing, I think, is part of 59.2 insofar as Hex 20 comes into play. If what I'm talking about is part of 59.2, then there's no hurrying or running or fleeing required - let it go and let it disperse - cuz all you have to do is open your eyes and your 'new' support is evident.
bruce_g said:(But don't tell Chris, cuz he thinks he invented archetypes!)
lightofreason said:The universals come out of the order that emerges when we contain noise.
If you read through the end section of:
http://members.iimetro.com.au/~lofting/myweb/WaveStructure.html
you will see the emergence of the trigram categories where such categories reflect compression of data.
Consider reality as what we see in telescopes. Then reduce the resolution to that of binoculars, and then reduce THAT to the resolution of naked-eye. The trigrams are like the constellations we see and a such reflect invarient qualities spanning all levels - and in IDM that is basic blending, bonding, bounding, and binding - all else follows (and so layers and layers of archetypes, specialised into sensory forms etc)
For the emergence of order from the containment of noise, Google the 'chaos game'.
THen comes containers in containers etc and so more and more specialisations all rooted in self-referencing. (and so the IC being a container is rooted in self-referencing and so can serve as a language to describe all other container - in general ;-))
Chris.
martin said:There are concepts, there are symbols and there are archetypes. All different.
bruce_g said:Your specific method works well for you, and you require a more detailed analysis to make up for what you lose in rejecting the always perfect fit-ness of a reading, which only divination/synchronicity can provide. But, whatever makes you feel better.
lightofreason said:At the Species I Ching level of meaning, 59 represents a context of contractive bounding within which is operating contractive binding.
<snip>
as the wind become influencial it is working in a context of protection, of sharp differentiation of 'this from that', 'fact from fiction', 'us from them' - from this comes the notion of dispersion of clouds, lifting of fog, and the dispelling of illusions. etc etc etc
<snip>
Chris.
bruce_g said:Not sure what definition sources you're using here, Martin. They aren't Jungian. Not that Jung is the end-all, but he has set a standard of terms in this area.
rinda said:Last time I was flying, I spent some time wondering about how the clouds stayed differentiated from the sky- there is a sharp differentiation even when the wind buffets the plane, and the clouds around it. There must be some force that holds the water molecules together, berhaps ionization? So If the context is sharp differentiation, how then does that relate to dispersion?
Rinda
Clarity,
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