attracting crowds 60.1.2 > 8

[hopex]

it has happened a few times now - I am out with my
dog and someone stops to talk about him and it becomes
a crowd (which freaks my dog in the end ! )

its a funny thing - I asked Yi about it. I was merely looking
at a cardigan and a nice cuople stopped then an elderly gent
- however I was aware of another 4/5 people on the periphery.

My dog likes the people talking but not the 'onlookers'

maybe I dont get out much and just need to get used to it

 

[Trojina]

it has happened a few times now - I am out with my
dog and someone stops to talk about him and it becomes
a crowd (which freaks my dog in the end ! )

its a funny thing - I asked Yi about it. I was merely looking
at a cardigan and a nice cuople stopped then an elderly gent
- however I was aware of another 4/5 people on the periphery.

My dog likes the people talking but not the 'onlookers'

maybe I dont get out much and just need to get used to it

I think Yi is taking the piss out of you....You go out of the door or you don't go out of the door...(60.1.2)the choice is yours (hex 8)


You haven't said what the question was.


People like to pat dogs and so on.....but why is he drawing crowds there was a picture posted of him I think but I couldn't see it as I'm not in facebook



You said you 'stopped to look at a cardigan' you mean you took the dog to a shopping centre ...or busy street ? Maybe its best to take him to open spaces where he's free to run about.


Actually its a really clear answer. Hex 8, choosing where you/he belongs...open space or cardigan shops. Then you decide to go to them or not.

Yes Yi is showing you the obvious.


I never liked walking in busy streets with my dog as she didn't much like it.....she preferred to let rip, off the lead, in an open green space.

Is Bruce having a good run off the leash ? I think all dogs need that. I hate seeing people always having their dogs on leashes restraining them even in open space.

 

[hopex]

we are in the country at the moment so Brucie had an hour on
the open plain but I sat in a bohemian cafe after in an antiques arcade
where I do business. This is an open market not busy on a monday
- a collegue was unpacking from a vintage fair and had a viv westward
cardigan. So we were talking when the tourist couple came by

We have just been a galumphing over a country estate leash free and by
the deer park

people like the look of Bruce becasue he's cuddly. My Mother was a farmer
and I grew up with animals so I hope that reassures you Trojan

 

[dragona]

Hehe, that`s kinda sweet...you two are "Holding Together" perhaps and odd, interesting pair (especially if you happen to be a small , fragile figured lady) so you attract the attention..and you get to form boundries for people to follow...if Bruce gets nervous at these times, you could just keep people away - it s not unusual that people think every animal is to be pated by all and enjoy it and I have seen owners just say: "Leave the dog alone, he is tired." The end of the story. You make the rules for both.
There is an atachment to see the doggie trojan: http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=14971&page=2

 

[Trojina]

we are in the country at the moment so Brucie had an hour on
the open plain but I sat in a bohemian cafe after in an antiques arcade
where I do business. This is an open market not busy on a monday
- a collegue was unpacking from a vintage fair and had a viv westward
cardigan. So we were talking when the tourist couple came by

We have just been a galumphing over a country estate leash free and by
the deer park

people like the look of Bruce becasue he's cuddly. My Mother was a farmer
and I grew up with animals so I hope that reassures you Trojan

It does, but its not really me who needs reassuring is it ?

60.1 is about not going out and it being okay and 60.2 is about not going out and so missing opportunites.

These can hardly be completely overlooked in favour of the focus on hex 8 being all about you two bonding.

Its some task to figure 60.1 and 60.2 together as they mean the opposite. Either way they are about staying in and going out and here it seems pretty literal as I find these particular lines often are.


What do you think it means ?


You still haven't said what the question was...

 

[hopex]

Question was why has Bruce attracted a crowd of people
for 3rd time in 2 days ?

I think Dragona is right we make a pair !

also there are times when its good to be in and times when its
good to go out - our rambles together are bonding sessions but
I do have a responsibility some people are afraid of several kilos
of muscular dog bounding towards them

i just wonder how B is going to cope with celebrity - will get him an
agent - naah he's just a dawgg x

 

[dragona]

We each offer our own idea or an impression of the situation, don`t we? The one who asked should take it in an account as fits the best for him...so, I liked the image of the new pair in town.
I think you are in the phase of getting used to life with each other and remember someone said he will benefit you or you will benefit one another, so there..
And I like trojan`s take on lines 1 and 2, sayin it is your decision where and how to take him out but in the future things should probably get more common in terms of your everyday routine.
Have you heard of Maru, the cat? Show him to Bruce and see....

 

[Trojina]

We each offer our own idea or an impression of the situation, don`t we? The one who asked should take it in an account as fits the best for him...so, I liked the image of the new pair in town. I think you are in the phase of getting used to life with each other and remember someone said he will benefit you or you will benefit one another, so there..
And I like trojan`s take on lines 1 and 2, sayin it is your decision where and how to take him out but in the future things should probably get more common in terms of your everyday routine.
Have you heard of Maru, the cat? Show him to Bruce and see....

Mmmm I don't know. I don't always see it like that....I mean theres no point just choosing the interpretation that makes you feel good at the cost of completely ignoring the I Ching reading and I see that more and more here on SR

A group of friends saying supportive things to each other but totally ignoring the actual reading. I think thats happened on all of the Bruce the Dog threads and other threads by other people

 

[dragona]

Mmmm I don't know. I don't always see it like that....I mean theres no point just choosing the interpretation that makes you feel good at the cost of completely ignoring the I Ching reading and I see that more and more here on SR

A group of friends saying supportive things to each other but totally ignoring the actual reading. I think thats happened on all of the Bruce the Dog threads and other threads by other people

Oh, I do hope this is not so. In this case, I was not ignoring, just was saying what made sense to me, did not know the exact query even. I like to be able to relate to the topic and this thread made sense in the way that a dog can only benefit getting a caring and sensible owner.

It gets amazing for me where people can go with the interpretations offered sometimes and conclusion they are getting out of them.
But I try to be understanding, smooth persuasion always works better when someone is in distress and you can see from the way they ask and how they interpret things how affected they are. It is hard for most to see the cast with an objective eye.
And most tend to ignore the bad news anyway...and ask more. :bag:
It is good to return to the older casts or sleep on it...yea, easier said then done.

But in Bruce`s case, you think hopex made the wrong decision or what is troubling you in her casts on the matter? I don`t follow, sorry.

 

[Trojina]

Oh, I do hope this is not so. In this case, I was not ignoring, just was saying what made sense to me, did not know the exact query even. I like to be able to relate to the topic and this thread made sense in the way that a dog can only benefit getting a caring and sensible owner.

It gets amazing for me where people can go with the interpretations offered sometimes and conclusion they are getting out of them.
But I try to be understanding, smooth persuasion always works better when someone is in distress and you can see from the way they ask and how they interpret things how affected they are. It is hard for most to see the cast with an objective eye.
And most tend to ignore the bad news anyway...and ask more. :bag:
It is good to return to the older casts or sleep on it...yea, easier said then done.

But in Bruce`s case, you think hopex made the wrong decision or what is troubling you in her casts on the matter? I don`t follow, sorry.

I only meant some of the castings were very much over looked...(in general, not by you in particular) such as 53.3.5>23 and 42.6. and 55>16 This doesn't mean there was a wrong decision exactly, I just thought there was more to it, more to think about. Re your statement underlined...that kind of indicates what I was saying. What you said is common sense. You believe if an owner is caring then an animal will be fine. I agree that seems like common sense but the I Ching gives us more than common sense. Thats why we ask it.

I thought the answers said more than that. I think theres alot of responsibility involved in the care of this dog. We have had 3 threads on the dog now so its still on Hopexs mind for some reason.


We have to allow the I Ching to say the opposite of what we ourselves would think don't we.



However as all seems well best to "let sleeping dogs lie" as they say

 

[dragona]

I see your point. Valid. A presumption, as benevolent as it is, is still a presumption.
Still I don`t think it was off and those readings are for hopex to get into and for us to offer our view.
All we can do, really.

 

[foxx777]

@Trojan: I am curious. As you say "friends comforting friends" seems to be the rule specifically with the Bruce threads, do you see some danger or "opposite message" within the readings cast by Hopex?

I am just wondering, as if there is , say, some potential danger in bringing him around too many people too soon it might be worth exploring, or Hopex may even decide to consult a vet about what is the best protocol. I understand 60.1.2 in the following manner: ( I know you dislike Berkers but indulge me):

60. Limitation

Line 1:

Not going out of the door to the yard.
Without fault.

Limiting oneself to what is familiar, not taking risks. It is not wrong to do so.

Line 2:

Not going beyond the gate of the yard.
Misfortune.

Limiting oneself too much, and by that missing opportunities.

If there is some danger, line 2 would seem to be misleading in all of the translations I know of. But it is indeed something to ponder with regard to an animal that had a rough past, and was in a shelter, and is now surrounded by people. I would say a healthy dose of caution coupled with a spirit of fun should be the right formula. Hard to attain, I know.

and just from memory, Wilhelm's 42.6 is "He brings increase to no one. Indeed, someone even strikes him. He does not keep his heart constantly steady" (or close enough, as I said, from memory)---what might you see in this with regard to Bruce? I think it may mean that one must be careful of him getting overstimulated, and avoid any possible mishap.

 

[Trojina]

@Trojan: I am curious. As you say friends comforting friends seems to be the rule specifically with the Bruce threads, do you see some danger or "opposite message" within the readings cast by Hopex?

Yes, but I already explained that on the previous threads. I'm not being alarmist, its not like danger from the outside..

I am just wondering, as if there is , say, some potential danger in bringing him around too many people too soon it might be worth exploring, or Hopex may even decide to consult a vet about what is the best protocol. I understand 60.1.2 in the following manner: ( I know you dislike Berkers but indulge me):
If there is some danger, line 2 would seem to be misleading in all of the translations I know of. But it is indeed something to ponder with regard to an animal that had a rough past, and was in a shelter, and is now surrounded by people. I would say a healthy dose of caution coupled with a spirit of fun should be the right formula. Hard to attain, I know

.


Personally with this reading in this thread I don't feel its that deep...it just describes going out/not going out and yes may refer to past expereinces of being out...who knows However in this thread Hopex asked about the motives of the crowd not the dog. Assuming everyonein the crowd had similar motives...she asked "why has Bruce attracted a crowd of people". It would probably make any answer hard to understand...is it about the crowd..?.is it about the dog ? More importantly what is the real question here ? So no I don't see 'danger' here...its not really a question of danger is it ..

and just from memory, Wilhelm's 42.6 is "He brings increase to no one. Indeed, someone even strikes him. He does not keep his heart steady" (or close enough, as I said, from memory)---what might you see in this with regard to Bruce? I think it may mean that one must be careful of him getting overstimulated, and avoid any possible mishap.

I said what i thought it meant, in depth, on the previous threads about Bruce here http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=14882&page=2 in which the 42.6 was cast....and there were other casts here http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=14949 Look back if you want to see what i said. I don't think it has anything whatsoever to do with being overstimulated I can't imagine how you get that fron 42.6

 

[foxx777]

Yes, but I already explained that on the previous threads. I'm not being alarmist, its not like danger from the outside..



.


Personally with this reading in this thread I don't feel its that deep...it just describes going out/not going out and yes may refer to past expereinces of being out...who knows However in this thread Hopex asked about the motives of the crowd not the dog. Assuming everyonein the crowd had similar motives...she asked "why has Bruce attracted a crowd of people". It would probably make any answer hard to understand...is it about the crowd..?.is it about the dog ? More importantly what is the real question here ? So no I don't see 'danger' here...its not really a question of danger is it ..






I said what i thought it meant, in depth, on the previous threads about Bruce in which the 42.6 was cast. Look back if you want to see what i said. I don't think it has anything whatsoever to do with being overstimulated I can't imagine how you get that fron 42.6

I think it is very obvious. In this context, with these facts , in this situation, that line to me would be self explanatory in terms of possible potential.

In any case, I have my own past experiences with my own dog which compels me to at least throw the idea out there.

I was not asking about the other thread: I was asking about the line with regard to this present context, about how the situation is now unfolding. And yeah, I know how to look for what you said in other threads. But I would rather work with it from the current context.
ETA: The reason I am not interested in going back thru the threads is that years of I Ching consulting has shown me that a reading I receive one week, may actually only be understood some weeks down the line. It anticipated the current situation, as it were, somewhat prophetically. very similar to what Jung found with certain obscure dreams.

 

[foxx777]

In any case, Hopex, I think you and Bruce seem to be doing well, and I was just sounding a word of caution, really common sense moderation I am sure you have thought of---you know him best, and seem to be doing a lovely job with him. He sounds like an attractive dog, and I'll bet people simply like seeing him. I myself have found the readings to be fairly obvious and quite positive, and am not quite sure what anyone could see of bad faith or false comfort in the various responses; but decided I would give the warning side a whirl. x Hope you post a pic of the real boy asap. x

 

[hopex]

Thank you everyone - this has stimulated some debate and
I am enlightened by it all and feel I owe my thoughts.

I am a natural animal person having had an idyllic childhood
with a very organic Mother and Father. Life has changed - there
is less space in our fair island and small dogs are the trend.

42.6 to me talks of the business opportunities I am not chasing
while I am with my dog. So I know what that is - I have a metrop-
olitan life due to things that can only be done in the metropolis -
but I am half time in the sticks. More so with B now in my life but
I am finding it as healing as he is. Plus he copes well in London as
we are in the green part there.

B had an incident of growling at a volunteer at the gate of the office
in his last days in the sanctuary - that is why he
has come to me for his sake as his days were numbered there. I feel
he lacked a consistent leader and was stir crazy never going anywhere
beyond the office day in day out 24/7/365. He got lonely there at night
and the volunteer was hopeless with animals lacking the empathy i
see in animal lovers. As you all know you have to have no fear of the
dog.

The rehabilitation is going well and he is thriving in a normal
environment. He is off leash and by my side on command. I am
content that consistent attention is suiting him he is blossoming.
My only anxiety is the change of pace of it all for me a mega busy
entrepreneurial person ready to jump at any opportunity - but what could be
better walking through the morning mists in beautiful countryside and
consistent routine and permanence?

There is stuff I have to do and I think i do him a disservice not
exposing him to what I need to do for business.

imagine turner and hooch - he makes you want to wrap your arms
round his big head and shoulders. I am delighted that dog people
are so cool - i watch out for people who assume he is friendly and
touch him without asking me.

right now I believe his concern when so many people are surrounding
us is figuring out what they are up to and whether they mean me harm.
A throw back to his office days - it is me he is watching out for and he
loves it just the 2 of us - as most dogs do with their master/mistress.

I am delighted that he pulls me away rather than challenges. Who
wants to be pestered by all and sundry anyway ?

I believe in positivity and support - I am sure that one can detect a
warning from Yi and I have always been grateful for it.

on a final note i asked Yi is B ok as he slept happy in the boot room
16.4 > 2 - I think his life is settling rather than guarding the sanctuary
office for over 12 months like piccadilly circus.

B is a victim of his own handsomeness. I love what Dragona advised
tell people that he is tired. Thanks foxx777 Dragona and Trojan - the
range of opinion very helpful. Will stick to more serious topics hence-
forth

 

[foxx777]

I have loved hearing about Bruce, am so delighted that you and he are doing so well and bonding so beautifully (H8) : I felt from the get go that all he needed was you, someone to understand him and just allow him to be a dog and live the good life of a dog---in truth I did not see anything negative and was honest in positive feedback, but since the issue was brought up, decided to stretch it a bit, but your report sounds as if all is well and even better than I had hope for -and I for one do hope that you continue posting about him - the more the better!!!

 

[dragona]

Its nice to be right about something good , so hope it will stay that way