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Blog post: Casting the vessel… of state?

hilary

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I’ve written very excited posts before about the pattern of complementary hexagrams in the Sequence of the Yijing. Quick recap: to find a hexagram’s complement, you change all 6 of its lines. Thus the complement of hexagram 1 is hexagram 2 -

1.gif
2.gif


and the complement of Hexagram 3, Sprouting is Hexagram 50, the Vessel:

3.gif
50.gif


- and this is where it gets exciting, as…


  1. every hexagram between 3 and 50 finds its complement within that space, too. So it’s almost as if the Vessel and its complement were… a Vessel, in the Sequence, for containing hexagrams.
  2. if you imagine 3 and 50 as the mould to cast the vessel, and start looking at the ‘layers’ of the casting inside the mould – 5 and 6 on one side, 47 and 48 on the other, and so on all the way ‘in’, you find some lovely patterns: correlations in both shape and meaning of the hexagrams sited opposite one another.
  3. at the mid-point of this (when you’ve matched up 5/6 with 48/47, 7/8 with 46/45, and so on), you find the two sequences meet between 25-26 and 28-27. 28-27 look like (among other things) a mould and the contents poured into it.

So anyway… this is great fun to play with, and I’m barely beginning. (For instance, there must be something distinctive and unifying about the hexagrams that aren’t in the Vessel, don’t you think?) Today I’m just adding another idea to the mix: state building.

The Zhou people, when they established their rule, created a substantial sphere of influence by setting up feudal lords. Some were relatives, some were local leaders who became allies; all governed their region as representatives of Zhou authority, creating a network of trust through which information and resources could flow.

The hexagram associated with the moment of establishing Zhou rule is 50: the Vessel, embodiment of a state validated by its connection to the spirits through offering.

And hexagram 3…
‘Sprouting.
From the source, creating success, constancy bears fruit.
Don’t use this to have a direction to go,
Fruitful to establish feudal lords.’
…shows a new ruler, not travelling, but expanding his network in all directions like the roots of a seedling.

There’s a great expanse of hexagrams, and a great gulf in experience, between the clear, strong centre and the small one struggling to get a grip in the new soil – and yet they’re also the same pattern, like opposite sides of the same mould.

No other complementary hexagrams are anything like so far apart (the next largest gap is between 5 and 35, then 21 and 48). Maybe this represents the great physical distance between the centre and the states: it was a great achievement to bridge such a distance, creating true echoes of the centre far away at the periphery. (Also, of course, it wasn’t sustainable: the states grew in independence, their bonds to the centre weakened, and in the end the states held the real power.)

So now I’m seeing a second ‘layer’ of meaning in this structure of complements. It shows vessel-casting, the mould and its reverse side – but it also shows state-building.

Here in the West, especially on this small damp island, the natural image for the state is a ship. But in ancient China… perhaps the vessel of state? The state as humanity’s hugest endeavour, its biggest mirror to heaven; the Vessel, the most sophisticated product of the civilisation (just think what it takes – expert knowledge, technology, resources, support – to cast one), and also, in the shared ritual meal, at the heart of its very direct and simple relationship to the spirits. Everything we do (or almost everything – not forgetting 51-64) could be understood within the arc of that great enterprise.

This casts new light on those correlations between hexagrams further into the mould. Hexagrams 5 and 6 stand across from 48-47, and you could surely say that Hexagram 5, waiting and praying for favourable weather, is fulfilling the same basic function as the Well, bringing what the farmer needs. Only the Well is the product of complex collaboration, part of a stable civilisation. It’s just that there are faint echoes between the prayers and dances of 5 and the well-lining work of 48.

Then there’s 8, how we come together, like Yu bringing the beginnings of the first state together after the floods were conquered – sited opposite the grand ceremony of 45, renewing the same covenant, still bringing order out of chaos. (That was what Yu did – and the line texts of 45 are a reminder that bigger gatherings create more opportunities for chaos!) More echoes, I think. Or am I hearing things?
 
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Liselle

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Alas, whenever I see a post based on the Sequence my eyes glaze over, because I don't understand the Sequence (how it came to be, why it matters, etc.).

Somewhere here (found it via searching "sequence") you had linked to an article called "The I Ching Landscape" about trigrams in the Sequence, and on the same site there's another article, "The explanation of King Wen’s order of the 64 hexagrams".

After looking those over (albeit briefly), I'm still :confused:.

Enough is made of the Sequence that I think I should make a good faith effort with it, but where to begin?

Do you think it's just a matter of digging into those articles with a bit more fortitude? Or is there something simpler that would be better to start with?

[Edited to add: Shortly after I posted this (of course) it dawned on me that searching the blog and searching the rest of the website are two different things. Searching the blog for "sequence" popped up a whole bunch of results. Maybe I should start there...:duh:]
 
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Trojina

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I don't think you have to dig through the sequence to see what might be happening with the patterns



I don't even believe in the sequence I only believe in the patterns

I believe in pairs like 1 and 2 and 3 and 4...one can see how they are 2 sides of the same coin

I almost believe in opposites or rather complementary hexagrams...where you make every line of a hexagram the opposite and, for the first time I think we actually explored connections in complementary hexagrams here, explored how complements might complement

http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?17790-Hexagram-Opposites


This is shocking, that it's the first time, for me, because actually if anything means anything in the I Ching the meanings lie amongst the patterns, they can't not can they ? They didn't get that way accidentally...it cannot be by accident that every hexagram between 3 and 50 finds it's complement within that space.


My trouble is I feel I need some physical props to help me think about it....then I figured there could be no physical props it would just take time and some paper.

Hang on...hang on.....neuron overload.... once I believe in the patterns it seems I would actually have to believe in the sequence......or it wouldn't mean much..

I can't cope with it all at once so take one pattern at a time
 

hilary

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I've never been able to find where the sequence comes from or how old it is. Does anyone know?

There isn't any grand unifying explanation of the sequence to learn - oh, of course every now and then someone thinks they've cracked it, but they all seem to be right at once, and I don't think any of them can account for everything the others notice. And then there are little pattern-fragments galore. So... there is nothing to 'get' really. If you want a starting point, just get in the habit of checking with your own readings to see if the preceding hexagram is where you've been, or maybe a prerequisite for this one. If you want a starting point for patterns in the sequence... er... sit and look at it and see if you spot a new one?
 

Liselle

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I don't even believe in the sequence I only believe in the patterns

I believe in pairs like 1 and 2 and 3 and 4...one can see how they are 2 sides of the same coin

[...]

it cannot be by accident that every hexagram between 3 and 50 finds it's complement within that space.

[...]

Hang on...hang on.....neuron overload.... once I believe in the patterns it seems I would actually have to believe in the sequence......or it wouldn't mean much..
Pretty much nodded my head all the way through that, and ended much where you did: :confused: LOL

Had noticed the Opposites thread but haven't read much of it, yet. Thanks for reminding.

If you want a starting point for patterns in the sequence... er... sit and look at it and see if you spot a new one?

Am I maybe thinking about this backwards? I was thinking: "I don't understand Hilary's post, because I don't understand the sequence." Is the point more that finding things like this, the 3-to-50 pattern within the King Wen sequence, helps to corroborate the King Wen sequence? Helps to prove that it is the correct one rather than others?
 

hilary

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Well, it's the oldest one we've got. I suppose it helps to prove it's not just some random aberration and is actually meaningful and purposeful. (You do get people who want to bin the whole thing and replace it with something systematic and fully comprehensible.)

I should have linked to previous posts in the series - must edit original blog post. Here they are:
http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2012/09/08/casting-the-vessel/
http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2012/09/16/casting-the-vessel-so/
http://onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2012/09/26/casting-the-vessel-so-part-2/
 

Liselle

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Am relieved to find out that it's not so much that I must hurry "learn" all this.

To carry the metallurgical metaphor possibly beyond reason, maybe this "Yeekery" (nice term) is akin to the properties and grain structure of the Yi? And while you don't have to be a metallurgist (Yeek) to make use of the metal (do readings), it is nice to know that the internal structure is still there, holding the whole thing together.
 
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Sparhawk

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Well, it's the oldest one we've got. I suppose it helps to prove it's not just some random aberration and is actually meaningful and purposeful. (You do get people who want to bin the whole thing and replace it with something systematic and fully comprehensible.)

Not really... It is the "received sequence" but that doesn't make it the oldest one. The Mawangdui sequence is older, as far as extant copies goes, for example and it has a logical explanation to boot. The so called KWS could be a Han Dynasty construct for all we know. There is even some speculation that it was created using the Jiao Shi Yilin as a basis as there aren't extant copies of the received KWS older than the Yilin itself.
 

anemos

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Luis,

have been playing with hex and order for a while. altering the KW sequence with a more symmetrical one ( in my lay-person-pov) i.e Heaven , 1s,2s,3s - 3d 2d 1d Earth the double hexagrams and the 11 12 31 32 41 42 63 64 create a cycle within the square.

also a question. Is there any source talking about the Fire and water trigrams as appeared 'later" than the rest ? The feeling I get is without them Yijing is somehow 2d and by adding those two becomes 3D . Is that a later influence , considering the symbolism of fire and water that in other systems has very similar traits with heaven and earth ? ( alchemy for instance) .

maybe what i'm saying is pure nonsense,yet its a question has been in my mind for quite awhile.haven't investigate it and probably i 'see' patterns where they don't exist, but the water-fire trigrams , somehow breaking the polarity of heaven-earth and add another dimension , as i said earlier.
 

Sparhawk

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also a question. Is there any source talking about the Fire and water trigrams as appeared 'later" than the rest ? The feeling I get is without them Yijing is somehow 2d and by adding those two becomes 3D . Is that a later influence , considering the symbolism of fire and water that in other systems has very similar traits with heaven and earth ? ( alchemy for instance) .

Hi Maria,

Not sure I follow you... I haven't heard that theory before. However, we can safely assume all trigrams were created at the same time. It is a simple progression once you establish the binary --as in yin/yang, black/white, etc.--, base. The rich symbology attached to them is a completely different story. I would say though that (I was reading this recently) man "knowing" and using fire for at least a million years and water being present for ever, there should be not much of a doubt that ancient mankind has been observing those contrasts since antiquity. Another reason to argue that all basic meanings were created/attached at the same time. IMHO, of course.
 

anemos

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Thank you Luis

my question was not clear because its not clear in my mind too... sorry .

was looking at the black/white progression and it feels like there is not an intention -(don't know how better describe it) , yet simply elegant.

xiantian.gif


what I observe is that the second level( line) consists of 4 trigrams : earth, heaven, fire, water.

on the other hand at the "waning-waxing" sequence, fire and water trigrams are missing.

Maybe its not important and we talk about different things but I was just curious and wondered if there is a theory behind that.
 

Liselle

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Anemos, where did you find that diagram? I'd like to read about it. Thanks.
 

hilary

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Not really... It is the "received sequence" but that doesn't make it the oldest one. The Mawangdui sequence is older, as far as extant copies goes, for example and it has a logical explanation to boot. The so called KWS could be a Han Dynasty construct for all we know. There is even some speculation that it was created using the Jiao Shi Yilin as a basis as there aren't extant copies of the received KWS older than the Yilin itself.

Good to know, thank you!

I suppose it feels older (tremendously scientific approach, I know) because it's not perfectly symmetrical and explicable. Like the Later Heaven bagua as compared with the Early Heaven one. There seems to be a human tendency to want to make things all neat, tidy and symmetrical. The KWS seems more organic, like a natural phenomenon (or a work of literature): look at it for long enough, and you see all kinds of patterns, but you can never find one view that accounts for everything. In other words, like poetry, it is already in its simplest form, can't be described by anything simpler. (If you want to tell me the MWD sequence, you can do so by telling me the rules to generate it. Whereas if you want to tell me the KWS, you'll have to write the whole thing out.)
 

Sparhawk

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Yes, that's the beauty of the KWS: it is open to interpretation in and by itself. Scott Davis believes it is much older than the Han but it is an inferred opinion based on the received text (you have the book so you know this). A few years ago I proposed to him that it was perhaps ordered as musical notation as there are repeating patterns in the "人 band" of lines (lines 3 and 4) suggesting some sort of rhythm. Those patterns are not present in the other two sections in the sequence.
 
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That's interesting, Luis. I could not help but to see a progressive set of keyboards in the diagram.
 

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