Calamity after 10 years? Why?

[ginnie]

More on line 55.1, the first line moving in Abundance Peaked.

Was reading in the Concordance that the 'princes of equal rank' can indeed be husband and wife.

So why should they 'go' after a complete cycle of time? The text says "Exceeding a decade, calamity indeed."

Calamity is said to mean the disaster comes from outside, as opposed to SHENG, when the disaster is due to personal fault.

Does this mean that whenever a husband and wife are both strong people, that they will inevitably always need to move every 10 years? I asked: "What is the reason husband+wife have to move after a complete cycle of time?"

Got 10.1.2.3.4.6 > 53

Only line not moving is line 5.

H53 pertains to our marriage, I think, the stages it has gone through and will go through.

 

[ginnie]

Adaptiveness

I had asked a similar question previously and got: 56.4.6 > 15.

I take it to mean, we got what we wanted, but still we're not happy.

In 56.6 the bird burns its own nest. One text says that it takes things too easily and gets careless. It has lost its adaptiveness. Maybe it has lost its adaptiveness because it has been in the same place for too long a time.

56.6 changes to H62. Also H55.1 changes to H62. Stay low, be small. (???) Or does H62 signify a time of transition . . .

 

[Trojina]

10 years ? In Wilhelm its says 10 days for 55.1. What text says 'exceeding a decade' ?

Also theres no mention of 'calamity' in 55.1 is there ? Its just a relationship that will come to serve its purpose in a cycle of time and that could be a long cycle or a short cycle i guess. Its a fruitful connection but it has its culmination after its purpose is served

I wouldn't take it as a generalisation that 55.1 means all married couples need to move on after 10 days (figuratively)

Theres no reason to think it applies to married couples at all, except in this particular instance of your question it refers, you think to you and your husband. If you've no intention of ending any cycle with your husband i guess you could take it as seeing this time as a particular phase in the relationship. All relationships are cyclical aren't they regardless of being married or not...some of those cycles end the relationship, sometimes the cycles just put it on a slightly different footing...but i lost track of your actual question...

although 55.1 isn't focused on the ending exactly is it, more like understanding theres a peak for the relationship and past that peak of usefulness and value it will surely shift., but while its happening its surely 'meant to be', natural, fated even ?

And of course it says in 55 'do not be sad, be like the sun at noon' because theres awareness the time is a bit of a tipping point. a peak, a fullness of possibility of what can be

 

[bradford]

It's the Xiaoxiang or Wing text that uses Zai, disaster or calamity, if the timeliness of the affair is exceeded. This just means that there is a lot of energy on the loose here in 55 and if the time's requirements aren't respected, you can get knocked around by it. You need to stay attentive in 55 and able to make executive decisions.

 

[ginnie]

Thank you. Yes, there's a lot of energy loose in this situation.

With respect to which, I feel I ought to do something. I've gotten rather often 42.4: "It is advantageous to be a dependent and move the homeland.' That line keeps popping up. However, on my own that would be just about impossible. So, I am preoccupied with this.

Always when I get hexagram 55 i am very concerned about something, which is why, I think, Yi says to put the warm and bright sun at the center of my day -- and stop worrying. Alternatively, it gives me H5.5: have a feast; eat, drink, and be merry.

 

[bradford]

I forgot to mention that in this case the calamity or disaster could be just a big opportunity missed from not being where the time demanded.

 

[meng]

From the hip: The time comes when we feel we've had enough. With a head full of steam, we set up new borders and standards, and demand full cooperation from those around us, which more than likely sends them running.

So, I think the opposite way is what's shown in line 1. Staying together an excessively long time is actually a good thing.

As far as what better use to make of that head of steam, that could be the most fun part for both, providing both are still capable of change and a little adventure. Otherwise it is stuck, and the best may be only grinning and bearing it. So the shake up of 55 is necessary, but you don't necessarily want to fry the relationship.

 

[ginnie]

I forgot to mention that in this case the calamity or disaster could be just a big opportunity missed from not being where the time demanded.

Massively insightful! Thank you so much.

Isn't it always advisable to act, if at all possible, without hesitation on what the I Ching has tried to tell us, as soon as we understand what we need to do? Otherwise the sense of loss later will be like struggling along under a dark cloud of loss and regret.

I've been getting 42.4 fairly regularly, and I do understand how the time of increase is time limited. Strike while the iron is hot! At the same time, I am generally speaking right now in a time of hexagram 41, decreased vitality. I can still get things moving along by attempting to motivate others or influencing others, since I'll need their assistance -- and anyway, this is not all about me. Hexagram 42 is said to benefit everybody.

 

[ginnie]

Frying the Relationship

From the hip: The time comes when we feel we've had enough.

Staying together an excessively long time is actually a good thing.

So the shake up of 55 is necessary, but you don't necessarily want to fry the relationship.

Yes, we want to be careful not to fry the relationship.

 

[Trojina]

I forgot to mention that in this case the calamity or disaster could be just a big opportunity missed from not being where the time demanded.

yes 55.1 as a window of opportunity, i'd not seen it that way before, it certainly makes sense

 

[bamboo]

sometimes the window of opportunity in 55.1 is just the timeframe...not anything dire but just the way it is, as in childbearing years ( they end after awhile) and maybe things like making a career move, or just deciding to cultivate a relationship to the fullest in the years when it still makes a difference or can be fully enjoyed. I think a good way to look at this might to be to project oneself into the future, 10 years hence perhaps, and imagine what you might be saying you wished you had done, said, expressed. Everything has a timeframe. Hendricks wrote a good book about this...I think it was called 5 Questions That Can Change Your life.

 

[tigerintheboat]

Treading, All Kinds

I asked: "What is the reason husband+wife have to move after a complete cycle of time?"

Got 10.1.2.3.4.6 > 53

Only line not moving is line 5.

H53 pertains to our marriage, I think, the stages it has gone through and will go through.

So, all kinds of treading, moving ever closer to the Tiger in lines 1 through 4, but excluding line 5, where you have a definite aim and go for it. So you are engaged in all forms of treading around something dangerous and powerful, and perhaps for most relationships, this amount of treading carefully becomes difficult to sustain.

If you read the commentaries in Lines 1-4, it could sound like a marriage, with simple interactions (Line 1), Easy Interactions between Two where Neither is concerned about Others (Line 2), Getting Bit (Line 3), Careful Pleading and Winning Your Case (Line 4), and Being the Observer, standing outside the relationship, watching, in good fortune.

Tiger
(not the one whose tail you are treading near)

 

[ginnie]

Everything has a timeframe. Hendricks wrote a good book about this...I think it was called 5 Questions That Can Change Your life.

Could be the issue is delaying.

From my reading today in A Course in Miracles: 'Given a change of purpose for the good, there is no reason for an interval in which disaster strikes, to be perceived as "good" some day but now in form of pain. This is a sacrifice of now . . .'

The pain struck in the form of a severe low back pain and I actually am having trouble walking at all. One day I was fine. The next day I was using a cane.

Since I had already chosen to do spiritual work, perhaps I might concern myself more with how to actually do that instead of trying to accomplish things that are now physically impossible.

 

[bamboo]

Could be the issue is delaying.

From my reading today in A Course in Miracles: 'Given a change of purpose for the good, there is no reason for an interval in which disaster strikes, to be perceived as "good" some day but now in form of pain. This is a sacrifice of now . . .'

The pain struck in the form of a severe low back pain and I actually am having trouble walking at all. One day I was fine. The next day I was using a cane.

Since I had already chosen to do spiritual work, perhaps I might concern myself more with how to actually do that instead of trying to accomplish things that are now physically impossible.

I am not sure what you mean, Ginnie

55.1 would not imply a delay (to me) but nor does it suggest moving as you seem to think? or doing anything physically impossible or physically trying. I dont really see why you asked the question "why does a husband-wife need to move after ten years?"

If 55.1 applies to your marriage partnership, it could simply mean to use this time together now for maximum appreciation, cultivate it to the max, not letting things go unsaid, not delaying joy today in hopes for some better tomorrow...that kind of thing. the calamity is in the unlived life.

sorry about your back pain ouch.

 

[meng]

Appreciating Bamboo's comments, and your last post especially, Ginnie. Except I've never made the distinction between spiritual work and any other kind of work. Anything requiring effort and release of the will is work. Probably the most spiritual thing I do is walk. The second is cook.

But I'm not sure how this relates to 55.1 or your question: Calamity after 10 years? Why?

gonna look up the word "ruler". Bradford has "Meeting ones match........ continuing has merit." Match is a better word here, I think. Someone of equal or even superior status and say-so. Continuing has merit. I could be wrong, Ginnie, but am I picking up some resentment about being advised to continue on past the cycle? Because I don't see the Yi saying to continue on, only that it has merit. I think it's always important to not fight against a hedge, especially from the inside, and to keep options open. If options don't exist, it's a good time to possibly consider them. If people are together it should be because they mutually want to be together, not because there's no way out.

 

[meng]

..to cultivate a relationship to the fullest in the years when it still makes a difference or can be fully enjoyed.

pithy interpretation :bows:

 

[ginnie]

I'm going to have to go back and re-read the questions I asked to which the responses were 55.1, because it is no longer clear to me that my husband is the other person referred to.

The difficulty may be that we're not all using the same translation.

For example, here is a translation:

To work with one's destined ruler [the prince of equal rank]
Is no mistake. But only for so long.

That is, "to cling to him after the completion of the task is harmful. One must be able to stop at the right moment."

Line 55.1 is therefore often interpreted to mean a kind of relationship that has a built-in time limit. It's like the two people come together for a purpose, a specific reason, a project -- and then it must end.

That's why I say I had better go back and review what questions I was asking. Because the implication can be that I need to meet a person who can help me with my purposes. In other words, the other person mentioned may be someone I have not met yet.

The reason I say this is that I have frequently gotten H13 lately, and that means getting out and about and speaking with other people, not staying at home.

 

[rodaki]

hi Ginnie,

I've been following the discussion here with great interest, learning lots . . I just had an idea bout 55.1 . . not really sure for this but I thought I'd share it anyways to put it to the test . .

sometime ago I was thinking of the 1st line as the 'sign on the door' of the hexagram, kind of a more general guideline rather than a step in a process . . in 55 things are plentiful, opulent, drawn in wide brushstrokes . . the pieces fit more or less and there's too much happening to really focus on the small print (which may be an issue). 55.1 seems like a meeting that succeeds because of the sameness of status and the common goals that are in full force . . kind of like the 'honeymoon' period maybe? (and it could be that relationships have more-than-one such periods that follow different timescales so this could take 10 days/weeks/months/years but it's always a phase that can not be maintained for ever)

. . what happens after that is 62, with all its attention to detail, it reminds me of micro-chiseling, fine-tuning . . it could be then that the flow of dynamics shifts from outer to inner, from the go-getting, broad-lined, comfortable settings of 55 to that of streamlining and more subtly tuned in existence of 62 . . common goals get replaced by common roads (where it's ok if you get distracted looking out of the window for a while, or choose to take a slower rhythm since the marching band has stopped and it's more about the subdued but keener signs that determine the gait . .)
people of equal rank maybe turn into people of equal breath who agree because they beat like wings to an internal sameness rather than because they feed on the same external sources and exhibit a similarity of qualities . . could it be that this is what happens in passing from the exuberance of 55 to the silent momentum of 62? . .

just brain storming here . . would love to hear some feedback, good or bad it doesn't matter, I'm just wondering if this line of thought could stand . . or not!

 

[Trojina]

hi Ginnie,

). 55.1 seems like a meeting that succeeds because of the sameness of status and the common goals that are in full force . . kind of like the 'honeymoon' period maybe? (and it could be that relationships have more-than-one such periods that follow different timescales so this could take 10 days/weeks/months/years but it's always a phase that can not be maintained for ever)

. . what happens after that is 62, with all its attention to detail, it reminds me of micro-chiseling, fine-tuning . . it could be then that the flow of dynamics shifts from outer to inner, from the go-getting, broad-lined, comfortable settings of 55 to that of streamlining and more subtly tuned in existence of 62 . . common goals get replaced by common roads (where it's ok if you get distracted looking out of the window for a while, or choose to take a slower rhythm since the marching band has stopped and it's more about the subdued but keener signs that determine the gait . .)
people of equal rank maybe turn into people of equal breath who agree because they beat like wings to an internal sameness rather than because they feed on the same external sources and exhibit a similarity of qualities . . could it be that this is what happens in passing from the exuberance of 55 to the silent momentum of 62? . .

just brain storming here . . would love to hear some feedback, good or bad it doesn't matter, I'm just wondering if this line of thought could stand . . or not!

Its funny about this 'equal rank' thing because i never noticed that before, i always read it as he meets his 'lord' or 'destined ruler' . These words always meant to me it is someone or something who is a guide of some kind. I guess the idea is reinforced for me personally as the main times i have ever gotten 55.1 are about a teacher of some kind of great importance to me at the time, to whom i feel attached..or with someone I am actually working on something with, a project, a course of learning, a phase of growth...always very important but past this time of learning one cannot hang onto the connection because you come together for a specific purpose I always saw purpose as central to 55.1..out of the malestrom of 55 with all its options and directions one teams up with a certain direction often manifested as a teacher/leader/boss (husband ? hmm not sure) . I liked the idea of 55.1 also as a window of opportunity hence also possibility of missed opportunity...its a direction or purpose that has its time, has its moment. 55 is all about the moment isn't it...but i can see the 62 in 55.1 as the smaller task, the chosen timely direction/project that has its limits of course...not to miss them or over step them is important. The 62 the boundaries of the timing in 55.1

Just rambling, liked your thougths Dora, they are always so much subtler than mine lol

 

[rodaki]

thanks! . . i think they are more theoretical, subtler I'm not so sure they aren't very much coming from experience :bag: . . it seems strange to have 62 as relating, which is about a passage and see 55.1 as the be-all end-all . . obviously it can be . .

 

[Trojina]

I forgot to mention that in this case the calamity or disaster could be just a big opportunity missed from not being where the time demanded.

Ginnie to backtrack to this comment, i think it may be very relevant to your situation ? If i think back to my own experiences with 55.1 I could definately see it as a 'don't miss this opportunity' because i think 55.1 is about a valuable time . I'm forgetting what it is exactly you asked about your marriage but could it be reminding you you have specific opportunities in your relationship now that won't always be there..?

 

[bamboo]

I finally got around to looking up this word! ha. thanks bruce. i like that word. i always imagined it meant something more like the opposite

you amaze me with your vocabulary sometimes. and werent you a kid who didnt like school? self-made , self taught, the way it should be


QUOTE=meng;105471]pithy interpretation :bows:[/QUOTE]

 

[meng]

werent you a kid who didnt like school? self-made , self taught

Yup. Self made nut.

Truth is, I'd still fail basic high school, other than faking it on what I already have learned from every day life. Information has to find its way in through immediate context and need to do. The need to know doesn't exist other than how it applies. In school, many things were (are?) taught to accumulate knowledge. It's not a working match. Hard to imagine how many out there deal with this as a young 'un. If I wrote, maybe I'd write a book called "growing up stupid, waking up smart". chuckle.. but then stupid again.

 

[bamboo]

The thing is Bruce, you DO write , and very well. You write like an educated man, coupled with the fact that you have knowledge and make intelligent connections. I suspect there were a few teachers who did right by you, but it's also true that a kid who falls through the cracks of the educational system is sometimes very fortunate. escaping the brain-numbing and creativity-numbing machine.

I think that book would be great!! and boy would it be timely.

 

[meng]

Thanks, Bamboo, that's very kind of you. Actually, just for grins, I wrote over a page after posting here last night. Was fun. Maybe I'll keep going, just to see where it goes. I think you're right, it is an important subject for so many who struggle with poor grades, and parents of such students also.

excerpt..

That first Med cruise turned about to be memorable and educational for a 17 year old sailor. Only a very short while ago I was a nobody and a loser, in a world of smarter, bigger and more important people. Now, suddenly I’m at the helm of a U.S. Navy amphibious war ship, or coxoning a 9 ton LCVP landing craft.

Then, there was the ‘other education’. All I had known of sex while growing up in the US in the early 60’s was that sex was something one had to hide, and most especially for the girls and women. Now, here I am, strolling leisurely along the French Riviera. Never have I been much of a sports spectator, but volley ball took on a whole new level of significance that day.

 

[my_key]

Hi All
I've been dipping in and out of this thread, which is making some really interesting reading. Some great contributions and insights - thank you all.

I've just had come to mind a piece, I think, from "The Road less Travelled, where Mr Peck is relating about his long standing relationship amd marriage. It went through stages - something like first flush, common goals, comfortable acceptance, boredom, working through the boredom and finally wow! a hugely different relationship.

These are my words and may be off beam slightly or even completely to what he wrote, however there may be some useful parallels with this thread.
Mike

 

[ginnie]

Ginnie to backtrack to this comment, i think it may be very relevant to your situation ? If i think back to my own experiences with 55.1 I could definately see it as a 'don't miss this opportunity' because i think 55.1 is about a valuable time . I'm forgetting what it is exactly you asked about your marriage but could it be reminding you you have specific opportunities in your relationship now that won't always be there..?

Yes. Yi may be telling me to seize an opportunity, and I am just not clear about what that opportunity is. This is one of a number of times I definitely feel prompted to stop waiting and act immediately. My husband is sick again. I've been trying to take care of him for almost two weeks now, but I'm struggling along with severe back pain and walking with a cane. Is the opportunity still there, or have I flubbed it -- once again?

Thank you, Trojan. I'll ask Yi about that tomorrow. This strikes me as so important.

 

[ginnie]

If options don't exist, it's a good time to possibly consider them. If people are together it should be because they mutually want to be together, not because there's no way out.

Our outer circumstances are largely determined by forces not under our control. Most Westerners think this is a depressing thought. It is said that Easterners have a greater acceptance of fate.

 

[ginnie]

Frying the Relationship

So the shake up of 55 is necessary, but you don't necessarily want to fry the relationship.

I just love what you said: how we don't want to 'fry the relationship.'

 

[ginnie]

yes 55.1 as a window of opportunity, i'd not seen it that way before, it certainly makes sense

Maybe it's a window of opportunity in which we realize something, not a window of opportunity in which we do something in particular. Because of outer circumstances beyond my control, I feel awfully thwarted in the realm of taking actions.