Contemporary I Ching : I Ching Personas

[elvis]

The brain's method of deriving meaning from asking simple yes/no questions and layering such to get a richer meaning is a constant such that the format will elicit the same generic meanings regardless of the specific discipline that apply to the questions. Thus Jung's categories, extended into such as the MBTI or HBDI or umpteen other 'typologies', are all in the form of dichotomies we can map to yang/yin and so the I Ching. IN doing so we can acquire an "I Ching Persona" where simple questions elicit a trigram (and on to a hexagram) covering one's persona over the long term or just 'at that moment' (or you can apply them to someone else for a quick assessment of how they appear to be coming across)

The basic questions of the EIC can be used to generate a trigram persona without reference to emotions or with, that is up to you, thus the generic questions cover 'prefer' and so allow for emotional assessment or rational assessment - here we don't care about unconscious assessments :

Q1 do you prefer facts to values OR values to facts (a/b)?
Q2 do you prefer a focus on what was/is/will-be OR on what-could-have-been/is-not/could-be (a/b)?
Q3 do you prefer on being proactive, instigating, OR on being reactive, responding (a/b)?

Write done the order of answers 1,2,3 as a or b and find the order sequence for the three answers below. The answers below give us trigrams, we can double them to give us hexagrams covering generic personas reflecting the characteristics of those hexagrams in general. Finer details, more changing line possibilities per question etc give us finer distinctions of those characteristics but the above is enough to get the idea.

The below Answer matrix covers yang/yin orderings to give use the trigrams and associated hexagrams for eight classes (note there are 64 at the hexagram level, 4096 at the dodecagram level, so we can well exceed the usual 8 to 16 persona types given in other systems (including traditional astrology sign material) - and with the language nature of the I Ching identify LOTS of hard-coded details not obvious in the other systems other than through reading reams and reams of prose!):

answers - trigram nature (hexagram nature, personal 'totem')
123
aaa - heaven (01)
aab - lake (58)
aba - fire (30)
abb - thunder (51)
baa - wind (57)
bab - water (29)
bba - mountain (52)
bbb - earth (02)

Note that using the language capabilities of the EIC we can extract finer details such as 'what is the goal/outcome of this persona?' BUT to do such requires at least the hexagram level of material to be used - less than that means we lack resolution power to give details.

Chris
http://www.emotionaliching.com

 

[pantherpanther]

The astrological tradition says that “the idea of man lies in the Zodiac”.In contemporary astrological practice the vertical dimension is altogether missing.There is no sense for hierarchic structures, in the material world or ourselves.Everything is ordered horizontally .

Only a part of a human being is contained in the Zodiac, the “12 laws of the sun”. Behind the twelve signs of the Zodiac are the fixed star constellations. They are the energy columns in the galaxy, which created our sun. Their center is the center of the galaxy, what science calls a “black hole”. The Sufis called it “the sun behind the sun,” Taoists use the term "Dark Darkness" This contains the origin of man, which has been made visible through re-creation by our Sun.

Understanding is not possible without the study of cosmic structures and as every human being contains the whole cosmos, it is useless to study cosmology without self-study as well.

 

[Tohpol]

it is useless to study cosmology without self-study as well.

Perhaps you could say that for almost every discipline no? Perhaps "useless" isn't the right word though I think the quality of any process whether teaching or sand art is affected by the person's learned experiences and the understanding (or not) that colours the thought and thus the action.

Topal

 

[pantherpanther]

Perhaps you could say that for almost every discipline no? Perhaps "useless" isn't the right word though I think the quality of any process whether teaching or sand art is affected by the person's learned experiences and the understanding (or not) that colours the thought and thus the action.

Topal

Yes, if we are speaking of direct experience . Sand art may be a practice that involves direct experience for the artist. Hierarchy, the form in the whole cosmos and creation is involved and it cannot be denied . When one aspect of reality is stressed another is left out , and life is perceived as a play of opposites. When we give up our identification with our individual concepts we become under a greater law and related to the cosmic law to which humanity is subordinated. By teaching and discipline, I take you to mean one in which the individual learns to divide attention from what is observed and the observer (and therefore includes the principle of hierarchy) which is absent from elvis' system.

By the way, Topal, my response to your post about the I Ching relates to this? #161 http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?p=108874#post108874

 

[elvis]

the principle of hierarchy IS present in the system - it wont work without it - your issue is obviously not dealing with the concrete levels of the hierarchy, you start too far up in abstraction.

 

[elvis]

... and to add fuel to the fire, the identified IDM phase transition is a direct property of the hierarchy and shows the emergence of self-referencing such that we can get ANY system using the same method to self-reference

 

[pantherpanther]

the principle of hierarchy IS present in the system - it wont work without it - your issue is obviously not dealing with the concrete levels of the hierarchy, you start too far up in abstraction.

Your notion of hierarchy is not verifiable. It is purely theoretical. Consciousness and its gradations are verifiable. The I Ching gives us examples of how wise and great men acted in changing life conditions. Taoists consider that understanding is acquired through study of both cosmology and self-study,the macrocosm and microcosm. We can use a system like astrology as a guide. We can get this cosmic orientation from the order of the world hierarchy through knowledge of the energies of the Zodiac and how these work. The elements of the astrological system have validity in different worlds, which correspond to different dimensions of consciousness. There are no linear connections between different levels But through the law of analogy, we can find orientation in one system, with reference to another known system. "As above, so below."

According to Plato the world is created out of the relation between fire and earth – and “because the world is three-dimensional, it still needs two elements in between” – these are air and water. We find the same elements in the symbols of the four Evangelists: Taurus, Leo, Eagle and Man (or Angel).This the structure of the material we are composed of, we are living in and we can work with. They represent four aspects of the human being given at birth, which also have the potential of being developed as finer degrees of consciousness or bodies. A book like the I Ching can give us view from a higher place by which to navigate, like a point taken outside our immediate goal, just as sailors use a star outside our solar system or a satellite.

 

[elvis]

Your notion of hierarchy is not verifiable. It is purely theoretical.

no way - the hierarchy of the neurology is common knowledge and has been so for some time.

The IDM phase transition then identifies emergence of self-referencing as we move up the hierarchy and so from 'brain' to 'mind' etc

 

[pantherpanther]

I had used hierarchy in reference to levels of consciousness and the multiverse. The model that the human being has one brain doesn't recognize there are multiple brains and bodies in the human energy anatomy, and that other worlds have consciousness, to which humans are related and communicate with.
Language is one means of recording and transmitting ideas and thought (which are energy ) from higher worlds . So is sound one means of expressing and bringing through knowledge. An ancient language text in Sanskrit embodies in sound and words what is received and known from a different level or world, it brings it down or translates it into this world. There is a continual flow of energy from higher worlds downward and that energy is processed at each level - some continues down, some flows back. Everything interacts, everything feeds and is fed.

Astrology is one system that describes this cosmologically and relates it to human experience and functioning. Contemporary science isn't able to measure energies that are not material or work in different space/time(s). Neuroscience is only beginning to study the physical brain. Neurons are a small part of the brain, which is a "plastic" organ. We don't know why it may be shrinking, as some scientists claim. We don't why an extinct race had larger brains than homo sapiens. Scientists observing the interconnection among modules, as the perceptual, motor, evaluational, attentional, and long term memory systems in different so-called different conscious states according to the global neuronal workspace model , recognize they don't include some mental processes that are ongoing but "impervious to consciousness," that is, not connected to the neuronal workspace. There is no real scientific definition of consciousness. For some aspects of learning, developing skills, repairing functioning and so on the work of neuroscience can be of value. But it can't observe much higher functioning, as in creative work or understanding art and teachings like the I Ching .