Did I overreact? Should I give him another chance? Hex 8 UC

[dancingfox]

Hello everybody

Last weekend I had a first date with a man through an online dating platform. He didn't show up.... Which left me bewildered because I really thought we had a genuine click, I was really interested and excited and he said he felt the same way. The next morning he texted me that he was sick the other day, offering his apologies and asking for a second chance. I told him that he could have texted me the day of the date that he was sick and couldn't be there. That to leave someone hanging like that is just not respectful and that there wouldn't be a another chance for a date.

I am working on setting boundaries so I believed this was the right thing to do. I have some friends who disagree and think I was to harsh. I don't know anymore. I just never want to find myself in the same position ever again I was in last year, when I was in a toxic relationship with a man who didn't want to commit and whom I allowed over my boundaries again and again until I lost almost all sense of self worth.

If I understand correctly hex 8 unchanging is about knowing where you belong and from there making a natural, healthy connection with others.

Also the Oracle says: 'for the latecomer, pitfall'. Looks like this is pointing quite literally towards my date not showing and then texting me the next day that he was to sick to come (to late...)

So I think the Yi is telling me I was right not to give him a second chance.

What do you guys think?

 

[becalm]

Hi dancingfox

"Associating with someone. Things go well, this is not mistake - Your initial chatting online
Be well on time, if you're late things won't go well. - Him being a no show.
If you cast an oracle about the nature of this association on its first day, you will know what always will be the situation with this." This is a definite.

Speaking from my own experience - Others will treat you the way you let them treat you. If the situation had been reversed and YOU had been sick, would you have found a way to send him a message???? I'm going to assume the answer is YES.
In recent times I went on a date, the guy talked about going on another date and just gave the impression he was very, very interested. A couple of days later he pulled back and started making out it was my fault in some way. I let his BS go because he'd promised to help me out with something and I needed his help although I knew it would be nothing more from that moment.
Even the day he helped me out he kept talking about taking me out to dinner and how he'd come back around and have a glass of wine with me but of course he never did.
A couple of months later I went on a date with different guy (there's a thread on it on here somewhere) Anyway same sort of thing, non-committed to actually following through on things. So I just said See you later.....
Previous to these two men I'd let my good and trusting nature be taken advantage of.
I believe we get a chance to prove to ourselves that we definitely don't want to go back to allowing ourselves to become involved with toxic situations etc.
We will always meet these kind of men if we're single but it's up to us to Accept or Reject their behaviours towards us.

---

​

 

[dancingfox]

Hi Becalm,

Exactly! I would never wait with a message until the day after, if I were in his shoes. I also think it might be an indication of how he would treat me if we would get to know each other better. Everything on his terms... Been there done that, never again. I am sticking to my guns this time.

Thank you

 

[becalm]

Hi Becalm,

Exactly! I would never wait with a message until the day after, if I were in his shoes. I also think it might be an indication of how he would treat me if we would get to know each other better. Everything on his terms... Been there done that, never again. I am sticking to my guns this time.

Thank you

Yay!! Good on you. Yes it seems they want EVERYTHING on their terms - it's a No from me too.

 

[IrfanK]

Also the Oracle says: 'for the latecomer, pitfall'.

That would be enough for me, if I even felt the need to ask at all. Unless he says he was so sick he couldn't even pick up his phone, or he was in a coma, or something like that. I cut a bit of slack with "late," but no show is a deal breaker.

 

[moss elk]

What the guy did was disrespectful.

Though, in truth, it is only the male version of the female who spends an hour in the bathroom after her date arrives.

It's actually a technique that immature males talk about and teach each other starting at adolescence, it's manipulative,
Bro-culture.

So, you are looking at either
1-a power play
and/or
2-just an inconsiderate jerk.

That's enough info to work with.

 

[becalm]

So, you are looking at either
1-a power play
and/or
2-just an inconsiderate jerk.

That's enough info to work with.

Or a married man who either got 'cold feet' or somehow couldn't get away.....just sayin'

 

[moss elk]

Or a married man who either got 'cold feet' or somehow couldn't get away.....just sayin'

That falls under 2-

 

[steve]

Hey Dancing Fox

The advice is fairly clear, snoozers are losers.

From a guy's perspective, it's a pretty lame excuse.
He could have made up some wild tale that he was caught in a snow blizzard and ran out of gas.
In addition, he had no reception,

Also, he could say, that he was caught in a time glitch and was stuck in 1985 and not 2021. Meaning, there are a hundred ways to contact someone.
Even in bed with no money.

The cast is unchanging and is pretty blunt.
Moss Elk could well be right in that he may be trying to get an upper hand in some way.

Saying all of that, maybe if he were to really beg, possibly, you might give him another shot.
I really don't know what type of person he is. He may have had a really dumb moment. (to his own detriment)
However, I would be asking him if he was on his deathbed.

It's not a good sign, let's face it, what does your intuition tell you?
That's the real answer

Steve

 

[becalm]

That falls under 2-

Ah right....

 

[moss elk]

I find it interesting that we all came to the same conclusion, even though generally when we get 8, it means to seek the union.

But it sure feels right, doesn't it?
(particularly the part about
the Late-Comer)

 

[dancingfox]

Thanks guys for helping me see the male perspective here.

@steve I followed my intuition and told him to go... himself. I think he is a number 2 by the way
@IrfanK I know it's sad that I am questioning myself on my boundaries and basically my own instinct. As you can see I had some bad experiences in relationships. I am working on it though.
@moss elk Yes would you say that the manipulative part/ powerplay comes back somewhere in the imagery of Hex 8 or was that just (really sound) advice from you to me

 

[moss elk]

would you say that the manipulative part/ powerplay comes back somewhere in the imagery of Hex 8 or was that just (really sound) advice from you to me

No, but the mention of the latecomer stands out. (I seem to recall he was executed?) It shows unfitness for the task and lack of commitment.

 

[steve]

Hey Guys,

My experiences with hexagram 8 are not always so positive or the situation is not. If you take a look at the unchanging hexagram section here on the forum. Many people's experiences are not either. There is one story of a girl being pulled over by a cop. It turns out the cop was just trying to get her number.
The car's engine weirdly bursts into flames and she dodges a bullet.

In that case, he was forcing union and it was rejected. That's another manipulative type of situation. Perhaps it's something we should look for having received the cast.

On a lighter note:

Do you guys remember the Seinfeld episode where George was manipulating this lady that played the piano. It was all about him getting hand as he called it (upper hand). Basically, she knew he was going to break up with him. So he broke up with her first, she not liking the rejection. Agreed to his crazy demands to keep the relationship going. For example, she had to think of him every time she performed on the piano.

In the end, she worked out what he was doing and she broke up with him. Then he started saying "but I've got hand" Then she said " yea and you are going to need it"

Who knows Dancing Fox you may have dodged a bullet too.

Steve

 

[dfreed]

I think enough of us 'guys' have weighed in here ... however, being a guy, I have one more super, very important genius thing to add -

I wonder how much fear had something to do with this guy bailing on you? I'm not offering it as an excuse, but only as a possibility: after all, even us guys can be afraid of first dates - though we sometimes go to get lengths to hide our fear!

What brings this possibility to mind - besides that I'm a guy - is the fact that the upper trigram is Water - which I associate with strong emotions, including fear; and also Richard Rutt's translation of Hex. 8, includes:

"... Coming from unsubjugated lands,
for those who arrive late: disastrous."

And 'unsubjugated lands' reminds me of a perhaps wild, or even fearful place (to be coming from).

Best, D

 

[dancingfox]

Hi D,

Fear might have played a role and maybe arrogance was his attempt to hide it.

Unsubjugated lands... English isn't my first language so would think unsubjugated would mean something like 'untamed' or wild, yes!

 

[rosada]

This made me so mad I wrote a suggestion for how you might respond to his request to arrange for another meeting (and I think his excuse that he was "sick" sounds totally bogus):

"Dear _____,
I have to admit I was disappointed when you didn't show the other night and I hope you will understand why I don't wish to continue with this friendship. Had you decided to ghost me because something more interesting came up or because you simply forgot, that I could understand, but for you to become so ill you couldn't even text me a two word "must cancel" message tells me you are in no shape to be thinking about dating or even meeting new people. I do hope you eventually recover, but meanwhile I must look out for myself and associate only with those who are healthy enough to keep their word."

That made me feel better but then I thought maybe I should try to 'take the higher road" and so I asked the I Ching to give me a reason why you should give him another chance. I got 14.1.2.3.4 - 23. Possession in Great Measure changing to 23. Splitting Apart. I think that's saying nope, you're better off splitting!

 

[dancingfox]

Hi Rosada!

I responded almost in kind! A bit less witty and just a bit more bitchy
As Steve mentioned I get the feeling I might have dodged a bullet with this guy. Your reading just confirmed my decision, and thank you for caring and making me laugh so much

 

[Albatross]

That to leave someone hanging like that is just not respectful and that there wouldn't be a another chance for a date.

I think that a important part from the Yi, it is that you must respect the decision you took. "Holding Together brings good fortune." (Hex. 8) In this date the thing that you should be notice it is not the behavior of the guy but the way you want to be treated. To have "healthy connection with others" you should have a good relation with yourself, "holding together". Attach to your decision.

 

[dancingfox]

Hi Albatross, very true. And when you have a good relationship with yourself you also know where you belong.

 

[dfreed]

Fear might have played a role and maybe arrogance was his attempt to hide it.

You may be right. However, for me it is interesting to explore the notion of how much fear plays a part in our lives: many counselors and therapist think of anger - and maybe arrogance - as 'secondary' emotions, where the underlying emotion is fear.

E.g. is it possible that it was fear that kept him from showing up, and further (even more) fear that also kept him from fessing up as to why he didn't show up in the first place? And this seems to correspond with Water, the upper trigram, which can be about fear .... or fear of 'going with the flow (of one's emotions)'.

Just a thought (and not an excuse). Best, D

 

[DebMcCarter]

Very well said, dfreed, and why compassion is needed even when you decide not to engage for your personal reasons. We are all struggling. (*;*)

 

[Amaterasu]

I generally concur with the posts on this. Iching totally aside, standing a person up on a first date is a major red flag. Good on the yi for stating the obvious (re latecomers), but yeah, any healthy and well-adjusted person worth your time will at least bother to contact you first before failing to show up.

As dancingfox stated, it may be the case that this person has some hang ups that need dealing with (fear, etc), but ask yourself first if you’re really in a position to get into a relationship with someone who needs that level of healing. If, as you said, you’re at that phase where you need to learn to set boundaries, then honor yourself and do so without regret.

 

[dancingfox]

Very well said, dfreed, and why compassion is needed even when you decide not to engage for your personal reasons. We are all struggling. (*;* Deb,

Hi Deb,
as much as I am a compassionate woman. I am also a woman who needs to learn how to set boundaries because I have tons and tons of empathy. In the past I attracted men who tended to cross my boundaries because I kept allowing it. I wasn’t planning on sharing this because it happened a couple of days later after he stood me up and I didn’t think it was relevant to this thread. But...
I did give him a a chance to explain himself with no judgement from my part, at first. He then asked for another chance for a date. I asked him to give me one decent reason to give him such a chance. He said he wanted to have sex with me. A lot of it and preferably right away.
Now I am working on being compassionate with myself and even forgiving my exes for what happened in the past. I understand that this is the key for me to having healthy relationships from here on.
This man doesn’t need compassion at this moment. He just needs a good kick in the butt. Really.

 

[Amaterasu]

This man doesn’t need compassion at this moment. He just needs a good kick in the butt. Really.

I’m so sorry dancingfox. I just realized I referred to your reply (as the OP) when I meant to refer to dfreed’s comment about the fear thing.

 

[dancingfox]

I’m so sorry dancingfox. I just realized I referred to your reply (as the OP) when I meant to refer to dfreed’s comment about the fear thing.

No problem Amaterasu

 

[diamant]

He then asked for another chance for a date. I asked him to give me one decent reason to give him such a chance. He said he wanted to have sex with me. A lot of it and preferably right away.

Wow, I hereby name him a------ of the year.
No need to understand why he behaves with such depravity, no need to 'forgive'.
Much more useful to apply your energy into recognising and kicking them away sooner.

 

[becalm]

This man doesn’t need compassion at this moment. He just needs a good kick in the butt. Really.

Sorry I don't want to be a grammar nazi but I think you spelt butt wrong - using it in this sentence it should be spelt b alls.....just sayin'

 

[moss elk]

I asked him to give me one decent reason to give a chance. He said he wanted to have sex with me. A lot of it and preferably right away.

What a charmer, eh?
He's #1 and #2

 

[dancingfox]

Sorry I don't want to be a grammar nazi but I think you spelt butt wrong - using it in this sentence it should be spelt b alls.....just sayin'

Sorry English is not my first language... Aaaand oooh! I was just really slow with this one