Help please! When the Shadow Site hexagram = Inner Change Operator hexagram ??

[F K Ander]

Hello all:

I'm very confused as to how to interpret the following:
I asked Change to help me with strengthening the relationship I have with a friend who is very special and dear to me. The given hexagram: 14 , with changing lines at 1 and 4

I'm a big fan of Karcher, so I'm using his terminology here, there might be other ways of expressing this but regardless:
As lines 1 and 4 are changing, this creates the 'Inner' Change Operator of hexagram 51
The Shadow Site of 14, however, is also 51.

I don't know how to reconcile these apparent incongruities. Unless I'm mistaken, the Inner / Inspirational Operator describes the inner transformative aspect of a situation, while the Shadow is what is counter-indicated at the moment.

Any help with interpretation or analysis is much appreciated, it would mean a lot for me to understand this.
Thanks in advance

 

[bradford]

I fear you may be in over your head.
Why don't you try a traditional interpretation first?

 

[sooo]

It's always been over mine. It's not that I can't make sense of it somehow, but I doubt its stability as a 100% reliable factor. Kind of like a Fan Yao. But I could be wrong.

 

[bradford]

It's always been over mine. It's not that I can't make sense of it somehow, but I doubt its stability as a 100% reliable factor. Kind of like a Fan Yao. But I could be wrong.

As I've tried to explain, Fan Yao was never meant to be used for divination. Only for translation.


But the bottom line here is that all of these dimensions of interpretation that people have been making up out of the blue since the Han Dynasty are not germane or fundamental to the interpretation of the Zhouyi text. This includes the ideas found in the Ten Wings and even such later ideas as Yin and Yang. It's OK to use them for what they might have to offer, but it's better if you begin with the simpler, basic, original text first, and recognize that these afterthoughts are just that, there to see what might be added to the real thing. They are not essential.

 

[sooo]

Yes, I got that. In fact I thought you had coined the term, Fan Yao, yourself, and clearly stated, it's (in my term) not entirely reliable for divination. And the same would apply to (what I thought was) your transitional reading style of interpretation.

 

[bradford]

And the same would apply to (what I thought was) your transitional reading style of interpretation.

I have to recognize the transitional gua (changing one line at a time from bottom up) as being as artificial a method as any of Karcher's ideas. I mainly go to it when there are big contradictions between individual lines. I still try to get whatever I can from the original methods first.

 

[russell]

Not to contradict any of the above, but just some possible ways of looking at the situation:
1. could the inner transformative aspect of the situation be something to be avoided in this case? Feelings of shock/thunder/earthquake may not be in fact the best thing to go by.
2. the shadow site is an artifact of the King Wen order. Not to start an argument, but I don't think that it came from divine revelation. The anti-hexagram, which is the transformed hexagram with all the lines reversed in polarity, or the base hexagram with all the unchanging lines changed (same thing), to me is more intuitive: the direction that change is not pointing in. Hexagram 17 in this case.

—Russell
russellcottrell.com/VirtualYarrowStalks/

 

[F K Ander]

Thank you

I apologize for being unable to respond until now, but I do express my gratitude to you guys for responding.

@Bradford, I'm a huge fan, it was a nice surprise to hear your comments. Have you found these extra tools extraneous from experience, or just unnecessary to explore to begin with, ..? How to rectify life's process of evolving, changing, with each moment containing the totality of the last, datum built upon datum until there is unstoppable exponential growth etc. etc. with an exclusively strict adherence to the fundamentals, wouldn't the path of the former lead back to the Source eventually, maybe even at a higher wavelength? Interested in hearing your thoughts on this.
*Straying from topic, I know...

Anyways, an answer for this did finally hit me all of a sudden very unexpectedly, and quite perfectly, it was very much an 'a-ha!' moment, remarkably apropos, in a way which made a lot of sense to me in this situation. Just to conclude

Thanks again to all

 

[bradford]

The properties of binary systems are as infinitely complex as those of decimal systems, and the Yi, being binary, can be made to cover them all. It is easy for people to get lost on theses bypaths, to spend all of their time there, and a lot of people do, beginners as well as experts. Meanwhile, the main paths have decades worth of wisdom to teach if we don't let ourselves get distracted. There is a real danger of going at the Yi "a mile wide and an inch deep." I think it's better to stay in the deeper channels, where the original authors were. These were enough to allow them to write the book. They ought to be enough to allow you to figure it out.

 

[Liselle]

@FKAnder, would you be willing to share your "a-ha!" answer with us, if you could do it without revealing more than you want to about the situation with your friend? After reading all this, I'm curious...such light-bulb moments are usually interesting...

 

[sooo]

"The anti-hexagram, which is the transformed hexagram with all the lines reversed in polarity, or the base hexagram with all the unchanging lines changed (same thing), to me is more intuitive: the direction that change is not pointing in. —Russell"

That's interesting, especially that it feels more intuitive.