Hex 35

[candida]

What in the world is Hexagram 35 referring to when it says, "He shall receive this great blessing from his grandmother"? In a general context, I mean. Does this mean that a persons' grandmother has left a legacy, a curse or something?

 

[cheiron]

Hi Candid

Here is one approach to it? I?m afraid for me it is one of those where I can only approach it by cutting the frog up and then trying to see the whole in the parts

Following the trans. of Willhelm:

?Then one obtains great happiness from ones ancestress?

The ruler of the Hx is the yin in the 5th position a yang place. So here we have nurturing ruler set around with supportive elements. It should be a disastrous position but being in the centre of Li (Brightness) it is appropriate.

The inner trigram earth is in full service. Thus all is generally very good? if your not a hamster?

The nature of the ruler is to give blessings and honour to those who serve. (See Judgment / or Image in Risema - Karcher)

Your line is central to this well placed serving trigram, K ?un? which beautifully nurtures the nurturing ruler. The central (second line) is best placed of them all as it is in the middle, a point of balance. Indeed this position naturally forms a relationship with the 5th line. Even better! As such the ruler is bound to give great honours and blessings to such a one.

So here we have Li inspirationally growing out of the earth with its key attendant the honoured third line nurturing and serving the growth, the progress?

So why grandmother?

Willhelm Bk.3? ?(this) appears under the image of the ancestress, because according to ancient custom the grandson was associated with the grandfather not with the father. Both lines being weak, the images here are feminine ? the grandson?s wife and the ancestress.? ? I struggle with this comment!

To widen it all out a bit? (Bus or Yi) Ancestress, for me indicates, spiritual or as nicely put by Louise earlier (I think that is right apologies if not) something that we have internalised from our mother grandmother? a value, belief or way of doing perceiving.

Switching to Ritsema ? Karcher:
Kingly mother to me indicates, I think quite reasonably, the Yin ruling in the 5th place ? A Queen.

Well, it?s a stab at it anyway?

Hope it helps

--Kevin

 

[cheiron]

oops - that should have read 'honoured second line'

--Kevin

 

[cheiron]

ohh, more errors!

Hi Candida

My eyesight must be going!

sorry

--Kevin

 

[cheiron]

Candida? I?ve made a bit of a mess of this? sorry.

I wrote it, mistakenly, to Candid? and he is better read than I, hence the odd comments.

(You may be too? but I will flesh it out anyway? it is such a beautiful image)

The hexagram is fire rising out of earth? Consciousness; light giving; articulating; something which draws people and enlightens them - being fed by earth ? nurturing, growing ? An image which is, I think, deeply beautiful.

It represents ?Proceeding Forward? according to Huang. I don?t think he does it justice with this name.

Ritsema / Karcher translate it as ?Prospering?

Wilhelm points out that that there are three hexagrams relating to growth and progression and this is the most potent.

The ruler here is the 5th line, a Queen, which is leading the process be it spiritual or whatever.

The second line is the feeder to the Queen, the one which is supportive of the process.

The nature of the Queen is to bestow blessings on those about her who are helping.

Find the Queen and you will know the source of the blessings?

Having said this the blessings will come anyway? it is unnecessary to seek them out.

The blessings could be anything from cash through promotion or spiritual things? but they are good!

It seems to me that the recipient of this Hx. may be involved in a wonderful process

Sorry to have made a mess of this.

--Kevin

 

[cal val]

Candida...

Is your question about a relationship? Or a business partnership? Are you having a problem communicating with someone and want to know why? Are you not getting the recognition you want? Feeling sad about it?

Go with the sadness. Let it emanate from you. In time, someone will show you affection and show you the way, give you the nurturing that Cheiron spoke of. It may not be the way you imagine now, but you will be happy and fulfilled, nonetheless.

Ciao for now,

Val

 

[cal val]

Candida,

I just thought of something. If that was your only changing line, that's basically the message. If you have changing lines above it, then it's a different story. I'd love to know exactly what you got.

Cheerio the noo,

Val

 

[cheiron]

Well. Now with a paper bag firmly pulled over my head.

Better that I correct myself now? couldn?t sleep for wondering about the mention of sadness in the line?

So I had a look a Richard Lynn?s translation.

Candida, you have perhaps made one of the most eloquent comments of the day? synchronicity or beautiful subtlety?

A website was withdrawn earlier today? It?s mark was ?Calling Crane in the Shadow?

From Lynn on Hx.35 line two: (translating Wang Bi 226 ? 249 CE)

?The second Yin advances but receives no response from the fifth Yin? this is why the text says ?Now advancing now saddening?

He goes on to point out because of the very good conduct of this line/person (Constancy and service despite all) he (sic) ?receives here great blessings from his departed grandmother?

So there is an element of blessings from outwith he situation be it spiritual or other.

For some reason this hexagram does not obey the rules (Ruler and line relationships etc)? well some don?t.

Possibly my mistake was seeing the 5th Yin as a Queen rather than a weak ruler of either sex?which is more Lynn?s sense of it.

And the great eloquence? Lynn also says of this line??A Calling Crane in the Shadows, its young answer it.?? One establishes his sincerity in obscurity but even in obscurity would have response to it.?

This is still a very positive line.

As I was writing this Val posted? She seems to have got straight to the nub.

Meanwhile I shall keep this bag on my head

--Kevin

 

[cal val]

Cheiron...

Oh Cheiron, you're brilliant. This line is just how I feel about the loss of that website.

And I just linked to it last night from my own and tried to send a friend there today. I was so excited about it's beauty and it's message. It's the perfect way, I think, to introduce a friend to the Yijing.

I just hope he reconsiders when his pain subsides.

Sadly,

Val

 

[anita]

I too have had recent experience with this line in hex 35 and its predictions are still unfolding. I have 'fallen from grace' in the temple after 5 years of being a sort of priestess in the most important of ceremonies because of an error on my part. The error however does not require such extremes of punishment and this the Queen Grandmother knows -- and despite my problems, I have Her - the Great Mother's blessings -- who is the Source of all. I have sure signs of this and have realised that while the Path I follow is the most powerful and beautiful of all, those who run it can make errors. But the Path is beyond human error and because I continue to practise the Way, I'm fine. I no longer need the rituals and the ceremonies because my foundation is strong enough. In fact on two occasions I have received this same moving line when asking about this event that has deeply shocked me and turned my life around. I have ofcourse repented for my error and corrected it.

Hope this throws some light on your situation, Candida.

Best for Your Quest

Anita

 

[candid]

Candida, Sometimes we seem to separate from ourselves. We feel disconnected from the source of our being. Unrelated. But nevertheless, if our heart is intent on the good of all (all sentient beings), though we are in sorrow over this, we move toward progress anyway. Then, as though with grand-maternal love, the way becomes clear once again. Not through intellectualizing or fatherly discipline, but with the touch of love that only an understanding grand-mother could know and provide.

 

[candid]

I had a thought last night, which really relates to LiSe's rendition of 35 - Quiver of arrows. I was going to email her with it but here's an appropriate place to mention it.

Each arrow is a usuable tool. Emotion is an arrow. As is our personality. Our intellect is another. Any artistic ability or apptitude. Each arrow enables us to make Progress.

LiSe's work is such an incredible springboard to further understanding of Yi and of ourselves. But then, those who uses her resources already know this.

 

[hilary]

Here is an example from Wu Jing Nuan about this line - I think it's the only personal divination he shares in all his wonderful and intriguing Yijing.

"Early in my career as a Chinese medical practitioner a patient came to me with a very difficult illness. In the course of treatment my normal methods seemed to desert me, then my timing and technique both changed dramatically. The patient recovered. All of this happened in the space of three weeks. When I asked Yi Jing what had happened, I received [this line]. In Chinese tradition, when you call on your ancestral spirits they will answer and help you. I blessed my maternal grandmother for both me and my patient."

I also have a question for LiSe about the arrows. What are the chances that they're not arrows in a quiver, but arrows fired at the sun?

 

[candida]

Thank you all for the wonderful bits of insight into Hex 35. I agree with all of you because everything you've said seems highly plausible to me, of course; I suppose I Ching really does know.
I really enjoy the idea of "the blessing of the grandmother(grandfather) being the Queen or spiritual advisor of our soul comforting us.
At least I think this is what you are all trying to say to me.

 

[anita]

Further proof of blessings on my path despite my error. I have struggled with blame and non-blame and realised that what seems harsh measures to me is required at this time to shock me out of my ignorance. Yesterday Guruji herself summoned me to the temple and when I went there she told me I had to go back because the senior sanyasin wasn't in. So I cheerfully did. Cheerfully because I'm now even more sure that they are only testing my faith. And so I will keep going in sorrow but blessed.

Best for your Quest

Anita

 

[candid]

Anita, sorrow is an arrow too, and a valuable tool. Just as you said, to shock us out of our ignorance, and to awaken our priorities.

Hilary, could you elaborate on arrows fired on the sun? Intriguing visual but I don't understand the metaphor.

 

[hilary]

Ah, Candid, you'll never guess, you need to read the Mandate of Heaven! There is a myth, according to Marshall younger than the Zhouyi, that Yi the archer (no relation...) saved the world from being burned to a cinder when all ten suns rose into the sky at once, by shooting down nine of them. Marshall thinks that the original story might have been that Yi shot not nine suns, but the three-legged crow that was eating the sun and causing a solar eclipse.

He connects this story with hexagram 36 and its mysterious bird. But respecting Karcher's insight into the importance of the Pairs of hexagrams, and seeing those arrows in Hexagram 35, I just wonder what might be happening here... Which is why I need LiSe to help sort out what is possible and what is my fevered imagination!

 

[candid]

10 suns? Ok you got me - what do the 10 suns symbolize?

 

[gene]

Since Anita is a Saggitarian, I guess the image of the arrow is somewhat appropriate. Today I received hexagram 55. Be not sad, be like the noon day sun. Sorrow, but blessed. Yes, Anita, I do believe you are blessed. Sometimes though, I think you are too hard on yourself. But maybe not. You can decide.

Gene

 

[gene]

Oh, and thinking of Marshall's story, number 55 is the eclipse of the sun.

Gene

 

[gene]

I think the story of shooting down the suns parallels to a certain extent the greek myth of Zeus's son who wanted to drive the suns chariot across the sky, but the suns power was too much for him, and he could not control the reigns, in which case the sun zigzaged and took its own course in the sky, and almost burnt the earth. At least that is the jist of it. Coincidence? Maybe, maybe not, Hexagram 35 is about the sun rising in the sky, and 55, the sun is at its zenith. Where does it go from there? Well, maybe the sky crow eats it up, but it returns each morning. I may have to do a study now on arrows in the Yi Jing. It has got my curiosity. Two places not already mentioned come to mind. Hexagram 21, bites through meat and receives a golden arrow, and #62. One shoots an arrow and hits him who is in the cave. I am sure these ideas have a great deal of symbolism that has been lost over the ages. Jesus was supposedly born in a cave, and Plato said we are creatures, who see only the shadows as those in a cave would see them.

Gene

 

[anita]

Thanks Candid and Gene.

Candid, I agree with you totally. Sorrow is the arrow that gets straight to the point of ignorance. At one time Gene, I just couldn't be too hard on myself. I think the time has come though to be...but not for too long, not for too long. Yesterday when I entered the temple, I was sent out again by Itsuko but Sensei smiled at me and said 'See you'.

Best for your Quest
Anita

 

[pedro]

Hilary, I havent read Marshall's book, but it occurred to me that in order to see an eclipse in hex 36, you have to take into account the trigrams seing the sun in the lower at least. That would require the association to have been made long after king wen and his son's times, not in a pre-zhouyi age. Am I missing something or does he go into any detail about that? (I know: "read the book!!!")

 

[pedro]

Gene wrote: "I may have to do a study now on arrows in the Yi Jing. It has got my curiosity. Two places not already mentioned come to mind. Hexagram 21, bites through meat and receives a golden arrow, and #62. One shoots an arrow and hits him who is in the cave. I am sure these ideas have a great deal of symbolism that has been lost over the ages. Jesus was supposedly born in a cave, and Plato said we are creatures, who see only the shadows as those in a cave would see them."

Arrows are also mentioned in 40 line 2, and also indirectly in line 6 where the prince shoots a falcon. Also in 56:5 you get to shoot something. Bows and arrows are mentioned in 38, in the appended commentaries, but the connection seems far fetched

About caves, there is also a lot of references in the Yi. Do they have some special meaning, appart from being hiding places, as well as refuges, and somewhat obscure places?

 

[gene]

I wish I knew if there were some special meaning apart from being hiding places.

Gene

 

[candid]

Gene - For 36? I think of it more as protecting than hiding. My hot water heater's pilot light blew out last night in the heavy wind. Had the small flame been better protected, its light wouldn't have been extinguished, and I'd be enjoying a hot shower right now.

 

[gene]

Geez, Candid, sorry about the hot water situation. Has it been getting hot in AZ yet? I know it can really get hot in southern AZ in the summer. If so, put your water out in the summer sun...Well, maybe I am not being too funny. Sorry about the shower situation. I think protection is part of the reason the superior man in #36 hides his light yet still shines. It has been a curious phenomenon on this planet that when too large a population starts getting too enlightened, they seem to get killed off. Case in point is the Cathar's in France. Questionable whether it was the French government or the Catholic church that was behind it, but it certainly happened, And in more recent times the brutal treatment of the Tibetan monks. After all, enlightened people tend to sit around in CAVES and meditate, and don't pay a lot of money in taxes, etc. But I am getting too far afield here. There is a protection of the light going on so that it is not extinguished. The superior man still shines though as it is the nature of enlightened man to have an unmistakable aura about him. On a different forum I once compared this image to the Hermit card in the Tarot, and one lady just kept saying it wasn't a fair comparison. It appeared she was intent on having a debate about it which I just do not do. Finally she gave up. True, in the Tarot card the lamp is not hidden, but he is on a mountain where few dare to go. Well, hopefully you can have your shower soon, Candid.

Gene

 

[pedro]

Well, I beg to differ. I see the hermit being more like 52. The hermit is indeed in a cave, but he has also left human concerns behind, he is saturn, not the best buddy to go out on a saturday night. His goal is to attain enlightenment, and he does that by leaving the world behind (hence 52)
In 36 the concern is very much with human affairs, there is a need to hide your qualities, but that is only a consequence of the moment. Eventually there must be a resurgence, when the time is right to overthrow the bad influences one is escaping by 36.
I dont know what card of the tarot would suit 36, nor do I think such correspondances can be made except for few cases. If one is dealing with two symbolic systems of a different cardinal (64 vs 21+1), when both suposely encompass the whole cosmos, there can be no straight one to one relationship, with meanings being scattered between several symbols. But this is just pointing the obvious...

 

[heylise]

Arrows or birds or lingams (phalluses), and a container or the sun or a mouth or a support or a yoni. Nobody mentions the phallus and yoni (what is the counterpart of phallus?) anywhere, so maybe they are sheer imagination. But the Marquis of Kang mated his horses three times a day ..
In some old characters the arrows don?t look like arrows, but certainly nowhere as birds. They might be ?arrows hitting something?: with a horizontal line at their point. One character shows a kind of vase below them, but on most it looks like a sun, and on some like a mouth with a line in it.
The support would mean that the arrows or whatever is being presented.
In most two-character words it has the meaning of going on audience, or receiving a promotion, especially into nobility.

Hilary?s idea of the sun being shot is not entirely impossible, I think. Nobody knows what it is for sure, after all these character date from 1000nds of years back, so go ahead, imagine. Until someone finds out what it really is, they are free game, as long as nobody imposes his idea as being the truth.
Meanings: Oracle-Bones meaning not clear. Advance, progress, grow bigger, promote, being awarded a dignity, raise oneself; hold back, to moderate, restrain (horses), copper ornament at foot of lance, name of a state, of a fief and of two dynasties.
Exchangeable with same char. with radical hand: fix to belt, make penetrate, fix in or to, restrain, incline, with respect. Jinjian (jin-see): go on audience, jinsheng (jin-advance, char. of hex.46): promote.
(a radical is a part of a character which specifies the meaning)

(And about Saturn: Saturday is called after him, because it is the perfect day for wild parties. The Saturnalia were quite hot)

LiSe

 

[hilary]

Argh, LiSe, it's not my idea! The whole idea that Yi shot a bird eating the sun is a Marshall original. Don't ever call it my idea!!