Hex 42.4 > 25 - pursing a possible romance

[BlackSwan]

Hi all,

I hope you are all keeping well.

So I met a lovely man on a trip away a few weeks ago.
We have kept in touch, messaging back & forth, all very positive & very encouraging. We have both expressed an interest in seeing each other again. In fact the only thing that's stopping us at the moment is the fact that we both live in different countries.

So I asked: I feel good about this - should I pursue? And got Hex 42.4 changing to 25.

I see this as a very positive reading but not sure what the changing line is warning & the resulting hex?

Any input is greatly appreciated!

 

[diamanda]

Hello,
I'd say if one of you is prepared to move to the country where the other one lives, then yes, great.
However, the resulting 25 (no sex) points to the possibility that none of you wants to do that.
If by 'pursue' you mean move to where he is, then I'd say go for it!

 

[BlackSwan]

Thanks diamanda!

It's a particularly apt result as I feel things with him are genuine, relaxed, free, nothing seems forced between us. I was reading 25 as maintain that openness, that innocence, go with the flow! Not to think to much, enjoy it & let it happen.

But does the initial 42 speak of acting now while the opportunity is there & fresh? Like riding that wave! I was already considering planning a trip over there in the coming weeks.

And by pursuing I meant actively see where this goes, with visiting each other & stuff, the fact that he lives in another country doesn't seem to bother me, nor him
A move certainly wouldn't be out of the question for me, in fact it would be welcoming! Although maybe a little more complicated as I have a young daughter but I'm just getting to know him so I'll cross that bridge when I come to it.

 

[BlackSwan]

Yikes I just seen you said no sex rather than hex! That's concerning

 

[BlackSwan]

Well my flights are booked for 3wks time......so lets see where this little adventure takes me!

 

[Fern_of_the_woods]

it would be great to have an update : )

 

[canislulu]

Newbie 21 ---- May we have an update?

 

[BlackSwan]

Hi all, sorry about the delay!!

All had been going well the last few months, both of us flying over & back to each other. He really is the sweetest guy! One or two cultural misunderstandings but nothing major...or so I thought.

Just under 2 weeks ago he spent a few days with me & then I flew back over to his country to spend the weekend with him. All was going amazing in my country but when we were in his (only seems to happen in his country) he misread things I did or said & took offence or thought I meant something else. I always try to talk about it with him, make sure he understands what I actually mean so there's no weirdness or miscommunication, and then move on happy.
Then one night over the weekend, we were at a concert, having a great time, he was telling me how much he loved me & he'd like to start planning our future together, it was really lovely.
Then a few drinks in he said something I found a bit insulting about my personality, obviously stemming from one of our previous miscommunication, he laughed it off, but it happened a further 3 times that night which obviously annoyed me & I wanted to nip it in the bud so I tried to talk to him about it. He was having none of it & we got into an argument which escalated & lets just say I got to see his dark side

So we broke up. He says it's a personality clash (he still hasn't understood the miscommunication & doesn't like thar I'm well able to stand up for myself!) but for me it was his uncalled for response during the argument. I still don't understand how someone can be so in love & wanting to plan a future with you then the nxt day nope don't like your personality! Even when we were saying goodbye at the airport he was telling me he loved me & had wanted to move in with me & have kids! Needless to say I don't know what to think anymore.

So i asked: "what should I do with regards to him?" And got 4.1.3 > changing to 26

I am taking from line 1 that he needs to learn from this (or is it me?) & line 3 not to lose myself or who I am to him?
I am not sure about the resulting hex 26? Again it speaks of crossing the big river which seems to be a pattern with both readings I've done regarding him.

Any interpretations would be greatly appreciated!

 

[canislulu]

4.1.3 < 26

Hi Newbie,

Thanks for the update.
One thing I notice about your reading is that your experience seems related to part of the text connected with Hexagram 4 in general, i.e.

The first consultation speaks clearly. The second and third pollute the waters. Polluted, and hence not speaking. --- from translation in Wikiwing

This seems to mirror what you said happened at the concert. The first time he speaks to you about loving you and wanting to spend the future with you. Then the second and third communications you perceived as insults about your personality. These insults "polluted the waters" of his statement of love and now you are not speaking.

It is possible for someone to love a person but not to like certain of their behaviors. He wasn't necessarily saying he didn't like your entire personality (which likely has many aspects --- some of which he must love as he is wanting to spend a future with you) . Rather he was mentioning one thing that was troubling him. I am not sure it is possible to have a relationship in which our partner likes everything about us all of the time.

So what to do? I like your understanding of line 1 about learning from the experience. Both of you can learn something from the experience.

I also think it is interesting that the relating figure of the question you asked back in the summer was 25 and now the relating figure is 26. I'm not sure what that means, but I find it interesting. At the beginning you proceeded with "Innocence" (H 25), "Increasing" (H42) your involvement. Now you are proceeding with "Great Restraint" (H 26) , "Not Knowing" (H 4) what to do.

Do you think perhaps the alcohol loosened his tongue in a harmful way?

For me, I wouldn't throw a relationship away simply because someone insulted me. People we like and love are bound to occasionally insult us. He is after all, human and not "a man of bronze". (line 3)

I would sit with "Not Knowing" and let this reading continue to speak to you as you hold back. What are you learning from this experience?

 

[BlackSwan]

Thanks jumpingmouse!

To be clear for me the breakup isn't over the insult that night, in fact I had wanted to talk about it & see where it had come from. For me it was the resulting argument where he got particularly nasty & dark & it really shocked & upset me, still does. It has made me feel do I really know this person at all?

For him the breakup is a personality clash...this seems to stem from miscommunications or misunderstandings of conversations or situations we've had. For example one cultural miscommunication about a month ago, I figured it out quite quickly that things were done slightly differently in both of our countries, that we had just got our wires crossed; explained to him, he wouldn't listen the first time, explained again the nxt morning he said he understood, then the following night he picked a fight out of nowhere over nothing, obviously I got annoyed & put my foot down stating that it was totally uncalled for & only in that moment did he understand the miscommunication from the previous night! He had still thought what he originally thought & that's why he childishly picked a fight over nothing! He then again brought up this very miscommunication in this argument 2 weeks ago! So he still doesn't get it, which is very frustrating!

After that first miscommunication I've always told him to stop me there & then if he doesn't understand or is offended by something I say; that way we can iron it out as it happens & not let it fester & gather with time into something that it's not. I get the impression that whatever his initial thoughts are of a situation are the ones he keeps & won't budge on. He's quite stubbron like that, & even though he's older seem quite immature & sheltered...which is why I think Hex 4 (youthful folly) is in reference to him.

Also there seems to be a reoccurring theme of having to go over things twice, three times (line 1)
I wonder is this line referring to him having to learn to see things from other perspectives not just his first understanding of a situation? Line 1 also speaks of disciplining the student but not harshly - I wonder is this telling me to make clear to him that what he did that night (during the escalated fight) was unacceptable & uncalled for, point out that his view of these personality traits that he's accusing me of are stemming from all these previous miscommunications (that I thought had be dealt with) that I do care for him but maybe he needs to take a step back & view things for what they really are?

I really feel line 3 is telling me not to throw myself at him or give in to his perception of me because of him misreading things. Let him come to me, be wooed once again.

Which brings it to Hex 26, hold fast, restrain, "containment of potential" maybe let it build once again so it can return to the "Innocence" of the previous Hex 25?

I'm a bit unsure about how to read the resulting Hex 26, there seems to be contradictory info out there on it. I see it as hold your power, be the leader but not in a controlling way, in a subtle, softer way......which would bring it back stuff he was saying about my personality - I'm quite passionate & head-strong & would be vocal if I see an injustice or wrongdoing & very forward in trying to resolve any issues (like the miscommunicatios), whereas he's very laid back & would shy away from dealing with things, or run away instead of having to face things.
Maybe my lesson here is to restrain my own strength!

 

[canislulu]

Line 1 also speaks of disciplining the student but not harshly - I wonder is this telling me to make clear to him that what he did that night (during the escalated fight) was unacceptable & uncalled for, point out that his view of these personality traits that he's accusing me of are stemming from all these previous miscommunications (that I thought had be dealt with) that I do care for him but maybe he needs to take a step back & view things for what they really are?

I really feel line 3 is telling me not to throw myself at him or give in to his perception of me because of him misreading things. Let him come to me, be wooed once again.

These all sound like good insights to take from the reading in terms of how to proceed.

And I am also wondering if there is something about the "protecting" aspect of Hexagram 4 --- That Yi is advising you to protect yourself. Letting him know about what kind of behavior you will not accept is a way to do this. And not giving in to his misperceptions of you is another way.

Are you familiar with the "transitional line" method that Bradford describes in his work and Ashteroid employs here in shared reading? I believe if you were to use that method your reading would look something like:

4.1 > 41.3 > 26.

I don't have the capacity that Ashteroid has for drawing out the hexagrams which looks so nice.
I also don't have a lot of experience with readings to know how reliable of a method it is --- but it makes sense to me. And so looking at the text for line 41.3 --- may it apply somehow to your situation? Is there a possibility that there is a third person in the situation that you do not know about?

In any event, I think Yi may be affirming your inclination to protect yourself in this evolving situation.

I think of hexagram 26 as sometimes being about delaying gratification in order to accumulate your quality of character and personal power.

And I would not necessarily want to go back to hexagram 25 which sometimes may indicate a need to Disentangle from a deluded belief or reckless action.

It is curious to me that Yi gave you 42.5 when you asked about pursuing. It certainly sounded on the surface like a "yes", "to move the city" and travel. I wonder if Yi was really speaking less of a physical shift and more of a conceptual shift that you were needing to make. And it sounds as though you have made that shift.... from pursuing to holding out for wooing.

 

[canislulu]

Newbie, I thought it might be helpful to distill what I hear in your conversation with Yi as follows:

Newbie: "What if I pursue this relationship?"

Yi: "It will Augment your Disentangling. Line 4: This will allow you to change your center of power."

And so you pursued the relationship. You were trustworthy and let him know who you were and then you were wounded. You broke up. And so you asked another question.

Newbie: "What shall I do with regards to him?"

Yi: "Protect your Great Taming/Great Accumulates. Line 1: You can learn something from this experience and to repeat it would be shameful. Transitional line 41.3: "You will soon gain a friend or lose an entangling triangle." (from http://inthefamilyway.org/iching/hexagrams/h42/) Remember how I told you that pursuing this relationship would help you to change your center of power? How can you do that? Heaven dwells in the center of the mountain. Be still and find "heaven" within yourself before looking for it in the world."

Yes, as you say: "Maybe my lesson here is to restrain my own strength!"

Perhaps there is a "strength" you've learned for surviving in the world that can be tamed and replaced by a different type of strength of character. Perhaps the friend you can gain is a Friend/Higher Self connection?

 

[canislulu]

transitional lines vs. crosslines

And Newbie, I also want to thank you for posting on this forum because it is helping me to tangle with a question I have about whether to employ crosslines in readings (which I learned from Karcher) or transitional lines (which I learned from ashteroid who learned it from Bradford's work.)

What I notice is that the transitional line of your second question is part of the "line pathway" of your first question.

I believe the "line pathway" of your first reading would be 42.4 [25.4 : 26.3] 41.3. (I am trusting someone might correct me if I this is inaccurate.)

It is also interesting to consider the nuclear hexagrams. The nuclear hexagram of your first reading is 23 and the nuclear hexagram of your second reading is 24.

Does any of that have meaning for you?

 

[BlackSwan]

These all sound like good insights to take from the reading in terms of how to proceed.

And I am also wondering if there is something about the "protecting" aspect of Hexagram 4 --- That Yi is advising you to protect yourself. Letting him know about what kind of behavior you will not accept is a way to do this. And not giving in to his misperceptions of you is another way.

Are you familiar with the "transitional line" method that Bradford describes in his work and Ashteroid employs here in shared reading? I believe if you were to use that method your reading would look something like:

4.1 > 41.3 > 26.

I don't have the capacity that Ashteroid has for drawing out the hexagrams which looks so nice.
I also don't have a lot of experience with readings to know how reliable of a method it is --- but it makes sense to me. And so looking at the text for line 41.3 --- may it apply somehow to your situation? Is there a possibility that there is a third person in the situation that you do not know about?

Thank you jumping mouse! I was not familiar with the transitional method.

It's funny that 41.3 suggests a third person in the mix & around the time you suggested it! I had been getting an odd vibe from his ex girlfriend! A little background: they were together for 14yrs but broke up 3yrs ago & have only recently (i don't know exactly how recent before I met him as I didn't want to pry) become friends. I am far from a jealous person, in fact I think it would be a terrible waste if they didn't have some kind of friendship after that length of time, so I've never had a problem with it. I've met her twice over in his city, she was always very nice & welcoming to me, she even added me on facebook after the first time we met. My last visit over there she said something that struck me as kind of odd; we were talking about his new apartment he has recently moved into, he had told me it was a rough part of town, too small, not that great etc. I had said to her I don't know what he was worried about as it was lovely & the area wasn't rough at all. She agreed & went on to describe the place from the inside, obviously she had been there. Now while I am not a jealous person I would never say to an ex's current girlfriend that I had been to their home, I understand that everyone doesn't think like me & alot of people would be bothered by that. I checked her facial expressions to see if this was a slip up but it didn't seem to be the case. So I was left feeling a little uneasy as I felt she was letting me know she had been there, almost in a passive aggressive way. Didn't think about it again until I started to notice that she has liked 99% of everything I've posted on facebook, sometimes from days beforehand! I work with social media so I know how it works & with the amount of friends she's added it's impossible that my posts are popping up on her feed....so I've gathered she must be checking my profile!
It's funny the timing you mention the transitional line 41.3 was the time this all came to me!

Now it has me wondering; I don't think they've been seeing each other but I wonder has she been in his ear feeding the doubt in his mind over our miscommunications? She certainly calls him & txts him regularly, if not daily...which actually made me think about my first visit to his city when I first met a group of his friends (incl her), he was wondering why he hadn't heard from any of them all wkend to which one of the girls said she was going to invite us for dinner but thought no leave them some alone time together, whereas the ex had been ringing him everyday knowing I was there!

So line 3; 2 of us started this journey but now there seems to be a third wheel or outside influence so one must drop out to become 2 again....but is that person me? It feels that way at the moment

 

[BlackSwan]

And Newbie, I also want to thank you for posting on this forum because it is helping me to tangle with a question I have about whether to employ crosslines in readings (which I learned from Karcher) or transitional lines (which I learned from ashteroid who learned it from Bradford's work.)

What I notice is that the transitional line of your second question is part of the "line pathway" of your first question.

I believe the "line pathway" of your first reading would be 42.4 [25.4 : 26.3] 41.3. (I am trusting someone might correct me if I this is inaccurate.)

It is also interesting to consider the nuclear hexagrams. The nuclear hexagram of your first reading is 23 and the nuclear hexagram of your second reading is 24.

Does any of that have meaning for you?

I've never used the nuclear hexagrams before but with the first reading with 23 "Splitting Apart" I feel it reflects how I feel now; confused, distrust, how can someone speak of planning a future together then hours later say the exact opposite? It has left me questioning if any of it was real or was it just meaningless words? I wonder was this hex a warning? Or a glimpse of what I would be feeling.

And the second nuclear hex 24 "Returning" "the slow return of trust after a period of estrangement; the careful development of new relationships after a splitting apart of old"
So also taking in 26, I wonder is that telling me to hold strong & then after a period of separation it will slowly return to what it once was....or that something or somebody new will come along & to forget about him?
I'm not sure of this one.

 

[canislulu]

Newbie, thank you for the update. 4 < 26 certainly sounds like an opportunity for growth no matter how it turns out. Good luck.