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Hex. 53 (memorizing the I Ching)

Trojina

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i think the 'deceitful persons' may just be an example of things that have hindered you in reaching your goal..like you haven't been appreciated and so on...like a boss at work who gives you no credit , stops you progressing etc and you have to put up with it...well line 5 says not for much longer...your time is nigh :D like the song says get your disco shoes, on ain't no stopping you now http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26-AippA-vs
 
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ravenstar

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So the dangers of the narrow-minded attitudes of 53.3 that have potentially cropped the development opportunities are moved beyond. The slow pace allows us to see the things before us differently, ego is less dominant. Rather than trying to control we are more accepting of things as they are. We find a new comfort zone where we can rest. The reasons why we are making the choices become clearer, we become better able to go with the flow. Our choices take us to a different comfort zone(s). It is a safe place to rest in the migration journey. The goose can rest but still has a way more flying to do yet.

Mike

Hi Mike,

Sorry I haven't been here lately, it's March break and a very busy time at the moment. I remembered reading about the symbology of trees in a book by Eric Ackroyd, who has studied Jungian and Freud phisolosphy. He said...

"It [tree] may symbolize the fulfilling of your destiny by surrendering to inner forces of growth and guidance that comes from your unconscious, as distinct from such things as conscious planning and the will to achieve"

Definitely seems in keeping with what you said above. It seems the growth and development of this line is essentially of the spiritual kind.....a kind of structured spiritual search....a time of reflection of consulting our inner voices that are wanting to seek expression. Also a time of gathering energy and germinating/integrating ideas and influences so we can see where life is taking us.

It may be about trusting guidance and following clues that comes to us in the most unlikely time and places.

ravenstar
 

ravenstar

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What indicates that "deceitful persons ... have wormed their way in"?
r.

Interestingly worms represent renewal, regeneration, self-healing, earth healing and transformation. They purify the earth by eating the dirt and pooping it out again. Worms can also move forward or backward with ease. But it's goal is to 'move forward'.

Are a can a worms hidden memories we don't want to resurface or won't let go? Are these memories preventing us from moving forward? The deceitful person knows of these memories/secrets and like a wiggley worm on a hook, lures, entices and entraps a fish. Are worms showing us there are unfinished issues we must deal with before we can move forward?

ravenstar
 

my_key

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Definitely seems in keeping with what you said above. It seems the growth and development of this line is essentially of the spiritual kind.....a kind of structured spiritual search....a time of reflection of consulting our inner voices that are wanting to seek expression. Also a time of gathering energy and germinating/integrating ideas and influences so we can see where life is taking us.

Hi Ravenstar
Nice to have you back contributing. March can be a busy time for us all and with the vernal equinox fast approaching is an exciting time for us as well.
I agree. There is a strong spiritual element to 53.4 - A time of inner things beginning to kick in...an emergence and acceptance of that emergence, without trying to do anything other than see where it takes us. The "tree quote" makes the point well.

What indicates that "deceitful persons ... have wormed their way in"?
r.
Hi Rosada
Deceit = illusion. The deceitful people may be those that create illusions for you on all sorts of levels. As trojan said, the boss who sidetracks you from your goal but just as easily it may be someone who is very close to you or even something that we do to self sabotage. The deceits can be physical or emotional, or show in a multitude of other ways.
What indicates whether they have wormed their way in? Good question !!!...I guess that it is only when the penny drops and you see the illusion for what it is that you know there has been a deceipt. Believeing in yourself, trusting yourself and what you stand for illuminates the areas of deceit.....eventually. Ravenstar's "can of worms" shows that it doesn't necessarily have to be seen as, or indeed is, a "bad" thing. Accept the illusion for what it is, just an illusion and nothing more, and "move forward". Remembering, at all times that moving forwards may be feeling like you are taking backward steps.

53.5 - Trust your intuition to take you onwards and upwards. There is a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow.

Mike
 
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rosada

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In the end nothing can hinder good fortune. One attains one's wish.

The line is the upper ruler of the hexagram, hence it is the summit to which the wild goose draws near. It stands in relationship to the lower ruler of the hexagram, the six in the second place; the correspondence between the two places is analogous to the relation of husband and wife. Hence the idea that union finally takes place. But this takes three years, for the line is separated from the six in the second place by the nuclear trigram K'an, danger. However, the union is based on natural affinity; hence it can be delayed but not permanently prevented.
-Wilhelm
 

rosada

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Thank you for these insights about the deceit and illusion. Interesting how these individual lines will tell of some specific event and you wonder, "Why would it be that always at this point in the development of a certain plot line we have this happening?" In this case, when we're involved in making Gradual Progress, we know we will always come to a point where we will have some issue similar to a woman who for three years has no child. I'm guessing this is because when people are coming together, when individual egos are having to slow down and co-ordinate with all the other viewpoints, there will inevitably be story lines that don't fit with the greater Agreed Upon Reality (as in the idea that all things happen by agreement) and these false, or unsupported viewpoints will fall by the way side and The Truth Will Out. But it is curious. Kinda like the I Ching is giving us the 64 classic plot lines and you know if you are going to write a great story it will have to include these specific twists and turns. A good Conflict story must start with 6.1 gossip, a warm hearted success story, The Well, must end with everyone sharing in the blessing 48.6, and here we see a classic romance must include deceitful persons determined to keep the lovers apart!

Now I'm wondering how this is shown in the actual structure of the hexagram. I mean, Wilhelm says the fifth line, the husband, is in relationship with the second line, the wife, so eventually there will be union but that meanwhile they are separated by the nuclear trigram K'an, danger, so now K'an is representing deceit (instead of eating and drinking as it did in line two!). How did he come up with the time of "three years"?
rosada
 
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frank_r

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53.2

With line 5 changing we go back in time, we go back to 52 again. Now we see the top of the mountain again. Here we see where the illusion has led us. We get a perspective from an even higher point. The wife, our idea's, is only getting pregnant when she get's a yes from the ancestral spirits. Our ancestral soul, our eartly soul can only understand why we our living this life we live if you go back to this top of the mountain. Our own mountain. Only the the wife can give birth to the new child. Because the mountain says STOP! Have a good look, look back go in meditation again. Still your mind and heart and confront yourself on a deeper and more subtle level.

This line is the ruler of the hexagram, it has a resonance with line 2 and als gets the help from line 4. For the rest it is the line on the place of the King.

53 and 54 are the most principle hexagrams that express the possibility of change. And here with the 5th line we have the changing to double mountain, double personal earth. So if you don't get it now you have to wait a long time again to get this opportunity again.

And because 53 has the connection with the spring we can see in the colour green what new life is bringing us. This is the only time during the year we are in this close relationship with the lives of our ancestors. Here we can see what the great Spirit wants us to examine/change during this lifetime.

Frank
 

frank_r

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How did he come up with the time of "three years"?
rosada

The number three is the beginning of everything. There are thee lines in a trigram, and there are 8 trigrams that are the basis of everything.
1+2+3=6 the lines of a hexagram. The first level of organisation of life, the first expression of everything what is possible under Heaven on Earth.

The poem of Lao Tse chapter 42
The Tao produced One; One produced Two; Two produced Three;
Three produced All things. All things leave behind them the Obscurity
(out of which they have come), and go forward to embrace the
Brightness (into which they have emerged), while they are harmonised
by the Breath of Vacancy.

There are three kinds of Hun, ethereal souls. And usually this etheral soul lives for three generations.
So three is the discription of eternity felt on a human level.

Frank

And
 

my_key

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53 and 54 are the most principle hexagrams that express the possibility of change. And here with the 5th line we have the changing to double mountain, double personal earth. So if you don't get it now you have to wait a long time again to get this opportunity again.

And because 53 has the connection with the spring we can see in the colour green what new life is bringing us. This is the only time during the year we are in this close relationship with the lives of our ancestors. Here we can see what the great Spirit wants us to examine/change during this lifetime.

Frank
Hi Frank
A great insight again, and a few things have jumped to mind that maybe you can clarify. It seems pretty appropriate that we are having this line at the vernal equinox time of year.

So 53.5 changes the hex to a double mountain(52). That is one huge mountain!!:). Does this relate to the enormity of the ancestoral issue that needs to be addressed? Or is this more of a 'double personal earth' and you have a much greater chance of seeing things for what the are? And are you saying that this can only be done through meditation?

The 3 years time frame has confused me in the past. So it is not a literal 3 years, it's more of a gestation period, the time it will take for the new changes to manifest. Is that more like it? It seems like this may be a bit of a 'how long is a piece of string' question if we try to assign a time frame to it.

This link to a life's purpose is a huge aspect as well
This is the only time during the year we are in this close relationship with the lives of our ancestors. Here we can see what the great Spirit wants us to examine/change during this lifetime.

Is the time frame then more likely to be one year, until this time next year, or are we really going to have to a "last chance saloon" scenario and have to wait an eternity for it to come again?

I'll stop there as I've lobbed lots of heavy balls back over the net. Any insights on any of these points in relation to the hexagram and this line will be appreciated.

Take Care

Mike
 

rosada

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53.6
Nine at the top means:
The wild goose gradually draws near the cloud heights.
Its feathers can be used for the sacred dance.
Good fortune.

Here life comes to its end. A man's work stands completed. The path rises high toward heaven, like the flight of wild geese when they have left the earth far behind. There they fly, keeping to the order of their flight in strict formation. And if their feathers fall, they can serve as ornaments in the sacred dance pantomimes performed in the temples. Thus the life of a man who has perfected himself is a bright light for the people of the earth, who look up to him as an example.
-Wilhelm
 

rosada

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Okay, that's good to know, that there is a reason to the "three years". Just realized also that while this hexagram is said to represent marriage and fidelity, the main event is the conceiving and birthing of a child, that is, that something is supposed to come from this marriage, something more than just having a partner but also creating a child.
Thinking about the fact the bottom trigram is Mountain and how the last three lines are all positive...
 

frank_r

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Hi Frank
A great insight again, and a few things have jumped to mind that maybe you can clarify. It seems pretty appropriate that we are having this line at the vernal equinox time of year.

So 53.5 changes the hex to a double mountain(52). That is one huge mountain!!:). Does this relate to the enormity of the ancestoral issue that needs to be addressed? Or is this more of a 'double personal earth' and you have a much greater chance of seeing things for what the are? And are you saying that this can only be done through meditation?

Hello Mike,

For me it is more a ancestoral issue that is felt on a personal level. On such a level that you can't miss it. You have to stop otherwise it will haunt you in all kind of other disguises. Till you get the point, and in the spring you get new perspectives to deal with it. New ways, new green, like the many colours of the new leaves in spring. It's all green but it's all different. The expression of 1 in all his different forms.

And personally I think that meditation is only a way to learn how to be in the moment, it's only a training tool. But in the end life isn't lived during meditation. With meditation you can learn what it is to be in the middle to be in the now. But after that you have done this you have to let everything go and only remember that you are you and live your life. so after you learned in 52 you can take this feeling with you when you come in 53. The geese go higher than the mountain. they go over the mountain they reach another new kind of land. Even where the weather is stopped by mountains the geese can overcome this summit. On the other side of the bigger mountains the weather is sometimes completly different. It's a different country there.

The 3 years time frame has confused me in the past. So it is not a literal 3 years, it's more of a gestation period, the time it will take for the new changes to manifest. Is that more like it? It seems like this may be a bit of a 'how long is a piece of string' question if we try to assign a time frame to it.

I think so like three years is a reference to the connection with eternity and everything. I's 1 on a human level. without this connection there can not be a child. 1 father, 1 mother, and 1 child. Together makes three. the Level of Heaven, Earth and Man. The principle of eternity. the principle of connection.

Frank
 
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my_key

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Hi Frank
Wow!! So just to help me get straight here.
For me it is more a ancestoral issue that is felt on a personal level.
So size doesn't come into it. Well that's answered one question.:mischief:

On such a level that you can't miss it. You have to stop otherwise it will haunt you in all kind of other disguises. Till you get the point, and in the spring you get new perspectives to deal with it. New ways, new green, like the many colours of the new leaves in spring. It's all green but it's all different. The expression of 1 in all his different forms.
So we have a chance to see things differently, in a new type of completeness. If you have missed the more subtle signs it will come back in a more magnified version. The 'old ghosts' change shape and reinvent themselves in a grander less missable form. Haunting has never felt like this before. It becomes fuller, more complete... you ARE going to notice me..Hmmm!! Interesting. The gradual development takes on a different perspective here. Ancestoral issues and the real world collide - it can be anything from a small niggle to a weapon of mass destruction. No wonder there can be such mayhem and chaos on a personal level during the gradual development. But these are all "The expression of 1 in all his different forms."

And personally I think that meditation is only a way to learn how to be in the moment, it's only a training tool. But in the end life isn't lived during meditation. With meditation you can learn what it is to be in the middle to be in the now. But after that you have done this you have to let everything go and only remember that you are you and live your life.
Yes. Nicely worded. Meditation helps you to find the middle and then you can endeavour to stay there. Sometimes easier said than done. The gradual development gives you ample opportunity to test how well you have learnt. I get a sense that you pass one test and the next one becomes more onerous.... stretch targets to use business parlance. You are only as good as your next now.:)

The geese go higher than the mountain. they go over the mountain they reach another new kind of land. Even where the weather is stopped by mountains the geese can overcome this summit. On the other side of the bigger mountains the weather is sometimes completly different. It's a different country there.
The ultimate successful learning. Whatever the obstacle we stay in our centre able to deal with it. The inside becomes the outside.The 53.6 effect.

I think so like three years is a reference to the connection with eternity and everything. I's 1 on a human level. without this connection there can not be a child. 1 father, 1 mother, and 1 child. Together makes three. the Level of Heaven, Earth and Man. The principle of eternity. the principle of connection.
The principle of now. Father Sky and Mother Earth give birth through Man. The instantaneous gestation period or is it the infinite gestation period?

Not sure if I haven't mixed a few metaphors here, but I hope it makes some sense.


Mike
 

rosada

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thoughts..
52. Boundries.
53. Dissolving the boundries / becoming as one.
54. Seeing life through the other person's perspective.
 

rosada

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Nine at the top:

a)
The wild goose gradually draws near the cloud heights.
Its feathers can be used for the sacred dance.
Good fortune.

b)
"Its feathers can be used for the sacred dance.
Good fortune." He is not to be disconcerted.

The place at the top is the region of the clouds, and here the character lu, really meaning a plateau (cf. the nine in the third place) has mistakenly been written in place of another character meaning "highest heights."
The trigram Sun means wind. This suggests flight through the clouds. The line is strong and already outside the affairs of the world. It is regarded by the others solelly as an example and thus exerts a beneficent influence. It no longer enters into the confusion of mundane affairs.
The dances mentioned were sacred pantomimes in which feathers of a special sort were used. The idea inhering in this line recalls that of the top line of Kuan, VIEW(20). In the latter too the line as such stands outside the affairs of the world, taking part only as a spectator.
-Wilhelm
 

Olga Super Star

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Nine at the top:

a)
The wild goose gradually draws near the cloud heights.
Its feathers can be used for the sacred dance.
Good fortune.

b)
"Its feathers can be used for the sacred dance.
Good fortune." He is not to be disconcerted.

The place at the top is the region of the clouds, and here the character lu, really meaning a plateau (cf. the nine in the third place) has mistakenly been written in place of another character meaning "highest heights."
The trigram Sun means wind. This suggests flight through the clouds. The line is strong and already outside the affairs of the world. It is regarded by the others solelly as an example and thus exerts a beneficent influence. It no longer enters into the confusion of mundane affairs.
The dances mentioned were sacred pantomimes in which feathers of a special sort were used. The idea inhering in this line recalls that of the top line of Kuan, VIEW(20). In the latter too the line as such stands outside the affairs of the world, taking part only as a spectator.
-Wilhelm
Hi all

could it be said that the line becomes a spectator since it’s out of everything now? Could it be that it no longer belongs?
 

Gmulii

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Hi all

could it be said that the line becomes a spectator since it’s out of everything now? Could it be that it no longer belongs?

Its always out of everything. That is what it represents by definition. In this case the Images of that are repeating more then usual, but the inherit idea is in the line itself(6). If we look at the lines as having specific meaning, the basic ideas can go like this:

Line 3 - Time(Yang - moving in time, Yin - not developing)
Line 2 - Man(Yang - having the needed support to accomplish something, Yin - no active people supporting)
Line 1 - Space(Yang - place that is ready and supporting whatever is attempted, Yin - there is no response from that place in what is attempted, voice in a desert kind of situation)

Then we also have
Line 3 - Heaven
Line 2- Man
Line 1 - Earth
This 3 will need some knowledge of the five arts, but you can guess much of it by the word itself and the upper images are still connected to them somewhat.


And there are more, the 3 treasures for example(so line 3 - shen/spirit/mind/heart, line 2 - Qi, line 1 - jing/essence)but for this this should be enough.

So Line 6 would be Time spend in Heaven. This are just a very short moments when everything fits and flows in "pre-heaven" way, so with ease and joy and it rarely can be grasped for long periods of time.
That shows while line 5 is the person that can attain this moments in their rule, so in that sense they represent Heaven, in practice they can't get to line 6, as this moments of connection with it, can only happen to someone outside of the situation(hermits, beggars and others that are outside of the ruling structure).

In most questions line 6 will just show someone or something that is out of the scope of the question in the way we understand it. So often its factor we aren't aware is involved in the situation. Either that or if it represents us then it means the situation hasn't fully started yet(and that is only in the pure made hexagrams, so Zhen on top of Zhen, or Xun on top of Xun etc.).
 

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