Hexagram 58>16, also 51>2

[mbeck]

Hello,

I have lurked here for awhile now, but finally decided to take the plunge and ask for some advice on the readings I got today.

I am involved in a new relationship with a man who I have been friends with for four years. Both of us are coming out of bad marriages, his divorce should be final next month, I have to wait awhile before I can even file. He lives far away now, and we haven't seen each other since our relationship became more than "just friends". While frustrating, i know this is for the best as both of need some time and space to heal before plunging deeply into a new situation. However, despite that, our relationship is pretty serious on an emotional level. The idea is that we both do the work we need to do in order to get us to where we both want to be - with each other.

But of course, now I have been getting a bit of hot and cold signals from him over the past month, so I've been trying to give him some space. However, the past week and a half, I haven't been speaking much with him, and we haven't spoken at all in the past 4 or 5 days which is very unusual for us and has me feeling insecure. I sent a couple texts, but no response. I didn't call.

So I sent him an email earlier, basically reminding him that I am first and foremost his friend and there to support him and asked him if things were alright with him. I told him about how I was feeling and asked him for clarification and possibly a little reassurance. I know he has a lot going on, I don't want to be clingy, but quite frankly, I feel he's being inconsiderate.

I asked what the impact of my email would be and got 51.1.4>2 as an answer. I'm not sure how to interpret that exactly, but kind of thought that maybe I was blowing things out of proportion?

I meditated on that for awhile and then decided to ask what path our relationship was on and got 58.1.3.5>16. Which sounds good to me, but I am not experienced at this.

I do feel like this is the person I am meant to be with, and I know he feels the same because he has told me so. We communicate very well and openly, which is why this off and on pulling back on the communication has me concerned.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

 

[pocossin]

What will the impact of my email be?
51.1.4>2

Distant relationship do need the nurture of constant communication, and I understand your concern, but men typically do not have the openness and communication skills of women. Could your partner find it difficult to express himself? I'd feel better about the email if you had attached a current picture of yourself to it -- something that could involve him in your life now and doesn't need words to appreciate.

Nine at the beginning means:
Shock comes-oh, oh!
Then follow laughing words-ha, ha!
Good fortune.

Implies a misunderstanding that will pass.

Nine in the fourth place means:
Shock is mired.

Implies that the relationship will be delayed.

Hexagram 2 suggests eventual mutual support and is auspicious for the relationship.

There is an error somewhere in the statement of the second casting since 58.1.2.5 > 16, and I'm uncertain what the casting should be.

 

[mbeck]

Thank you for your response pocossin.

You are correct, the software I used must have a bug. It was definitely 58.1.3.5, which I guess changes it to 58>32 instead. Which doesn't sound bad either.

He has seen recent photos of me. I didn't send one with that particular email, but we generally send daily pictures to one another that we take with our webcams. Under normal circumstances, we chat online off and on throughout the day, followed up with a phone call in the evening. That's why the drop off in our communication has me concerned. It's not normal for us, although there are circumstances that do help explain it (his job is taking up a lot time rolling out a new system so he has been working on days off, 15hr days etc), but to not be able to return a Happy EAster text seems...off.

I have received a response to my email since I posted. He said that yes he was tired, overwhelmed and feeling disconnected lately. That he has spent the past few days trying to figure out what is going on with him, but words aren't coming to him. He told me to not worry, that not a thing has changed regarding his feelings for me, but that he needs to figure out why he is feeling the need to "unplug" to the extent he is.

So I told him to take all the time he needed, that I was there if/when he wanted to talk, and if he didn't want to talk about that was okay too. So now I wait, arg. He is not showing up online like he normally does, so I'm just trying to focus on things within myself right now and wait until I hear from him.

If this were any other guy, I might think he was full of....something, but I have a lot of faith in him. I hope I am not proven wrong. I just don't understand why I'm being cut out if what he is going through has nothing to do with me.

So I asked the oracle this morning for insight into just that, lol. I got 8.4 > 45.
I'm thinking maybe our relationship is too intense for him right now? I have to admit that it IS pretty intense. Four years of pent up feelings that came pouring out in a sudden rush.

I just hope that this is a hiccup, that given some room, he will come back around. I already asked about our potential though so I don't want to muddy it up by asking again.

 

[pocossin]

I asked the oracle this morning for insight into why I'm being cut out.
8.4 > 45

Hexagram 8 does suggest business involvement:

On the earth is water:
The image of Holding Together.
Thus the kings of antiquity
Bestowed the different states as fiefs
And cultivated friendly relations
With the feudal lords.


15hr days are exhausting.

Six in the fourth place means:
Hold to him outwardly also.
Perseverance brings good fortune.

Counsels perseverance.

Image of 45

Over the earth, the lake:
The image of Gathering Together.
Thus the superior man renews his weapons
In order to meet the unforeseen.


What would your strengths be in the defense of the relationship? ". . . so I'm just trying to focus on things within myself right now and wait until I hear from him." I think that's a good policy.

 

[Trojina]

http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=12642

 

[pocossin]

http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=12642

Thanks for the link to Hilary's Blog post: Advice for relationship readings. Which part of this Blog post do you think to be relevant here?

 

[mbeck]

http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=12642

I did read that. How has my approach deviated from her advice?

 

[Trojina]

I was not implying deviation specifically, I thought it generally useful. It isn't a set of rules anyway so how is deviation possible. They aren't intended as rules only suggestions...

You are trying to find out why he has cut you out and how he'll feel about/ respond to your email as in 'what will the impact of my email be' etc so you are trying to figure what his thoughts are whilst not being able to communicate with him...which as you will have read has its pitfalls.

I didn't realise you had already read it so obviously the link was not relevant..so ignore if you want

 

[mbeck]

I asked the oracle this morning for insight into why I'm being cut out.
8.4 > 45

Hexagram 8 does suggest business involvement:

On the earth is water:
The image of Holding Together.
Thus the kings of antiquity
Bestowed the different states as fiefs
And cultivated friendly relations
With the feudal lords.


15hr days are exhausting.

Six in the fourth place means:
Hold to him outwardly also.
Perseverance brings good fortune.

Counsels perseverance.

Image of 45

Over the earth, the lake:
The image of Gathering Together.
Thus the superior man renews his weapons
In order to meet the unforeseen.


What would your strengths be in the defense of the relationship? ". . . so I'm just trying to focus on things within myself right now and wait until I hear from him." I think that's a good policy.

Thank you very much for your insight again. I did not glean a business involvement at all from 8 - this is why i wanted to ask!

So now I guess I play the waiting game. I hate it, but honestly, he has given me no reason to feel insecure. There have been no arguments or unpleasantness prior to this. We both have been through a lot and we both need time to heal, so I'm going to take advantage of this dry spell to look inward and work on grounding myself again.

I do think this has something to do with his impending final divorce date, combined with all the massive change he has gone through. He is no doubt reeling from it all, I know I am.

 

[mbeck]

I was not implying deviation specifically, I thought it generally useful.

You are trying to find out why he has cut you out and how he'll respond to your email as in 'what will the impact of my email be' etc so you are trying to figure what his thoughts are whilst not being able to communicate with him...which as you will have read has its pitfalls.

I didn't realise you had already read it so obviously the link was not relevant..so ignore if you want

It is a very helpful link, I just wasn't certain whether or not by posting it you were implying that my post hadn't heeded it in some manner.

I wasn't trying to get into his head at all when I asked about the email and the overall potential of our relationship. I wanted to see if my email was going to have a beneficial or negative impact on the situation. Would the action I took nudge it this way or that way, that kind of thing. I was hoping it might free things up a bit, get things moving again.

I probably should have consulted before I sent it, but I felt strongly at the time it was the right thing to do, so it didn't occur to me to check first. The major strength of our relationship is our past years of friendship and how we have always been able to talk and tell each other everything. Because of this I felt that honesty and openness was the best course of action. I was also concerned about him, I know what is on his plate, and I know what he has gone through and is going through. I am going through the same. I just had misgivings after I hit send.

That was two days ago though, he did respond early yesterday morning, he explained that he was indeed going through something that he couldn't explain even to himself yet, but reassured me that it didn't change a thing where his feelings for me were concerned. I told him to take all the time he needed, that I'm there for him, etc.

Now the question I asked this morning about why I was being cut out if it didn't have to do with me, was definitely trying to get inside his head a bit Hilary did address this though, and we do have an existing, publicly recognized relationship even though it is new. It just doesn't make sense to me, but I'm not going to crowd someone when they clearly need space, I see no positive coming out of that. I may be being put aside for now simply because I am the only thing that can be right now. Can't avoid work, have to deal with and come to terms with emotional baggage as it comes up.

I'd be lying if I said I wasn't hurt over it, because I am, and this sort of behavior is also a trigger for my own baggage, but he is Him, not the Other Guy. So I will have faith in him, and hope for the best.

 

[Trojina]

Hello,

I have lurked here for awhile now, but finally decided to take the plunge and ask for some advice on the readings I got today.




I meditated on that for awhile and then decided to ask what path our relationship was on and got 58.1.3.5>16. Which sounds good to me, but I am not experienced at this.

I do feel like this is the person I am meant to be with, and I know he feels the same because he has told me so. We communicate very well and openly, which is why this off and on pulling back on the communication has me concerned.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

Can't avoid work, have to deal with and come to terms with emotional baggage as it comes up.

I'd be lying if I said I wasn't hurt over it, because I am, and this sort of behavior is also a trigger for my own baggage, but he is Him, not the Other Guy. So I will have faith in him, and hope for the best.

Well as the Angel of Death I come to say don't have faith in him because that is the precise advice of 58.5 ! 58.5 states it is dangerous to place your sincerity or trust in disintegrating influences...disintegrative to you...in other words your integrity in investing in this is not wholly well placed. 58.3 shows times when we look forward, expect something thats not actually coming. As a sentence though 58>32 could say 'enduring joy' or 'openess/joy enduring/continuing. Its odd when the lines contradict the sentence the 2 hexes make ...but still I'd say there are complications here. What looks sweet may not be something you'd actually want to invest in.

In your shoes I would pull back just a little and watch where you are giving yourself away realising you may be trusting just a little too much in something that may be undermining, that looks promising but delivers nothing (58.3)

This is not to say its dead in the water, the reading could reflect a temporary state of affairs...but still I would heed both 58.3 and 58.5 .....so in the context of all this communication, openness, joy.......keep some guard there, its not so sweet as it looks. Something threatens to undermine you...already is undermining you if you give yourself over to it wholly believing its all for your good. I think you are advised to keep yourself intact by not laying yourself so open to it. Protect yourself a bit and rein in the expectations a bit too perhaps ?


afterthought...thinking of 58>32 with these lines makes me think of him continually stringing you along a bit....maybe hes not, but its one impression I have

 

[mbeck]

Well as the Angel of Death I come to say don't have faith in him because that is the precise advice of 58.5 ! 58.5 states it is dangerous to place your sincerity or trust in disintegrating influences...disintegrative to you...in other words your integrity in investing in this is not wholly well placed. 58.3 shows times when we look forward, expect something thats not actually coming. As a sentence though 58>32 could say 'enduring joy' or 'openess/joy enduring/continuing. Its odd when the lines contradict the sentence the 2 hexes make ...but still I'd say there are complications here. What looks sweet may not be something you'd actually want to invest in.

In your shoes I would pull back just a little and watch where you are giving yourself away realising you may be trusting just a little too much in something that may be undermining, that looks promising but delivers nothing (58.3)

This is not to say its dead in the water, the reading could reflect a temporary state of affairs...but still I would heed both 58.3 and 58.5 .....so in the context of all this communication, openness, joy.......keep some guard there, its not so sweet as it looks. Something threatens to undermine you...already is undermining you if you give yourself over to it wholly believing its all for your good. I think you are advised to keep yourself intact by not laying yourself so open to it. Protect yourself a bit and rein in the expectations a bit too perhaps ?


afterthought...thinking of 58>32 with these lines makes me think of him continually stringing you along a bit....maybe hes not, but its one impression I have

Is it possible that it is a reminder to look within myself for my own happiness instead of expecting him to provide it? Because that is what I have spiritually been working on since my marriage ended, and that is the main reason I am glad for the geographical distance between us for the time being.

I mentioned us both needing time and space to heal from our previous relationships. Because of everything I have been through, it would be all too easy to shove him into that empty place, but I refuse to do that. I want that space to be full on it's own merits, the way it used to be before my terrible marriage. That way he gets the Best Me. He deserves that. And if he is overwhelmed and needs time to sort things out in his head - whether it is about me or not - I need to let him do that so that in return I will get the Best Him. I deserve that just as much.

There are definitely complications regarding our situation, but my gut is telling me to instead remove the walls and trust more, rather that putting more defenses into place. Perhaps I should consult about that.

 

[Trojina]

you asked 'what path is my relationship on'...and you got 58.1.3.5.....I don't really understand the question, maybe you mean 'where is it headed ?' ...but how would you interpret 58.3 and 58.5 ?

Hilarys translation and commentary of 58.5 is

"Trusting in stripping away there is danger"

"You place your trust in something unreliable with risks you are quite unaware of. You might be frofeiting your authority and autonomy here. Perhaps to move to a new level if experience you might need to open yourself more....but this is a dangerous idea if it leads you to surrender control. Where are you placing your trust and why ?"

The fact that he seems cooler or isn't connecting with you as much and your anxiety over that suggest you already have surrendered a a degree of autonomy, you are waiting on his next move. You could trust more...but as 58.5 directly advises against such trust it just seems a very clear message.

This doesn't mean you are looking for someone to fill a space left by a previous relationship, it may just be the situation snook up on you and inadvertently has put you in a position where you have lost a little autonomy since he was leading you towards some kinds of expectations. I have to say I find both with 58.3 and 58.5 the other is often not entirely blameless in leading on, or using a level of seduction...or rather beguilement. You said you felt hurt...well maybe you have a right to because he actually did something hurtful...and this something hurtful is why the 58.5 applies


I guess in the end it will come down to communication with him. Nothing else will answer your querys properly...another roundabout reason I posted the link to Hilarys blog post. You said yourself you are feeling insecure about this , but answers from Yi can't give you the reassurance you need from him....infact they have given you the opposite which I suspect you aren't so keen on.....so then if you ask more questions you have to think what you are really trying to do., what you want. If you want reassurance can you get it this way ?

I'm not lecturing you BTW I'm conversing with my own self as much as with you....thinking of how we use the Yi in relationship questions...so I'm not disapproving just reflecting.


If you felt hurt maybe that feeling was for a genuine good reason, maybe it was authentic...not clingy etc etc just plain feeling hurt. I think being hurt is what 58.5 talks about..it says in a way 'don't be genuine to influences which themselves are not genuine, which will hurt you...in other words 'dis integrate' you.

Integration is an inner thing and you spoke of inner work etc but it would seem something in this relationship threatens your inner integration. I think I read something like that in Bradfords understanding of 58.5. I liked the way he explained the meaning of 'disintegrating' influences anyway

I'm not saying you cannot trust him but I do think theres aspects of his behaviour that you would do better not trust or exonerate too quickly because i think from the reading he likley has actually been hurtful...did hurt you

 

[mbeck]

Well, the exact question I asked while casting was "What is the potential of this relationship".

You are right, I have lost autonomy and I am definitely waiting for his next move, because I don't think that forcing him to talk about things that, according to him, he can't define yet, will be beneficial. Were I to follow my impulses right now, I would be sending him messages and emails daily going into how his behaviour is hurting me, questioning him on the whys and wherefores, giving him blind advice based on speculative reasons why I think he is feeling so disconnected. But that is fear based action, right? That is what I mean by being clingy. Plus it shifts the focus of the situation to me, and my needs and turns everything into being about ME, and that isn't fair to him. My needs are important too, but so are his, and I have to respect that.

He has definitely hurt me, and I feel I have every right to be hurt. Whether he means to or not, he is handling this poorly, but since (to the best of my knowledge) there isn't a deliberate betrayal going on here, I am taking his intent into account and turning the other cheek. I would want the same. That doesn't mean that I won't advocate for myself though, I just don't think now is the time to do so. He either has to learn to communicate what he's going through before it builds up and/or I need to realize and accept that this is just how he handles stress and not immediately think that it means he is dumping me (my baggage again).

Something I haven't revealed here is that he did do this once before, in late March. I didn't bring it up because I don't see them as two separate instances - I see it as one ongoing issue beginning at that point. I reacted poorly at the time, which is why I'm being so careful to handle it correctly now. When he returned after his absence, he apologized. All the major changes in such a short time frame (a month at that point), as well as situations that triggered a bunch of emotions regarding his failed marriage had all come crashing down on him and he froze like a deer in the headlights.

We still have not been able to fully discuss that, all he said was that it made him realize that the only thing he was certain of in his life right now were his feelings for me. I think this is the same situation, and I think it's been ongoing all month. There just hasn't been time between his demanding work schedule, all the OT and travel he has been putting in, and our time zones to talk about it in depth the way we obviously need to. Our conversations have been normal, but relatively light, and I've had lots of drama myself this past month that has taken up a rather large portion of our limited "air time".

When I talk about trusting and having faith in him, I mean in the regards of taking him on his word that his feelings for me haven't changed, he still wants to explore our potential, that there isn't anything going on (i.e. another woman, just playing me, etc), that it really is something internal that he is struggling with. It may very well indeed be about me, but he may not realize it. Yet. I don't think he is deliberately playing games, or wanting his cake and to eat it to. I see 58.5 as a reminder and warning that he is flawed, that perhaps I am holding him to an ideal that is higher than he can live up to right now - or ever. In many ways he has been my white knight throughout our entire relationship, from friendship to romance, but maybe it's time I help him down off of that horse and look at him eye to eye.

You are right that I'm looking for reassurance under the guise of insight. It isn't that I don't want the insight, but if I wasn't worried and feeling insecure, I probably wouldn't have asked at all. I was hoping I would get a clear picture of what was really happening here.

If this were someone new I had just met, I wouldn't even be bothering, but he was my best friend. My only friend really. I just want to do the right thing, even if that right thing is maybe taking a step back, although I don't see how that is possible at that point. And that is not on me, when we finally spoke about our feelings for one another, I was proceeding with caution, whereas he took it and ran with it. I've been letting him lead since, but maybe that's a mistake.

 

[mbeck]

How does one thank someone for their advice?

I have seen it done on posts in other threads, but can't figure out how to do it.

 

[pocossin]

How does one thank someone for their advice?

I have seen it done on posts in other threads, but can't figure out how to do it.

There might be a Thanks button at the lower right corner of the post, to the right of the Edit and Quote buttons. For some unknown reason, not everyone finds a Thanks button. If you do have it, just click on that button. Some post a thanks message at the end of the thread, and some thank by PM.

 

[Trojina]

Well, the exact question I asked while casting was "What is the potential of this relationship".

You are right, I have lost autonomy and I am definitely waiting for his next move, because I don't think that forcing him to talk about things that, according to him, he can't define yet, will be beneficial. Were I to follow my impulses right now, I would be sending him messages and emails daily going into how his behaviour is hurting me, questioning him on the whys and wherefores, giving him blind advice based on speculative reasons why I think he is feeling so disconnected. But that is fear based action, right? That is what I mean by being clingy. Plus it shifts the focus of the situation to me, and my needs and turns everything into being about ME, and that isn't fair to him. My needs are important too, but so are his, and I have to respect that.



He has definitely hurt me, and I feel I have every right to be hurt. Whether he means to or not, he is handling this poorly, but since (to the best of my knowledge) there isn't a deliberate betrayal going on here, I am taking his intent into account and turning the other cheek. I would want the same. That doesn't mean that I won't advocate for myself though, I just don't think now is the time to do so. He either has to learn to communicate what he's going through before it builds up and/or I need to realize and accept that this is just how he handles stress and not immediately think that it means he is dumping me (my baggage again).

Something I haven't revealed here is that he did do this once before, in late March. I didn't bring it up because I don't see them as two separate instances - I see it as one ongoing issue beginning at that point. I reacted poorly at the time, which is why I'm being so careful to handle it correctly now. When he returned after his absence, he apologized. All the major changes in such a short time frame (a month at that point), as well as situations that triggered a bunch of emotions regarding his failed marriage had all come crashing down on him and he froze like a deer in the headlights.


When I talk about trusting and having faith in him, I mean in the regards of taking him on his word that his feelings for me haven't changed, he still wants to explore our potential, that there isn't anything going on (i.e. another woman, just playing me, etc), that it really is something internal that he is struggling with. It may very well indeed be about me, but he may not realize it. Yet. I don't think he is deliberately playing games, or wanting his cake and to eat it to. I see 58.5 as a reminder and warning that he is flawed, that perhaps I am holding him to an ideal that is higher than he can live up to right now - or ever. In many ways he has been my white knight throughout our entire relationship, from friendship to romance, but maybe it's time I help him down off of that horse and look at him eye to eye.

You are right that I'm looking for reassurance under the guise of insight. It isn't that I don't want the insight, but if I wasn't worried and feeling insecure, I probably wouldn't have asked at all. I was hoping I would get a clear picture of what was really happening here.

If this were someone new I had just met, I wouldn't even be bothering, but he was my best friend. My only friend really. I just want to do the right thing, even if that right thing is maybe taking a step back, although I don't see how that is possible at that point. And that is not on me, when we finally spoke about our feelings for one another, I was proceeding with caution, whereas he took it and ran with it. I've been letting him lead since, but maybe that's a mistake.

Getting him off his horse to look eye to eye sounds a good idea.

with regard to the reading 32 usually shows something that is ongoing, continuing on in the way it has, it has its own pattern so the idea of 'stringing you along' wasn't to say this would be at all deliberate on his part just that theres an ongoing pattern of promised future rewards (58.3) that you cannot really place much faith in (58.5)...at the moment anyway.


I see what you're saying about holding back from making demands on him, asking for reassurance and so on, but at some point, in an intimate relationship, doesn't one have to know the other in all their neediness and 'clinginess'...what I'm getting at is that should you really have to so carefully manage your needy feelings to keep them out of his way if infact ultimately you wish him to be the one to fill all those needs. If he cannot reassure you , know you, be with you when you expose these less attractive, totally uncool, but authentic needy feelings (that we all have) then can he love you like you wanna be loved ?

Anyway I don't know it like you do obviously so I can ony give my impression from the reading

 

[mbeck]

I see what you're saying about holding back from making demands on him, asking for reassurance and so on, but at some point, in an intimate relationship, doesn't one have to know the other in all their neediness and 'clinginess'...what I'm getting at is that should you really have to so carefully manage your needy feelings to keep them out of his way if infact ultimately you wish him to be the one to fill all those needs. If he cannot reassure you , know you, be with you when you expose these less attractive, totally uncool, but authentic needy feelings (that we all have) then can he love you like you wanna be loved ?

Anyway I don't know it like you do obviously so I can ony give my impression from the reading

You make an excellent point, but he actually does know, because I have talked to him about it. His response was "Be needy! Be needy!", lol. I don't think he really sees me as such, I think he feels I am strong (I am, I just have my issues like anyone else), but this is a personal struggle that I'm working on. I realized that before and during my marriage, I made a lot of decisions that were based on fear, and those decisions put me in a terrible position. When I'm scared, I cling, and this is something I am confronting in myself. I need to learn to trust in the Universe more.

Case in point - In the email I sent him, I told him I was feeling insecure and asked him point blank for clarification and reassurance (in those actual words). His response was to confirm that he was indeed going through something he couldn't explain yet but to not worry, that it didn't change a thing in regards to how he feels about me (almost his exact words, just changed the grammar so it would make sense in this post). So there it is, I got exactly what I asked for from him. And since I am consciously working on confronting my fears and learning to trust, the Universe has provided me with the perfect opportunity to do so.

He didn't tell me to not contact him, he didn't tell me he needed a break from our relationship, he didn't change our relationship status on facebook(lol), he didn't say or do anything like that, just that he was tired, overwhelmed and feeling disconnected from everything and was trying to figure out why. It was me who said "take all the time you need, I'm here for you if/when you are ready to talk about, and if you don't want to talk about it, that's okay too". It seemed pretty clear to me that he wanted space, even if he didn't directly ask for it.


So then why am I afraid?

 

[mbeck]

There might be a Thanks button at the lower right corner of the post, to the right of the Edit and Quote buttons. For some unknown reason, not everyone finds a Thanks button. If you do have it, just click on that button. Some post a thanks message at the end of the thread, and some thank by PM.

Ahh, I don't have that button!

So let me take this opportunity then to thank both you and Trojan for your insight into this matter, it has really helped me sort things out internally.

 

[Trojina]

There might be a Thanks button at the lower right corner of the post, to the right of the Edit and Quote buttons. For some unknown reason, not everyone finds a Thanks button. If you do have it, just click on that button. Some post a thanks message at the end of the thread, and some thank by PM.

I think the reason is that a 'Thanks' button doesn't appear until a certain number of posts have been made so all total newbies here won't be able to use the 'Thanks' button till they have done whatever the required number of posts is to activate the button

I think that because I remember someone else saying it...though I'm not sure if its true

Seems odd

 

[mbeck]

I think the reason is that a 'Thanks' button doesn't appear until a certain number of posts have been made so all total newbies here won't be able to use the 'Thanks' button till they have done whatever the required number of posts is to activate the button

I think that because I remember someone else saying it...though I'm not sure if its true

Seems odd

....and ironically, the Thanks button just appeared with your post, lol!

 

[Trojina]

.....in which case, as you are now on your 11th post, perhaps a person needs to do 10 posts before the 'Thanks'' button will show its face.

...maybe it likes to feel sure of some commitment from a member before showing its face

 

[Trojina]

You make an excellent point, but he actually does know, because I have talked to him about it. His response was "Be needy! Be needy!", lol. I don't think he really sees me as such, I think he feels I am strong (I am, I just have my issues like anyone else), but this is a personal struggle that I'm working on. I realized that before and during my marriage, I made a lot of decisions that were based on fear, and those decisions put me in a terrible position. When I'm scared, I cling, and this is something I am confronting in myself. I need to learn to trust in the Universe more.
Case in point - In the email I sent him, I told him I was feeling insecure and asked him point blank for clarification and reassurance (in those actual words). His response was to confirm that he was indeed going through something he couldn't explain yet but to not worry, that it didn't change a thing in regards to how he feels about me (almost his exact words, just changed the grammar so it would make sense in this post). So there it is, I got exactly what I asked for from him. And since I am consciously working on confronting my fears and learning to trust, the Universe has provided me with the perfect opportunity to do so.

He didn't tell me to not contact him, he didn't tell me he needed a break from our relationship, he didn't change our relationship status on facebook(lol), he didn't say or do anything like that, just that he was tired, overwhelmed and feeling disconnected from everything and was trying to figure out why. It was me who said "take all the time you need, I'm here for you if/when you are ready to talk about, and if you don't want to talk about it, that's okay too". It seemed pretty clear to me that he wanted space, even if he didn't directly ask for it.


So then why am I afraid?

I guess you are afraid because you only have words, his words not his presence. I think it unsuprising you would need more reassurance. The more words between you promise something, the more investment you begin to make, the more you would naturally need to hold and touch him, feel his presence. We are only sophisticated chimps you know on a gut level, an emotional level, words only count for so much...we need to smell , touch, look feel and then we can certainly know if we can trust by using our animal instincts, by feeling, by looking into someones eyes. They can talk sheer rubbish but if their eyes tell the right story its enough....

I don't know how long it is since you were actually with him physically but I feel its pretty difficult, to maintain a close relationship at a great distance.

Re trusting the universe etc....IMO the reading definatley advised you to place less faith in the idea that this relationship will deliver future joys (58.3.5) ....but you have decided you want to trust because thats your decision.....but then if you already had made your decision on this does Yis answer have any place ?

You may be right in wishing to trust to the universe more, infact I absolutely agree....but he isn't the universe, hes just him and it was him you asked about


Somewhere along the line sounds like you have decided trusting in this being a good potential future relationship =trusting the universe... but it doesn't. Trusting the universe would be maybe knowing it was quite safe to realise he may not be able to deliver because you can find what you need in any number of places ....I don't know. I think perhaps we may have gotten side tracked by thinking this was about trusting him as a person, whereas its more about just placing trust in the relationship, that it can deliver an actual future

Anyway I ain't the person you need to be communicating with...

 

[mbeck]

Update:

I took a break from the constant speculation about what was going on (at least publicly, lol) because it wasn't serving any positive purpose. I figured I would wait to hear from him, which I did, a couple of days ago.

It was as I suspected: a combination of work burnout and exhaustion combined with lots of uncontrolled emotional turmoil, fear and self doubt bubbling up, stemming from his failed marriage and the impending finality of his divorce.

I won't betray his confidence by publicly posting details - it is his business, not mine, but what he is going through is very similar to what I've been struggling with too, so I will give you my perspective instead.

It's the fear that you are somehow a failure even though really - you know that it wasn't you who failed in the (past) relationship. Wondering what is to stop it from happening again, and if this new relationship is doomed to crash and burn as a result, is it worth the potential pain. I know it takes "two to tango" in any relationship, but in both our cases we were dealing with people who were impossible to work things out with (abuse, alcoholism, possible untreated mental illness). But even though deep down you know it wasn't "your fault".... somehow you still shoulder the responsibility.

Breakthroughs have been made by both of us during this time of silence, and we have discussed plans to get together. His work situation should be calming down over the next several weeks, and hopefully we can spend some real time together in early summer. I think this will be beneficial to both of us, we love each other very much and I strongly feel that being in each others presence again will help eliminate a lot of our respective fears and clear the path before us. At the very least, it will remove the dream-like quality of what has been happening.

This morning I asked how things will unfold if I stick to my present course of restraint combined with trust and gentle support (I have no illusions that this sort of thing won't continue to some degree, healing is a process after all). I got 38.1.2.6 > 16. Am I right to interpret this as auspicious for our relationship?

I also asked what impact the visit would have on our relationship and I received 28.2 > 31. This seems to suggest that it will reawaken things and our relationship will grow, but am I missing something?

Thank you.