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I think i've discovered the origin of the King Wen Sequence

erime

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As usual - stating facts without supporting quotes, etc. - asserting a higher degree of 'scholarliness' to the point of suggesting one knows the ancient Chinese mind as if one has access to a time machine, etc.

I know enough to see that his is just hot air. I live in China and have travelled to most of the ancient places, have seen and read a lot about ancient Chinese practices, and I am also friends with a Chinese man who was top of his university class - majoring in History (specialising in ancient history and bagua may I point out). I have more than enough access to the information I need to support my investigations and derivations. Your statements don't affect my conviction one bit.

What is more; the processes I am discovering do not require modern mathemetics, a modern view on the Taiji and duality, etc. - it's all basic stuff, as I have said many times before. It doesn't require a computer or any special technology - it's just obvious pattern-making and manipulating using visual symbols based on the symmetry of nature.

I am sure you would like me to stop my project, Frank, because of course it undermines your awkward "seeing patterns in the clouds" exercise; 'decads', etc.

Lets just let taiji duality, cardinal directions, planetary aligments, etc. speak for themselves - they require no subjective interpretation and are obvious to all with regards to their function.

Enough chat for now, eh. :bows:

Erime
 

fkegan

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Hi Erime,

Why would I want you to stop your project? I just would like to see you complete it and let the world get on with its spinning, not having to hold its breath waiting for you to knock King Wen and Marcel Proust into a cocked hat.

I was wondering when you would join McKenna and Chris Lofting and so many more lashing out at those of us who aren't impressed by your great innovation you can't quite get stated. Everyone else has insufficient proof and your every notion is totally proven so it needs no evidence. I do understand, I have been involved with Piaget stages since I first heard Jean Piaget explain his work when I was like 11. At the time I thought his Swiss French style was strange, but after 50 years I appreciate his work greatly.

Get your project done, the world needs all the help it can get.

Enjoy China, keep talking to Chinese folks and seeing ancient sites while you complete your project.

Good Luck!

Frank
 

erime

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not having to hold its breath waiting for you to knock King Wen and Marcel Proust into a cocked hat.
Apologies - I didn't know you were holding your breath that much - you have been appearing pretty much apathatic and dismissive of late: "throwing together things of interest in modern computer sci student dorms. Generally, that work is mostly started under chemical intoxication and has no interest to sober adults." I was assuming you considered yourself a sober adult... :p

I was wondering when you would join McKenna and Chris Lofting and so many more lashing out at those of us who aren't impressed by your great innovation you can't quite get stated.
You don't even know what I have found, so I am not surprised you are not impressed with nothing, so you can breathe now. ;)

How have I "lashed out"? Stating that it would be in your interests to continue making out you have discovered the hidden pattern behind the KWS, since you have invested so much time and energy in your theory - 'fluxtome', etc. - was a recognition of your stance of not appearing to be able to recognise any other potential theory - even one which is rooted in simple logical systems reflecting nature's basic symmetry which would have been easily observable and replicated in ancient China. I can empathise that you may feel a bit 'miffed', and therefore not willingly want me to publish my findings; that's all. I apologise for any lack of sensitivty if you feel any 'lashes' as if from a whip when I speak these words.

I have been involved with Piaget stages since I first heard Jean Piaget explain his work when I was like 11.
You were, like, 11?! Wow - like, so young,; you must be, like, a genius or something. You weren't even an adult at that point - let alone a sober one! Were you doing computer sci also?

Right then; on with my investigations... :bows:
 

fkegan

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Hi Erime,

All that matters is that you complete your project. Sorry if my remarks disturbed your work.

Frank
 

erime

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Just a note to say I am currently compiling a powerpoint presentation to send to select supportive members here. I have been distilling my findings, and I am sure they will be of great interest. *Watch this space!* :bows:

Regards,

Erime
 

robertluoshu

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Erime,

Greetings!

You live in China?!?

And you have access to "stuff"?!? Books and stuff?

Any information you have on the Lo Shu, its use in Chinese society or temples, what you see in their art, I would be so interested. I have been studying the Jade bi (or pi) disc, and the Tsung-tube as it relates to the Lo Shu (or Luo Shu) [see Berglund, The Secret of the Luo Shu].

Would you include me on your select list when you finish your paper?

And don't mind Mister/Doctor Kegan, he is just trying to make you better. He actually made me take a hard look at my stuff and I think its improved.

robertluoshu at www.luo-shu.com
 
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erime

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Hi Robert,

Sorry, I've been absent from the forum for a while. As I may have mentioned on this thread before, I have the luck of being acquainted with the self-professed last favoured student of the now deceased foremost expert on Chinese bagua history in all of China. The man is a local official presently head of Culture and Leisure for my city. Alas my Mandarin is not yet up to scratch to really begin finding out what gems this man has stored away. I am progressing, though, and a discussion with him will have to happen some time in the nearer future. He has been a lecturer in Chinese history before his present job within the CCP. I am considering revealing my own work to him once I have it protected enough via Western sources.

At the moment my 'select list' is only frank_r, who has been looking at half of my work thus far. I intend to keep it this way until I have worked as hard on it as I feel inclined to. I am sorry about that, as I am pretty sure you will be able to 'bounce off it' in interesting ways.

I am hoping frank_r can post some words here on this thread as to his impressions of what he has seen thus far - he has sent me emails making statements, but I am loathe to reproduce any of that without his permission.

Agreed about Kegan - we need people like him around to keep us on our toes. I respect him a lot for his scholarship.

All the best,

Erime
 

frank_r

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At the moment my 'select list' is only frank_r, who has been looking at half of my work thus far. I intend to keep it this way until I have worked as hard on it as I feel inclined to. I am sorry about that, as I am pretty sure you will be able to 'bounce off it' in interesting ways.

I am hoping frank_r can post some words here on this thread as to his impressions of what he has seen thus far - he has sent me emails making statements, but I am loathe to reproduce any of that without his permission.


All the best,

Erime

I have seen two power point presentations of the explanation of the origin of the King wen sequence made by Erime. And I must say I was impressed. It is a bit complicated what he did at first but after a few times I understood what he did. Till now he explained a part of the sequence but as he is writing he showed not all of his work.

I hope that he will finish his work soon and that other people can also see his proof. I'm already looking forward to see the rest of his presentation.

Frank
 

erime

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Thanks Frank,

May I just say that the profundity and breadth of the patterns have doubled since last night! :) I am still looking in to them at the moment, but I will update you when I have it in some kind of presentable format.

Robert, I wish to consult you on something, actually, maybe I can email you a simple diagram? Thus far I have actually not needed to use any numbers or mathematics, but I have a feeling that there will probably be some accompanying numerical pattern.

Erime
 

Sparhawk

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Hi Erime,

I am curious. Are the colors on your avatar an indication of what's in your diagrams?
 

erime

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Hi Sparhawk,

Yes, my avatar relates to what I have been working on. The colours are not particularly symbolic. Do you have anything interesting to say about my avatar? Is it a well known shape/symbol/pattern/etc.?

Regards

Erime
 

Sparhawk

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Hi Sparhawk,

Yes, my avatar relates to what I have been working on. The colours are not particularly symbolic. Do you have anything interesting to say about my avatar? Is it a well known shape/symbol/pattern/etc.?

Regards

Erime

Well, I happen to be shared some diagrams by Justin K. Parsons that are included in his college Master's Thesis on the Yijing. He uses similar colors for the representation of hexagrams, even though the shapes he used are slightly different. He even went as far as having some of his key diagrams tattooed on his neck. Pictures are on his Facebook page but would not share here without his permission. Really wild... I even commented to him:

2010-05-19_1105.png


:D

I asked you about your avatar because the use of colors representing hexagram lines is familiar to me and others here. So, it does rings a bell, yes.
 
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robertluoshu

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Erime's avatar

Hello Erime,

Your Avatar has the traditional colors of the Tibetan mandala that represent the five cardinal directions: north, south, east, west, and the direction pointing to the North Star as well as the center being represented. The colors that would make this complete would be white (west) and black (south).

ERIME_AVATAR.gif

In addition, the first row of your avatar has two blocks of color. If each block represents one unit (x), then it appears that the two individual units in the first row merge to form a double unit (2x) in the second row, and a quadruple unit (4x) in the third row.

In other words, one becomes two, two becomes four.

It reminds me of the early Bagua diagram in this post:

Earth to Wood, Wood to Metal.
 

erime

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Well, maybe the blue part of my avatar should be vertically divided down the centre:

"They set heaven as three and earth as two, and then calculated the numbers [for the lines]."

;)
 

heylise

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51r.gif
57.gif

There is a very logical interesting way of assigning colors to trigrams. The website disappeared but I saved the page, it is now here: Connie Achilles
This is just explained in a short way, the complete page can be found with the link on the left "theory".
White - all light colors - stands for Heaven, black - all pigment colors - for Earth. The RGB spectrum for the sons, the CMYC spectrum for the daughters.
 

erime

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thanks heylise,

Interesting stuff. If I had known about that before, I could have used it for colour coding within my work, but alas I have already chosen colours - sometimes arbitrarily, at other times to indicate sequence. It would be a lot of trouble to change it now.

I am presently working on more apparent reveleations based on symmetry and other quite simple pattern structures.

Keep checking back.

Erime
 

Sparhawk

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Hi Erime,

Are all those patterns and diagrams in your work color based?
 

erime

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No, mostly trigram-based, but I have substituted trigrams for colours to make pattern-identification more easy.
 

erime

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Just a note to add to this thread that I have found what I believe were the original influences on the King Wen sequence (most which are suspected by all of us anyway).

My previous work with coloured individual trigrams still stands in a more simplistic way and yet while taking that approach I eventually reached some obstacles that threw me off the trail for some time.

Returning to the basic math and geometry of the KW sequence I have found what could be described as a set of logical and undeniably significant patterns having their origin and structure based around observing the stars, quadrated square shapes, mathematical 'root' phenomena, balancing opposites, combining astronomical solar and lunar calendars, and geometric spirals.

None of these phenomena are complex or require any special ability to understand, and yet when used in combination like individual ingredients added to make a special dish, the hexagrams all arrive at their locations in the KWS in the 8x8 grid as if guided there according to the laws of symmetry, rotating duality, the stars around the ecliptic North pole, and basic mathematics.

This is not to say there are some mysteries - in the same way as there are mysteries surrounding the erection of Stonehenge. What appears undeniable with regards to Stonehenge, however, is the alignment to the Spring equinox. I can provide structural details like the latter - obvious and significant information that can easily remain hidden, and yet I can't always say or point out exactly why a certain alignment prevails over another.

I am in the process of creating a presentation for consideration, and if all goes well (and I am not considered crazy and forcing connections - again, the connections appear very obvious and far beyond coincidence using known mathematical patterns and natural phenomena as 'rules'), then I will be seeking to publish my findings along with a more comprehensive rendering of the creation of the Early and Later Heaven Bagua trigram arrangements based on astronomy and 3x3 magic square manipulation (as posted on this thread previously).
 
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