Law of Attraction with the I Ching

[Zane02]

Dear all,

I am new to the I Ching and would love to start a discussion with those more experienced. What are your thoughts on the Law of Attraction and does it compliment the I Ching? Do they go hand in hand or are they completely different philosophies, theories, wisdoms? Can one you use the wisdom of the I Ching to guide one to specific desires?

 

[moss elk]

What are your thoughts on the Law of Attraction?

It's self delusion and wishful thinking.
Not unlike 61.6

Like does not attract like.
(Though like produces like.)

Mr Quimby, who founded the thought, made an error at the outset. He suffered from tuberculosis, and noticed that he felt better after exercise. Then he made this fundamental cognitive error: Some held belief in his mind caused his illness.
Please consider how dangerous this is knowing that:
Plagues, virus, bacteria (like tuberculosis) kill regardless of the belief or education of the one infected.


Does it compliment the I Ching?

No, the I Ching can help one overcome their self delusions. Yi is much about virtue, seeing clearly, and the things which are life nourishing.
Proponents of the belief of 'the-law-of-attraction' may come to believe that they create reality. (we don't, it was there before you were born and will be after you are gone.)

Do they go hand in hand or are they completely different philosophies, theories, wisdoms?

Completely different.
One has merit.

Can one you use the wisdom of the I Ching to guide one to specific desires?

If you mean outcomes and accomplishment, yes.

If you'd like to hear a differing opinion,
just stick around, a fruitcake will surely show up.

 

[Zane02]

It's self delusion and wishful thinking.
Not unlike 61.6

Like does not attract like.
(Though like produces like.)

Mr Quimby, who founded the thought, made an error at the outset. He suffered from tuberculosis, and noticed that he felt better after exercise. Then he made this fundamental cognitive error: Some held belief in his mind caused his illness.
Please consider how dangerous this is knowing that:
Plagues, virus, bacteria (like tuberculosis) kill regardless of the belief or education of the one infected.


Does it compliment the I Ching?

No, the I Ching can help one overcome their self delusions. Yi is much about virtue, seeing clearly, and the things which are life nourishing.
Proponents of the belief of 'the-law-of-attraction' may come to believe that they create reality. (we don't, it was there before you were born and will be after you are gone.)

Do they go hand in hand or are they completely different philosophies, theories, wisdoms?

Completely different.
One has merit.

Can one you use the wisdom of the I Ching to guide one to specific desires?

If you mean outcomes and accomplishment, yes.

If you'd like to hear a differing opinion,
just stick around, a fruitcake will surely show up.

Hi Moss Elk

Thanks for your reply and amusing sign out.
I followed your line of thought completely until you threw this in the mix...

Can one you use the wisdom of the I Ching to guide one to specific desires?

If you mean outcomes and accomplishment, yes.

it surprised me! How does being in tune with guidance of the I Ching leading to outcomes and accomplishments differ to 'manifesting desires' through the law of attraction? I understand the potential delusion that one may believe they therefore create reality but if all honest outcomes and accomplishments can be achieved when being in tune with the guidance of I Ching then it is only the terminology and subtleties of theology/philosophy that differs no?

 

[moss elk]

How does being in tune with guidance of the I Ching leading to outcomes and accomplishments differ to 'manifesting desires' through the law of attraction?

Say you desire a gal that lives across the river.
The desire for her grows into passion and enthusiasm, and one day you get an ingenious idea to don your best tights and cape and swim across with a rose clenched in your teeth.

What happens next?
The lawofattraction says to everyone:
"go for it baby! just believe hard enough "

Yi can give any number of relevant-to-you-&-the-exact-sitiation responses varying the spectrum from:
1-Don't you'll fail and drown.
2-you'll make it across only to find she has a fiance then swim your sad self back
3-Everything will start out fine,
you'll marry, but she'll leave you to join the circus.
4-You'll have success in this quest.
5- Sbe is a wicked deranged person on the inside.
5..etc etc etc

Please notice which is more helpful,
which contains wisdom?

 

[moss elk]

I rely more on the Magic 8 Ball for that.

I prefer our magic 8x8x8x8 ball.

No wood puns were intended.

 

[moss elk]

8 trigrams...
8 to the 4th power= 4096.
(the number of possible readings)

 

[Gmulii]

Dear all,

I am new to the I Ching and would love to start a discussion with those more experienced. What are your thoughts on the Law of Attraction and does it compliment the I Ching? Do they go hand in hand or are they completely different philosophies, theories, wisdoms? Can one you use the wisdom of the I Ching to guide one to specific desires?

Haven't seen anything similar in Yi Jing directly...

In warfare systems like 奇門遁甲 there is very similar approach to the "law of attraction" at times.
Yet in there its different as well, I would say its 90% selecting the right time, strategy numbers, alignment, directions, gods, doors, stems and less then 10% of the actual wishing/creating events.
Even then, there is the idea that that is a form of practice that gets stronger with time, so the connection to their deities is not something that happens by itself, its developed and straightened with time.

Overall, in the way its presented in the material connected to "law of attraction" I would say it doesn't have much place in there.
However, the idea that our mind/emotions create events, is fundamental for much of the systems in the East, even though the division mind/emotions would be very different and can probably be better summarized as "the heart" create events.
In Traditional Chinese Medicine each organ has "emotions" that show up when one is healthy and ones that show up when its not(anger for the liver for example). Its not working by itself, there are still external pathogenic factors that create an illness, yet the bodys response to them would depend on its state and what we would call beliefs/emotions/thoughts.

However they focus their study on how it happens in connection to nature and all the factors that play a role in that, while the western view often seems to come up with the idea if someone wants it bad enough it happens by itself. And that is very far from the systems connected to Yi as far as I'm aware.

 

[Trojina]

Dear all,

I am new to the I Ching and would love to start a discussion with those more experienced. What are your thoughts on the Law of Attraction and does it compliment the I Ching? Do they go hand in hand or are they completely different philosophies, theories, wisdoms? Can one you use the wisdom of the I Ching to guide one to specific desires?

Law of Attraction generally degenerates into/is spiritual materialism and then worse the rather dim conclusion that all in life is down to the person 'attracting it'. That can go into literally diabolical territory if you think about it.

I do think the things we need or want can come to us sometimes quite magically but I don't think this happens through our 'efforts', these are more like blessings.

Re your question I can't grasp the connection. The so called 'law of attraction' is made up of largely new age profiteers trying to make money out of repackaging an idea that was never theirs to begin with. Sure in some circumstances what we wish for happens but to think that is all down to us manipulating reality for our own ends is devil's work IMO - it's materialism dressed up as spirituality. What that kind of thinking can lead to is far worse. The I Ching is a source of wisdom, the purpose of it for you is always wisdom. If what you want is aligned with the flow of nature then I think you will get answers that lead you forward towards that. Not that I can presume to know what the I Ching will or won't do, I can't say, no one can, it works very individually.



I don't think it quite works to compare I Ching and 'law of attraction'. One is an ancient oracle of wisdom the other is more or less a marketing strategy posing as wisdom.

 

[my_key]

The Law of Attraction in it's modern manifestation can give people hope for a better future. It is their chance to hold onto a dream. I would agree with Trojina though that there are a lot of people that see it mostly from a materialist perspective, either spiritually or physically, and many have used it as part of a get rich quick business plan.

The Law of Attraction seems to me to be rooted in the teachings of Hermes Trismestigus and the 7 Hermetic principles and is based in the principle that energy follows throught. Principle 1 shown below - with smatterings of the others thrown in depending on which story you are following.

The Hermetic principles, in general, align with the ideas espoused by the I Ching and other philosophical Chinese texts.

Do they go hand in hand or are they completely different philosophies, theories, wisdoms?

For me, the Hermetic Principles and the principles of the I Ching go hand in hand however the way the Law of Attraction has been hijacked in the modern world takes it away from the richness of the ancient wisdoms.

Can one you use the wisdom of the I Ching to guide one to specific desires?

"Desires" - not a word that I'd say sits neatly with the wisdom of the I Ching. Wisdom and desire are not comfortable bedfellows - nicely demonstrated in moss elk's 'froggy did a-wooing go post' above. If you are asking "Can I use the I Ching to guide me towards becoming richer?" then I'd say yes.

Good Luck

 

[Zane02]

Love all the responses, thanks for taking the time.

I completely agree with the materialistic propaganda of the 'Law of Attraction'. I have read a few books on the topic and listened to various Youtube videos. The most honest speaker of the LOA that I have found is Dr. Wayne Dyer who speaks also extensively on the Toa Te Ching.
Here is my very modest take on LOA that I do not stay attached to in the slightest. I rather have a curiosity for all things and enjoy broadening and learning. It is a 'new age thought' which I do believe has become a fad to make quick money and it sucks people into believing they have the power to 'manifest' whatever they want even if it is completely ego driven. So yes on the surface I'm not a fan and I disregard many of its superficial layers.
However, I have read and listened to more convincing promoters of the LOA who ask you in a nutshell to shed the superficial aspects of an ego driven desire and to draw back to the 'higher self', 'true self', 'divine self' whatever terminology you associate with best.
Behind every human want there is an honest human need that has not been met. By definition we are incomplete human beings, who have lacks. We often perceive these lacks as the stumbling blocks of our wounds. However, we must not forget that the lack is constitutive of the setting in motion, therefore essential to inner and outer growth.
It is ones ego that associates lack with external 'things' i.e. partner, money, house, promotion... If one can draw back and reflect honestly on the need they would like to fulfill then the specifics of what the external source looks like matters not as long as the need is nurtured. What I believe the theory of LOA asks of you is to shift to nurture and positive thinking even in the material absence of what your ego wants. It is less about getting what you want but about allowing what you want to arrive and to be nurturing and content in the arrival. In turn one develops a faith (not a certainty) in a Universe of abundance. All that you need or even want is already provided for you. Then (I'm skipping some detail) with this non resistant perspective you can allow abundance to flow and material things will likely manifest, but unlikely in the way you thought they would. Not what an unchecked ego might like to hear, but rather what an honest human soul is very content with.
Therefore as it is important to understand the honest source of a question to the I Ching it is also important to understand the honest need that isn't met behind an ego driven desire. The I Ching, as I understand, can provide wisdom to an honest question and the LOA as described by some (not many I agree) asks one to recognise the honest needs that are wanted and to sit in positive non-action (I don't mean sitting and doing nothing) and allow the abundant Universe to provide it in its on way.

I hope I didn't loose you!

 

[Zane02]

In Tibetan Buddhism there are practices about feeding one's demons. The idea, basically, is that we have emotional and psychic demons, but we as humans don't usually deal with them effectively: we either try to fulfill our wants (and by extension, try to fulfill their wants), or we try to ignore or push these demons away. The practice instead involves evoking or 'visualizing' one's demon, and then asking it what it wants and what it needs, and you then feed it what it needs (not what it wants), and in feeding it this way, you can release its grip on you.
I just don't think this is the case. I said it either here or in another thread - I think that as a divination system and tool, the Yi does a darn good job of understanding what we're asking about - regardless of how we phrase the question, or how honest or sincere we're being - or think we're being!

However, that is a different beast than figuring out what we honestly need, or what is behind our desires, etc. But that's for us to work on - I don't think the Yi is concerned with that at all: if we ask about these matters, or anything - regardless of how good or bad we phrase the question, or regardless of our intent, honesty, or sincerity - it will give us useful advice and direction.

However, I do think that the part about the importance of "understand(ing) the honest source of a question" and also the importance of "understand(ing) the honest need" really has to do with how available we are to hear, take in, and act upon the Yi's advice. It's kind of a 'pearls before swine' sort of thing.

Best, F

Yes, exactly what I meant about in regards to Tibetan Buddhist practices... you put it succinctly.

I also understand what you mean later about the the questions proposed to the Yi.

I believe I am starting to grow a better basic concept of the Yi and am keen to continue learning and asking. A lot to discover and so rich in history.

Interesting the general consensus of my original query and thank you all for your answers. I will continue you seeing you around this forum.

Regards,

Zane02