"Letting the oracle into the conversation"? 11uc

[Liselle]

...as Hilary put it, over in the other thread, about Freedda's idea to cast a reading.

I wonder if we might already have one? (If Hilary doesn't mind having it dragged into this...? :hide

A few years ago, Hilary asked Yi, "How were you made?," and then kindly shared it with us (original blog article, discussion thread).

Yi's answer was 11 unchanging, Flow.

Thoughts?

I'll start with a couple:

• 11's Pair is 12. The Pair text for 11, quoting Hilary's book, starts, "Heaven and Earth communicate: Flow. The Pair text for 12 starts, "Heaven and earth do not interact: Blocked."
  
  So Yi was made when Heaven and Earth communicated and interacted, or was made out of such an interaction? Trigram heaven is below, with natural movement upwards. Trigram earth is above, naturally sinking downwards. It's unnatural for heaven to be below earth, but it does force them to communicate, as they struggle to work this out and regain their positions? Maybe? (Then when they do, hexagram 12 results, and there's no more interaction. They can ignore each other again, and nothing creative happens? Hence some names for 12: Blocked, Stagnation?)
  
  The other "creative" hexagram is 1, Heaven / Creative Force. It's followed by its Pair - 2, Earth. But in those, heaven and earth seem independent, each doing their own thing? Heaven goes on creating unceasingly, regardless if anything's done with it, and maybe Earth will sit there, untiringly ready for whenever something's given it to do? (Er...???) But in 11, they combine and communicate. What other words...collaboration? Co-operation (learning how to co-operate?)? Synergy? Integration?
  
  What might something like that (if it's not just silly drivel I've made up) tell us about Yi's origins? That at times it may have felt like jockeying everything into position? That inspiration from heaven, and an ability to manifest it, flowed together, symbiotically, at the same time? (We might ask, "Who or what does 'heaven' represent here, and who or what is 'earth'?") Other things?
  
  
• Hilary wrote somewhere else - I can't find it, so I hope I'm paraphrasing decently - that she did get from the reading that Yi was made by one person, not a committee. I wonder if the Shadow, 54, might help support that? How not to think about how Yi was made: by a group of powerless subordinates?

 

[moss elk]

So Yi was made when Heaven and Earth communicated and interacted, or was made out of such an interaction?

Both, no?

Some recently made a comment on how 11 unchanging is the closest thing to what we call Love, helping and protecting another. And I must agree.

Yi has certainly helped me many times,
and has certainly protected me from danger many times.
(such as in 26.3.... you don't want that horse to catch you!)

 

[Liselle]

11 is controversial (are they all controversial? *weary face*)... some call it "Peace," but there are experiences showing it can be quite un-peaceful in practice. Hilary notes that when it says, "Small goes, great comes," what's going doesn't always seem so small. It might be moving towards love or peace or protection, but the experience of getting there could be a different matter.

But anyway, the reading wasn't about Yi's role in our lives, it was about how Yi was made. "It was made with love" is a nice thought...

 

[Freedda]

A few years ago, Hilary asked Yi, "How were you made?," and then kindly shared it with us (original blog article, discussion thread).

Yi's answer was 11 unchanging, Flow. Thoughts?

So, just to be clear, the 11uc is related to Hilary's 2015 question - 'How were you (Yi) made?, and is not specifically about the current topic of this thread about, "Letting the oracle into the conversation"?

Which I take to mean that Hilary's question is an example about how we could let the Yi be included in a reading - which is to ask 'it' (or he/she/they) about 'itself'?

And as an aside, some other names / titles / handles for 11 are 'Harmonious Action', 'Intermingling', and 'Interplay' which for me goes along quite well with both the image and Oracle text: 'Heaven and earth interact' ... and 'Smallness departs, greatness arrives. Promise and fulfillment.'

Which I suppose you could take to mean that the Yi was created or 'made' from the harmonious interaction of Earth above/with Heaven.


Best, d.

 

[Liselle]

I thought of this reading during all the contention in the other thread about the I Ching being a human construction with no underlying principles, or however exactly it was said.

As I understand it, Hilary asked Yi how it - Yi, the oracle - was made, and Yi answered with 11uc. Hilary explained it in her article.

Which I suppose you could take to mean that the Yi was created or 'made' from the harmonious interaction of Earth above/with Heaven.

Yes. Part of what I think 11uc might be saying is that it took both heaven and earth to create the Yi. Inspiration from heaven, divine inspiration if you will, plus conditions on earth that were prepared to receive it.

So if one says it's entirely a human invention, that's not 11... (imo)

 

[Liselle]

Iams Girl has posted a thread where she asked Yi about its underlying principles, and Yi said 14.1.6 > 32.
https://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/fri...g-principles-connected-to-the-Yi-14-1-6-gt-32

 

[Liselle]

Both, no?

Oops. @Moss Elk;, I think I misunderstood. I thought "Both, no?" meant you didn't think either of them applied, like "no to both of those?"

But upon re-reading...were you really saying something like, "Both, don't you think?"

In which case - yes, I do.