Mayan astrology, dreamspells . .

[rodaki]

hello everyone,

recently in the 56 thread I got introduced in mayan astrology.
Frank R and Mike provided some links and I did some reading there and elsewhere
(here and here and here for future reference)

so I got an idea of how this system works and seen some ways in which my sign agrees with me (yellow cosmic sun)
but I still wonder how much weight do others place on such things, or how they have incorporated them in their lives . .
on the one hand, Mayan civilization goes very far back in time and I'm not sure its principles apply in the modern world -of course the Yi is also very old and we are still using it today . .

this question goes primarily to Frank R (because he seems to have the most experience with it) but would also like to hear how others see this kind of 'stuff'

:bows:

 

[Tohpol]

hello everyone,

recently in the 56 thread I got introduced in mayan astrology.
Frank R and Mike provided some links and I did some reading there and elsewhere
(here and here and here for future reference)

so I got an idea of how this system works and seen some ways in which my sign agrees with me (yellow cosmic sun)
but I still wonder how much weight do others place on such things, or how they have incorporated them in their lives . .
on the one hand, Mayan civilization goes very far back in time and I'm not sure its principles apply in the modern world -of course the Yi is also very old and we are still using it today . .

this question goes primarily to Frank R (because he seems to have the most experience with it) but would also like to hear how others see this kind of 'stuff'

:bows:

It seems I'm a White Lunar Dog.... Whatever that means...

I don't have a whole lot of interest in the predictions as time is so fluid but I think the Mayans themselves, their culture and science is fascinating. Even more so the mystery of how they simply disappeared. Personally, I think they had a bit of ultra-terrestrial interference / assistance, rather like the ancient Egyptians but then I'm probably in the minority on that one.

I suspect this present interpretative system is a pale reflection of what it once was, though I suppose all those categorizing and measuring of personality influences isnt really my cup of tea. Fun though.

Topal

 

[my_key]

Hey Rodaki
Great idea to start this thread.

I've been reading my Mayan oracle again today. The more I read it and connect to it, the more I can see confirmations of other readings I have had over the years about me, my personaility, my destiny, my life path etc. I understand the meanings behind, in and around it, as much as I do astrology , numerology, tarot all of which I have had readings given to me in the past. The common threads and themes seem too close to be coincidence, and therefore I can choose to make a leap of faith, or not, that the other parts of the Mayan reading will have some connection to me and my life. At this moment in time:

Do they make full sense? No not all of them
Do they make some sense? Yes
Are there bits I don't follow at all? Yes
Has this whetted my curiosity? Oh Yes

As you say Frank R looks to be our resident 'super-user', so he may have a more scholarly reponse, however, it's like all these types of things, I Ching included, if they are approached with an open mind then that is the way to get the most from them.

I was really interested to hear Frank say that he had a system for connecting these to the Hexagrams. Frank - what more are you able to share here?
So no different than linking the Tarot, Kabbalah, Sabian symbols, astrological signs/ houses, enneagrams etc. All different dialects of the same language

Topal - I would agree with you that Mayan and Egyptian cultural legacies are amazingly fascinating. It may well be that what it is now "is a pale reflection of what it once was" but let's not do these great cultures a disservice by classifying what we have now on these website links to be just "prediction tools" or "measuring of personality influences". I for one am open to the prospect that their legacies are much more than this.

Mike

 

[rodaki]

hi Topal, Mike

It seems I'm a White Lunar Dog.... Whatever that means...

Yup!! exactly my feeling . . I was going a bit like huuuh???? . . whatever

I don't know much about the ancient Maya, only things I've heard here and there (their mysterious disappearance etc) and I'm reluctant to believe the 'extraterrestrial assistance' . . . of course we can never know for sure
and the whole prediction thing?? I think that it's more possible we will discover sth very important about Mayan civilization in 2012 rather than the whole earth going thru a radical change . . but that again is just me

and I guess it is the connections drawn between Mayan predictions and their signs that makes me feel most uncomfortable . . it's not only that they try to describe natural inclinations/elements and their possible combinations (this is part also of western astrology which I find really interesting and helpful in understanding ourselves in terms of analogies) but that they seem to tie these elements in a bigger scheme of some strange . . I don't know . . kingdom come??
ahem . . it makes me go really cynical ('ascension'?? yeah, I do feel like trudging uphill lately - that sort of thing . .)

BUT like Mike says, some things do make sense (if brought to the right scale )
in some ways the discourse used reminds me a bit of Wilhelm (in tone) . . like we are all missionaries of the great truth (ahem . . )

anyways . . this is why I wanted to talk more about it, contextualize it a bit, especially since we are going into discussing 57 which is about personal seals and finding what fits and what not (Mike I think that should be your domain right? )

and I'm curious to know what Frank R thinks about it all (and also with which hexagram is yellow cosmic sun related??? is that connected in any way with birth hexagrams? etc)

and one more thing: I got the impression that Frank might also be using mayan signs in his healing practice and in the descriptions there are distinct ways of healing (see Blue storm for example)

ok, nuff said for now . .'d love to hear more takes on these!!

cheers!
:bows:

 

[frank_r]

Hey Rodaki
Great idea to start this thread.

I've been reading my Mayan oracle again today. The more I read it and connect to it, the more I can see confirmations of other readings I have had over the years about me, my personaility, my destiny, my life path etc. I understand the meanings behind, in and around it, as much as I do astrology , numerology, tarot all of which I have had readings given to me in the past. The common threads and themes seem too close to be coincidence, and therefore I can choose to make a leap of faith, or not, that the other parts of the Mayan reading will have some connection to me and my life. At this moment in time:

Do they make full sense? No not all of them
Do they make some sense? Yes
Are there bits I don't follow at all? Yes
Has this whetted my curiosity? Oh Yes

As you say Frank R looks to be our resident 'super-user', so he may have a more scholarly reponse, however, it's like all these types of things, I Ching included, if they are approached with an open mind then that is the way to get the most from them.

I was really interested to hear Frank say that he had a system for connecting these to the Hexagrams. Frank - what more are you able to share here?
So no different than linking the Tarot, Kabbalah, Sabian symbols, astrological signs/ houses, enneagrams etc. All different dialects of the same language

Topal - I would agree with you that Mayan and Egyptian cultural legacies are amazingly fascinating. It may well be that what it is now "is a pale reflection of what it once was" but let's not do these great cultures a disservice by classifying what we have now on these website links to be just "prediction tools" or "measuring of personality influences". I for one am open to the prospect that their legacies are much more than this.

Mike

hello everyone,

recently in the 56 thread I got introduced in mayan astrology.
Frank R and Mike provided some links and I did some reading there and elsewhere
(here and here and here for future reference)

so I got an idea of how this system works and seen some ways in which my sign agrees with me (yellow cosmic sun)
but I still wonder how much weight do others place on such things, or how they have incorporated them in their lives . .
on the one hand, Mayan civilization goes very far back in time and I'm not sure its principles apply in the modern world -of course the Yi is also very old and we are still using it today . .

this question goes primarily to Frank R (because he seems to have the most experience with it) but would also like to hear how others see this kind of 'stuff'

:bows:

Hello Dora and Mike,

I started my education as a therapist here in the Netherlands. So the first couple of years I only learned western physiology/anatomy etc. Till that time I thought that was the only way to treat people. Then I travelled for severall years around the world and met different culturs with different healing systems.

After coming back(1988) I started to study acupuncture and here I met the Yi in my study.
I was fascinated with this totally different way of thinking. But I also liked the structure of the Yi.
With studying the Yi I also came across many different systems, like astrology, enneagrams, maya astrology, Meyer-briggs, DNA etc.
All these systems had different angles and all had there own mathematical structure.
Because I studied and compared all this different structure I started to understand The Yi more and more. Because in a way all these different systems have the same purpose they all try to bring order in the Chaos of every day life.

For instance the maya astrology have severall calenders, short ones, long ones and ultra long ones. It is fascinating how they count time and in that way understand cycles. there is not one culture that has studied time on such a scale.

With this in the back of my head I looked at the cycle what they call the Tzolkin.
Where there are 20 astrological signs that are combined with 13 different energies. Together this gives 260 different typological signs.

20 is a combination of 5 castles(the colours) and 4 directions. This I saw as the combination of the 5 elements/phase of the East(Wood,Fire, Earth,Metal and Water)and the four elements of the West(Water, Fire, Air and Earth). When combining this with the 13 energies- the 13 phases of the moon.
Then you get all possible combinations of all hexagrams.

Before this I already tried to make a system for the astrological sign and the Yi, doing this I got only 58 different kind of hexagrams.You could't get 21,22,29,30, 47 and 48.
http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=315

For me personaly the Mayan signs are realy working but on a more subtle level. You get totally different information than with the normal astrology. This last one is much more information for our earthly body and mind. The Mayan is much more connected with a idea of destination.

When looking to the enneagrams, which have a connection with the Sufi culture you get more information about how to act in relations. This they use for instance in the world of managers.
The Meyer-Briggs they use a lot in the world of sports and banks. This two are realy a lot more down to earth.

And Topal I also agree with you that it is a pale reflection of what the maya culture once was. But this culture had also different aspects, the really knew a lot about cycles,time and astronomie and astrology. But the had also barbaric rituals where a lot of people died in a terrible way.

Because I studied all these different systems you also meet a lot of people that hold on to each system as being the truth and that's usually the problem. Because it is only a system nothing less nothing more. It's what the Chinese call Li and the Indians call Indra's web. Tao is the Way, De is the Virtue and Li is the principle. Li has everything to do with structure and rituals.

And each system makes something different visible in a systematic way of this Li, this principle.
The system itself is only a blueprint and people use it to get control over the situation. Everybody is reading the Maya signs or the hexagram how he/she sees the world. I have met lots of interesting people that work with astrology, mayan astrology enneagrams and of course the Yi. But also people I only thought can I go away from here.

Personally I always translate everything towards the Yi where I find myself home and it is the easiest not to get lost in dogmatism.

All the best Frank

 

[frank_r]

hi Topal, Mike

and I'm curious to know what Frank R thinks about it all (and also with which hexagram is yellow cosmic sun related??? is that connected in any way with birth hexagrams? etc)

and one more thing: I got the impression that Frank might also be using mayan signs in his healing practice and in the descriptions there are distinct ways of healing (see Blue storm for example)

ok, nuff said for now . .'d love to hear more takes on these!!

cheers!
:bows:

Hello Dora,

First about the yellow cosmic sun, the last sign and the last tone(260), after yellow cosmic sun the year starts again with red magnetic dragon(1).Here there is a relation with hexagram 44. And your next mayan birthday will be in 28 days.


I'm not using these signs in my practice. I think I'm to earthly to use the Mayan signs in my practice. The Yi is more down to Earth. I feel comfartable using the yi because there is also a tradition with TCM(traditional Chinese medicine) for centuries.
But I know some people that use Maya signs for healing.

When I studied the Maya calenders and the yi, about 9 years ago I was specially intriged because in a way I found a sort of synthesis between the 5 elements from the east the 4 elements of the west in combination with the 13 moon cycles. And this together opened a new world of looking to the Yi.

When somebody wants to know how to calculate the connction between the Mayan signs and the hexagram pleae ask, it's a little technical but if somebody is interested I can explain.

Frank

 

[rodaki]

Hello Dora,

First about the yellow cosmic sun, the last sign and the last tone, after yellow cosmic sun the year starts again with red magnetic dragon.Here there is a relation with hexagram 44. And your next mayan birthday will be in 28 days.


I'm not using these signs in my practice. I think I'm to physical to use the Mayan signs in my practice. The Yi is more down to Earth. I feel comfartable using the yi because there is also a tradition with TCM(traditional Chinese medicine) for centuries.
But I know some people that use Maya signs for healing.


Frank

hello Frank,

glad 44 came up in this because 44 is exactly how I feel about Mayan signs -after reading about them a bit- something that feels powerful but I wouldn't like to marry

I do find connections between the description of 'yellow cosmic sun' and who I am: I like seeing the sunny side of things, I like picking up stones to see what's underneath, to take things that seem to have no value and turn them into something nice . . I often have the feeling that as long as my intentions are good and pure, things will work out eventually -and they often do . . I also try to see things beyond black/white and tend towards integration rather than division . .
Throughout the years I have had strange sensations/tensions but never tried to delve into them because I feel they might go too much towards the occult and that doesn't help clarity for me; and ever since I moved to A'dam synchronicites have grown stronger but I attribute that to all the water around (it really doesn't feel like living in the mainland here ) . . and I do sometimes blurt out things that seem to be central or happening to the people I talk to, but this happens with no prior understanding of mine . .

It was really helpful reading your insights about levels and how different systems address different aspects of who we are.
It's crystal clear to me now that this system is not cut out for my interests -not really my cup of tea as Topal said . . some things are better left untouched.


(one recurrent reading from the Yi in the past month for me has been 2.2,4: observe everything but don't let it get to you, use your eyes but keep your heart closed, yes, the Yi does feel closer to me too . .)


thank you very much again for sharing . .
:bows:

 

[charly]

hello everyone,
... Mayan civilization goes very far back in time and I'm not sure its principles apply in the modern world -of course the Yi is also very old and we are still using it today . .

this question goes primarily to Frank R (because he seems to have the most experience with it) but would also like to hear how others see this kind of 'stuff'

:bows:

Dora:

Maybe there is some connection between Mayas and Change:

Needham ... in discussing voyages and discoveries of the ancient Chinese, and Mayas as described by the Chinese, but even stranger that on both sides of the Pacific, jade beads or cicadas should have been placed in the mouth of the dead, and astonishment turned to conviction when one learned that in all these civilizations the jade corpse-amulet were sometimes painted with the life-giving color of red cinnabar or hematite." He also says that the Amerindian peoples mostly place jade beads in the mouth, but they also carve jade cicadas to go alongside." The Mexican author and artist Covarrubias ... has essentially the same information. The Oraibi Indians of Arizona, according to Clausen ..., also thought that the cicada's life cycle symbolized resurrection.

From: http://www.bugbios.com/ced3/cicada_chfolk.html

Here there are some jade cicadas from the Han dynasty:

From: http://etd.sinica.edu.tw/sinoramaweb/content/ChEnIm.asp?chptnumber=50511​

Jade cicadas were used also by Shangs.

Yours,

Charly

 

[rodaki]

Dora:

Maybe there is some connection between Mayas and Change:



Here there are some jade cicadas from the Han dynasty:

From: http://etd.sinica.edu.tw/sinoramaweb/content/ChEnIm.asp?chptnumber=50511​

Jade cicadas were used also by Shangs.

Yours,

Charly

Charly,

A true treasure chest

Thank you
:bows: