Mental Prison?

[arabella]

The reading is about someone with whom I have an ongoing conversation, mostly initiated by me, but always answered and a question on the end that keeps the conversation going. It's been this way for a while and from time to time I think, maybe it's outworn its welcome and has no real meaning, maybe it's even annoying.

I've asked the Yi -- what is the nature of our connection?

The answer: Hexagram 29.4 against a background of Hexagram 47.

Suffice it to say I feel a bit sorry for this person and that they have what I would describe as a life in a gilded cage. They are far better off than I am materially, but not nearly as happy. What I offer to them are bits of conversation about the Arts and classical music mostly and we chat about that. If it's helpful to them I'll keep going but I don't want to be annoying with it.

Based on the casting I would interpret the Yi's answer to mean they are more or less as I see them -- in a cage. I take it that these bits of communication may be quite significant to them and a light that comes in through a window where they live within the depths of trouble. Is that a good reading?

 

[bamboo]

sounds to me as if your offerings are valuable to the person and perhaps something they look forward to. If there is always a question at the end of the conversation, then it isnt really true that you initiate the exchange, is it? BUT, are you inferring that you offer the response and converse more liberally while the other party merely responds and then asks another question, as if being polite? then it might make you feel like you are being annoying. still I think the reading portrays a recipient who could be grateful for the exchange but have less conversational skill.

I had a correspondence like that too. I tended to write more and hope for a more detailed response, but I didn't get it, only the question thrown in at the end. Once, I stopped writing and surprisingly got a message saying "are you okay, I havent heard from you?" this was a series of emails from someone who had begun the correspondence saying that they didnt want to feel "chained" to an ongoing email exchange. It was confusing, but in retrospect, I think the person wanted communication but was commitment-shy, so to speak. Many commitment-shy persons actually crave consistent communication, but can't own that, as they are afraid they will be disappointed, or appear awkward. this person died soon after. I felt happy to have had the connection and that i had carried on
.Because I love to write, if it were me, I would keep writing

 

[white owl]

That is true some people are not as big detailed writers as others, but have a knack for processing information deeply. Is this other person a man who you maybe interested in developing something more than this, or just a more deeper exchange of words. Maybe ask him a deep question about how a certain music piece moves him or how does it make him feel when he or she listens to it. Exchange you tube video music via email to critique pieces? Just suggestions. I always find when someone answers you back with a question that is a very good sign that they value your time and want to know you more.."where is this relationship developing" or "what is the benefit of this relationship to myself & someone"? Sounds like it is getting stale with Hex 29.4 to 47 but I am sure it could be livened up if you want it to.

 

[patro]

what is the nature of our connection?
The answer: Hexagram 29.4 against a background of Hexagram 47.

the yi as always can surprise one.
the forth moving line is the one to wich refer to how we are or how we percive the counterpart. or just the reaction to expect.
the nature of your connection... is to find a simple way to get out from the peril, that can leads to more confusion and stressing questions.

the line talk about a window of the most lightened room in a house, the light comming in to the room is usefull, under which things can be seen clearly=analize.
we have to symbols the room (the safe place where the connection start) and the light (the tool used for).
the problem is that using the light for the analysis is to less... and this leads to exhaust your connection.
the line refers to the need of a more complex and partecipate connection.

for divination purpose is good to look at the fourth line of 47. the line contains the advice if you want to avoid the taking in force of hex 47.
it talk about slow progress and about the fact that you are not getting the support you need.
:bows:

 

[rodaki]

that's a poignant answer . .

29 and 47 could equally describe someone cut off but for different reasons; in the first there's the threat of drowning, in the second that of being dried out . .
Something similar happens with some people, who seem to welcome you with one hand but keep ready to slam closed with the other; maybe they don't even realize they do it but the effect is exactly what you described.

. . I wouldn't think that 29 is about a mental prison though (47 might be that at times), it sounds more like a muffled drumbeat . .

 

[arabella]

that's a poignant answer . .

29 and 47 could equally describe someone cut off but for different reasons; in the first there's the threat of drowning, in the second that of being dried out . .
Something similar happens with some people, who seem to welcome you with one hand but keep ready to slam closed with the other; maybe they don't even realize they do it but the effect is exactly what you described.

. . I wouldn't think that 29 is about a mental prison though (47 might be that at times), it sounds more like a muffled drumbeat . .

Interesting metaphor R, what is the source of the drumbeat i wonder? That might answer my question whether this contact is helpful or if the beating drum just causes a headache after a while.

I was reading through the archives this morning and found an interesting discussion of 29.4 amongst a large group of thoughtful people including dobro, bruce, sparhawk, brad, trojan, willowfox, rosada, and others, so a hefty discussion. i've pullled out a couple comments that seem to echo what I am feeling about this:

FROM DOBRO QUOTING WILLOWFOX AND COMMENITING:

Originally Posted by willowfox
Someone is in jail, a friend visits, hands the prisoner a jug of wine and a couple of bowls of rice through the prison bars. They are poor, so they only have earthenware plates and the one jug, it is done out of friendship, there is no obligation here, thanks is all that is necessary.

I didn't even notice the importance of this at first. The prison idea is a really good one. 29 has this idea of risk or danger, but one of the root meanings of the hex name is 'pit', right? Didn't the Chinese use pits for prisons sometimes? Not only that, but the relating hex for 29.4 is 47, with its idea of confinement, and this echoes the prison idea.

Anyway, if it fits it means something like: helping someone who's stuck or trapped, or being helped when you're stuck or trapped. No idea of obligations or commitment in this approach either; just charity which is without fault or blame.

ESOLO SAID:

Originally Posted by bradford
Literally it's a jin or metal carriage, but those were never very practical, so just like at 04.3 it refers to wealth, the chariot of a person of means.
This makes the state of depression or ingratitude all the more incongruous
or comical, and Hex 47 uses caricature a lot to snap us out of these states.

That's very interesting because the question that I asked when I got this answer involved someone with some wealth - not a lot, but more than a lot of people - who was in a bit of a jam I think. He would have definitely been the one on the receiving end. I thought about that when I saw 'gilded carriage'.

AND THEN DOBRO AGAIN:

The metal carriage/gilded carriage only crops up in 47, so I think it's a variation on our 'bird in a gilded cage'.

And what I see is that it's a self-imposed cage, but one the bird is afraid to leave. So I'm sort of shoving breadcrumbs through the bars. Which leave the question what 47 is about -- I wouldn't imagine the bird tires of getting fed, but is just exhausted trying to find a way out?

What's really weird is, i typed "bird in a gilded cage," which was the image i saw of this person, into google and up pops Clarity, Exploring Divination, the very line I cast and this discussion. Wow, that won't happen twice.

 

[rodaki]

oh, the anechoic chamber was on my mind when I wrote that . . the drumbeat for me is one of the signs of flow, or movement ..

Seems like this person wants to keep his distances though, like he wants to keep some exchange going but not open up or accept more . . have you tried approaching him on the matter to gauge any reactions? The gilded cage could be an appropriate image I guess . . these can be self-imposed confinements though -I think sometimes people don't want to get out, they provide some sort of assurance that things -even if not good- are under their control ..

An artist friend of mine had made these series of works on the idea, based on a phrase that meant something along the lines of 'confined but happy' . .

maybe that fits his situation . .

 

[sooo]

The reading is about someone with whom I have an ongoing conversation, mostly initiated by me, but always answered and a question on the end that keeps the conversation going. It's been this way for a while and from time to time I think, maybe it's outworn its welcome and has no real meaning, maybe it's even annoying.

I've asked the Yi -- what is the nature of our connection?

The answer: Hexagram 29.4 against a background of Hexagram 47.

Suffice it to say I feel a bit sorry for this person and that they have what I would describe as a life in a gilded cage. They are far better off than I am materially, but not nearly as happy. What I offer to them are bits of conversation about the Arts and classical music mostly and we chat about that. If it's helpful to them I'll keep going but I don't want to be annoying with it.

Based on the casting I would interpret the Yi's answer to mean they are more or less as I see them -- in a cage. I take it that these bits of communication may be quite significant to them and a light that comes in through a window where they live within the depths of trouble. Is that a good reading?

Since I generally put the relating or transitional hex first in the process, then swing back to it last, I'd interpret your reading as saying "about this matter of being enclosed a gilded cage..": 29.4-47

For me, the most poignant statement I've read r.e. line 4 is from Wilhelm commentary.

The window is the place through which light enters the room. If in difficult times we want to enlighten someone, we must begin with that which is in itself lucid and proceed quite simply from that point on.

That, frankly, can sometimes mean to dumb it down, simplify, remove it from your field of consciousness, and context it as best you can to fit their current field of consciousness.

(an aside: 29 implies a repeated pattern of some kind. This is not an isolated occurrence.)

I think the message here is: to try to enlighten or enlarge less, and simply relate more with them as one of them, or one with them. Climb into their tree. Be that window.

But, there's the no small matter of you feeling 47'd by the ordeal. If you have to hold back too much to relate well with them, does that emotionally or intellectually confine you? Or can you increase and decrease just as simply, or increase them without decreasing you?

 

[rodaki]

But, there's the no small matter of you feeling 47'd by the ordeal. If you have to hold back too much to relate well with them, does that emotionally or intellectually confine you? Or can you increase and decrease just as simply?

I agree, that's the fruitful question to answer . .