Multiple moving lines - a dramatic view

[cheiron]

I have been looking at hexagrams with multiple moving lines.

I have tested my thoughts on what they might represent and how one might work with them by doing readings.

I have begun to see them as a drama acting on the time.

This is the result so far:

The drama of the moment is captured in the primary hexagram. The moving lines might represent people or forces acting to move toward the resultant hexagram which is the time space drawing the action on and in to which it is likely to resolve.

The lines in the upper or outer trigram may represent oneself in the outer world (eg ones actions or position as perceived by others in the drama of the first hx), or other people acting in the drama.

The lines in the lower or inner trigram might represent ones inner world and the influences that it is bringing to bare in the drama. They might also represent other players in the drama.

The lines might also indicate a time line of actions of oneself or others.

One must first identify which lines refer to oneself and which to other people having a role in the drama.

Each line indicates a tension that the action (ones own or others) places on the time and what was drawing it on is shown in the resultant hexagram for that line.

If the line refers to another then the resultant hexagram for that line might indicate what or where they are being drawn.

If the line refers to oneself then it might be fruitful to read the resultant hexagram and lines as per the FanYao which might indicate how ones inspiration and actions are binding one into the situation.

I welcome comments and insights.

Thanks

--Kevin

 

[bradford_h]

Hi Kevin-
I really like your inner and outer Dramatis Personae approach. I haven't seen it before.
We probably have enough material in this forum's archives to compile a small book on interpreting multiple Yao Ci. And for research all you would need to do is search for the word "multiple."
Makes me really want to be less busy.

 

[cheiron]

Thanks Brad

I have never been comfortable with the ideas which reduce the number of moving lines only to end up somewhere other than the oracle might have indicated.

For a while I worked as if the multiple lines were merely a necessity to get two appropriate hexagrams and ignored the lines themselves.

That works for speed reading, but I felt there must be more.

The problem I had with Steps of Change is that multiple events might happen together and working on a timeline might not be appropriate in all occasions.

The Yijing likes the method I described above but says it needs more work.

One of the more exciting things I have found in this series of explorations is the idea that the nature of the resulting hexagram might define the best method for interpreting a given reading.

I am a little stuck right now and so will return to experimenting with Karcher?s ?Steps of Change? and Mundo Secter?s ?Transitional Hexagrams? which I also find attractive.

Chasing the Wind but finding it useful.


--Kevin

 

[bradford_h]

Hi Kevin

Regarding
"For a while I worked as if the multiple lines were merely a necessity to get two appropriate hexagrams and ignored the lines themselves."

I think that sometimes this is the case too, which adds yet another strategy to our list.

Regarding
"I am a little stuck right now and so will return to experimenting with Karcher?s ?Steps of Change? and Mundo Secter?s ?Transitional Hexagrams? which I also find attractive.

I take credit for co-discovering the Transitional Hexagram method in '76 (and Mondo knows this). It's his name for it though. This is still my preferred method. It's a little more complex, but no more so than a Tarot reading with several cards to interpret. Besides Steps and TH's, no other method for multiple lines really tracks the Zhi Gua relationship.

 

[jte]

Hi, Kevin -

"The lines in the upper or outer trigram may represent oneself in the outer world (eg ones actions or position as perceived by others in the drama of the first hx), or other people acting in the drama.

The lines in the lower or inner trigram might represent ones inner world and the influences that it is bringing to bare in the drama. They might also represent other players in the drama.

The lines might also indicate a time line of actions of oneself or others. "

I agree with all of these types of interpretations, and use them myself. But, I'm a little confused about the idea of restricting some types to upper and others to lower trigrams. For me, I could apply any of the interpretation styles to lines in upper or lower trigrams as needed to understand the meaning...

- Jeff

 

[heylise]

<BLOCKQUOTE><HR SIZE=0><!-Quote-!><FONT SIZE=1>Quote:</FONT>

Kevin: "For a while I worked as if the multiple lines were merely a necessity to get two appropriate hexagrams and ignored the lines themselves."
Brad: "I think that sometimes this is the case too, which adds yet another strategy to our list".<!-/Quote-!><HR SIZE=0></BLOCKQUOTE>

It is how I start any interpretation. Looking at the two hexagrams. Before looking at any line. But the hexagrams themselves are built up of 6 'images', every line represents an archetype. Hexagram 1 is built up from (bottom to top) 44, 13, 9, 10, 14, 43. The archetype "Qian, hex. 1" is a family of smaller archetypes, in a specific constellation together. So even without looking at a line, the pictures of them are in the hexagram already.
I wish I could make drawings of the hexagrams, showing the parts, and at the same time giving an image of the whole. Maybe Val can. Nature does it with all living creatures: DNA builds all from the same template, six parts, everywhere with the same basic meaning, but for every creature its own needs. Wings for flies and birds, arms for mankind, paws for dogs, pincers for crabs. It makes solving the problem of more lines by taking another one instead a bit strange: imagine a researcher, skipping the problem of too many legs of spiders by researching their ?missing wings? instead.
But sometimes science does indeed use a kind of steps of change. From the spider?s legs to the pincers, and from the crab-shield to the turtle-carapace. Hm, explains why some spend so many years on one little insect? Just kidding, the steps of change do have meaning, I think.

 

[heylise]

Forgot to say that this picture is hexagram 1, with all its lines.
LiSe
huh, editing: forgot that I did say so

 

[cheiron]

Brad

Grinning ? Well I?m still going to paddle up the river after you!

The Yijing really liked the ?Transitional Hexagram method? .

Did you come up with a name for it? I would prefer to call as you choose.

I am coming to think that not tracking the zhigua... not doing deeper readings and perhaps also asking a lot of supplementary questions, might be a little like climbing a mountain to see a wise one and then only listening to the first sentence s/he says before interrupting with another question.

So I am doing a bit of work on these and other methods of getting a little more depth and clarity from readings.

All the best

--Kevin

 

[cheiron]

Well Jeff

You said, ?But, I'm a little confused about the idea of restricting some types to upper and others to lower trigrams. For me, I could apply any of the interpretation styles to lines in upper or lower trigrams as needed to understand the meaning...?

So I asked the Yi ? and it agrees with you.

So I am guilty of trying to over organise things?

I shall sit down and write out a hundred times? ?I should not behave like a cheap Han Dynasty scribe.?

Thanks

--Kevin

 

[cheiron]

LiSe

You said, ?But the hexagrams themselves are built up of 6 'images', every line represents an archetype.?

When I read that sentence a world opened for me? Each line relates to a hexagram? but I never though of putting the hexagrams in there instead.


I think my subjective experience of what you said and did with Hx. 1 was a little like watching someone fold space to join up two sides to make a perfect pattern.

So simple and so beautiful.

Thanks

--Kevin

 

[jte]

Hi, Kevin -

In another thread, you wrote -

"After many years with it I have no doubt whatsoever it is a window to some ?intelligence??"

You're certainly not alone in that view, as many people mention similar views in their posts here and in other places. In fact the Shuo Kua (eighth wing appendix) starts out:
"Anciently, when the sages made the I in order to give mysterious assistance to the spiritual Intelligences they produced (the rules for the use of) divining plant." [i.e. yarrow]

That is from Legge. W/B has a more oblique reference (in my opinion). Instead of "spiritual Intelligences" it has "light of the gods". I think they're getting at the same thing.

I also definitely believe that I'm communicating with *something* (i.e. an intelligence of some sort). I'm pretty confident that you, me, and most of the others who believe this didn't start out believing in non-corporeal intelligences (other than, perhaps, as postulated by more mainstream religion, and often not even that). Rather, our experiences with the Yi (and in some cases other experiences) led us to that conclusion.

I think that for most of us the precise nature of this "intelligence" is as beyond our full understanding as it was 3000 years ago (perhaps even more so). Who knows, maybe it doesn't *want* us to fully understand it - we can only speculate...

So, all that said, when you wrote: "So I asked the Yi ? and it agrees with you." I have to say that I was flattered!



- Jeff

 

[bradford_h]

Hi Kevin-
I prefer Transitional Hexagrams, which is Dr. Secter's name for it.
In Chinese it would be "zhong1 jian4 gua4".