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Relationship Qs - straightening them out in my head.

em ching

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Hello,

I have asked numerous Qs about other people in my time, and I know a lot of people on here say it doesn't work/is wrong; an expression of our ego seeking gratification of some sort, usually in the face of actual deprivation from the person in mind, but that hasn't stopped me asking for example, How does he feel about me? What does he think of me? How does he see me? I even think, 'What is his position in the relationship' may be no better...

To clear this up once and for all :rolleyes:
I asked for Yi to comment on relationship Qs in general (after exasperating myself with a marathon run of them)
Hex 24 unchanging

I read this as: You're deviating from your path by asking these types of Qs. Return to your path. Start afresh, seeing with your eyes and yours alone. Realise you have all you need in yourself. 'The path is my friend and I will walk it with or without you'.

This was a few days ago, and I'm afraid, feeling upset about someone, I did go back into my usual ways of asking what he was thinking etc etc.

So tonight I asked, Is there any point in relationship Qs?
Hex 38 unchanging

This hex is about retaining your independence and individualism. About how people see with different eyes. So I interpret this as saying, the Yi expresses what you see through your eyes, and you cannot possibly see through another's just by using the Yi. There is a whole world in you, and a whole world in them. That is what it means to be Separate.

But I would like your advice.
What kind of questions can/do you ask about relationships?

For example, I woud say these are ok:

What is the situation between X and I?
How should I see us?
How do I best deal with X and I?
What is the potential between us?
What should I know about him? (not sure if this one's too personal though?)
My position in the relationship? (but not his position)
What if I contact X?
What if I wait for X?

Any others? I know I should aim to keep them to a minimum anyway, but I feel I am at last drawing up some boundaries for myself here.

Thanks for reading
:)

Oh and I asked How do I best see X and I? (previous thread guy)
27.1 > 23
- I should not allow myself to be destroyed when I can't depend on another. A lesson reminding me (again) how important it is to be self-reliant. And 23 - I'm on my own again amongst some relationship rubble, but I have my own food (27.1)
 

pocossin

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I asked for Yi to comment on relationship Qs in general. . .
24 unchanging


Em Ching, I think you would get better, more significant answers if you didn't ask so many questions. I get exhausted just reading about all this casting :) I think any question is valid -- in moderation.

The Judgement

Return. Success.
Going out and coming in without error.
Friends come without blame.
To and fro goes the way.
On the seventh day comes return.
It furthers one to have somewhere to go.

You can alway go deeper.

The Image

Thunder within the earth:
The image of the Turning Point.
Thus the kings of antiquity closed the passes
At the time of solstice.
Merchants and strangers did not go about,
And the ruler
Did not travel through the provinces.

They took time to stay still and view the big picture.
 

Trojina

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Hello,

I have asked numerous Qs about other people in my time, and I know a lot of people on here say it doesn't work/is wrong; an expression of our ego seeking gratification of some sort, usually in the face of actual deprivation from the person in mind, but that hasn't stopped me asking for example, How does he feel about me? What does he think of me? How does he see me? I even think, 'What is his position in the relationship' may be no better...

To clear this up once and for all :rolleyes:
I asked for Yi to comment on relationship Qs in general (after exasperating myself with a marathon run of them)
Hex 24 unchanging

I read this as: You're deviating from your path by asking these types of Qs. Return to your path. Start afresh, seeing with your eyes and yours alone. Realise you have all you need in yourself. 'The path is my friend and I will walk it with or without you'.

I don't think anyone ever said it was wrong, just not often especially effective or useful when you have much vested interest in the direction of the answer...but what a great answer 24 is here, returning to your truth, your path. If you view the answer postively you could say you have returned by simply asking this question.

This was a few days ago, and I'm afraid, feeling upset about someone, I did go back into my usual ways of asking what he was thinking etc etc.

So tonight I asked, Is there any point in relationship Qs?
Hex 38 unchanging

This hex is about retaining your independence and individualism. About how people see with different eyes. So I interpret this as saying, the Yi expresses what you see through your eyes, and you cannot possibly see through another's just by using the Yi. There is a whole world in you, and a whole world in them. That is what it means to be Separate.

I like your interpretation.

But I would like your advice.
What kind of questions can/do you ask about relationships?

For example, I woud say these are ok:

What is the situation between X and I?
How should I see us?
How do I best deal with X and I?
What is the potential between us?
What should I know about him? (not sure if this one's too personal though?)
My position in the relationship? (but not his position)
What if I contact X?
What if I wait for X?

Any others? I know I should aim to keep them to a minimum anyway, but I feel I am at last drawing up some boundaries for myself here.

An odd one I have used recently if for example I have some trepidation about a something is along the lines of "how will I feel or how will I come away from making this contact or taking this proposed action" For me this works well, seems reliable but then I'm using that question to maybe just prepare, adjust mindset, expectations., sometimes just for confidence. I guess its worth thinking about what you asking the question for, what do you really want from it. At first that sounds obvious but it isn't. Often what people want is certainty, to get rid of that nagging doubt in their mind but thats one thing one cannot get if asking about 'positions' and so on since there is no objective postion, each experiences from their own POV as your 38 answer says. I doubt the I Ching will ever give anyone certainty about how someone they aren't in touch with is feeling....no answer, however good will ever be enough. 5 minutes after aksing one question you will want to ask another for confirmation etc etc. One can be consulting repeatedly on relationships as a defensive device, a way of keeping it alive, avoidance of the obvious, so it is important you ask yourself why you are asking the question.



Oh and I asked How do I best see X and I? (previous thread guy)
27.1 > 23
- I should not allow myself to be destroyed when I can't depend on another. A lesson reminding me (again) how important it is to be self-reliant. And 23 - I'm on my own again amongst some relationship rubble, but I have my own food (27.1)


I think 27.1 shows you are self reliant, you have all the resources you need, so why says Yi, are you looking at me with your mouth hanging open. The truth is you aren't destroyed and being rejected can never destroy you.

What exactly was it you thought or think X gave you that he has now withdrawn that you need back so badly ? 27.1 suggests its not something you really need anyway....and meanwhile you have your own magic tortoise you just let go of.

Maybe you could pinpoint that thing you perceive X to have withdrawn because did he ever actually give it you in the first place ?

You have a longing in you but I suggest, only suggest, it has absolutey
nothing to do with X or any other person this ever happened with. Don't get conned by your own drama . You just enacted a scenario with him that put you back to a familiar emotional scene....current phase painful longing. Rather than fixate on him as a player in the drama why not get aquainted with the real nature of that longing. You could be using the questions about him to dodge the real issue, subconsciously that is.

So any question is okay really but if you are using it to veil truth from yourself rather than find it thats maybe a time to call a halt on the questioning ?

So I guess I'm saying its not just the forming of the question its whats behind it....and of course the forming of it does tend to say whats behind it.
 

Trojina

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I asked for Yi to comment on relationship Qs in general. . .
24 unchanging


Em Ching, I think you would get better, more significant answers if you didn't ask so many questions. I get exhausted just reading about all this casting :) I think any question is valid -- in moderation.

.

I think you need a day off. Hilary drives you too hard
 

em ching

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I don't think anyone ever said it was wrong, just not often especially effective or useful when you have much vested interest in the direction of the answer...but what a great answer 24 is here, returning to your truth, your path. If you view the answer postively you could say you have returned by simply asking this question.

An odd one I have used recently if for example I have some trepidation about a something is along the lines of "how will I feel or how will I come away from making this contact or taking this proposed action" For me this works well, seems reliable but then I'm using that question to maybe just prepare, adjust mindset, expectations., sometimes just for confidence. I guess its worth thinking about what you asking the question for, what do you really want from it. At first that sounds obvious but it isn't. Often what people want is certainty, to get rid of that nagging doubt in their mind but thats one thing one cannot get if asking about 'positions' and so on since there is no objective postion, each experiences from their own POV as your 38 answer says. I doubt the I Ching will ever give anyone certainty about how someone they aren't in touch with is feeling....no answer, however good will ever be enough. 5 minutes after aksing one question you will want to ask another for confirmation etc etc. One can be consulting repeatedly on relationships as a defensive device, a way of keeping it alive, avoidance of the obvious, so it is important you ask yourself why you are asking the question.

What exactly was it you thought or think X gave you that he has now withdrawn that you need back so badly ?[/U] 27.1 suggests its not something you really need anyway....and meanwhile you have your own magic tortoise you just let go of.

Maybe you could pinpoint that thing you perceive X to have withdrawn because did he ever actually give it you in the first place ?

You have a longing in you but I suggest, only suggest, it has absolutey
nothing to do with X or any other person this ever happened with. Don't get conned by your own drama . You just enacted a scenario with him that put you back to a familiar emotional scene....current phase painful longing. Rather than fixate on him as a player in the drama why not get aquainted with the real nature of that longing. You could be using the questions about him to dodge the real issue, subconsciously that is.
.


That's really brilliant Trojan thank you. Your question there re. relationships seems practical. What I've emboldened, especially your point about how any answer when we have a strong desire will not satisfy us, because the only thing that will is unattainable. And also how a string of Qs about a relationship that's ended helps keep it alive... I wonder how I'd be dealing with it if I didn't use the Yi? I guess I just wouldn't be thinking about all the layers and meanings and angles there are at work, and learning more about myself and others through looking at previous readings of all mine! :rofl: I do feel guilty about it when I am excessive, but at the same time it really calms me down and stimulates me to learn more, mainly about what I need to discipline in myself, and accepting that you have to take the good with the bad... and be true to yourself and not deceive yourself. If I'm honest something did feel a bit wrong when we were together, as it did the first time we got romantic but it came to nothing... It is odd though, what was missing between us. Because it definitely wasn't anything obvious.

Yes I will think about your point about what it is he gave me. I guess he made me feel like I was nice and interesting, respectable, clever, on his level, and potentially lovable... :rolleyes: but at the same time, becuase it was long-distance even when we were together (as opposed to my feeling that we are strangers again now) I was always fretting when he hadn't responded by a certain time and was constantly paranoid that things would go wrong. It's a shame we couldn't have got to know each other more slowly, but as it was the few times we did meet, I guess we'd gotten deep in our minds, idealising each other perhaps across distance, but in the flesh things didn't tally... if that makes sense.

I was quite upset last night, but asked a string Qs and they were Really helpful. I went from despair to hope and affirmation in the space of twenty minutes or so. (I came close to texting him too to ask the obvious and put myself down.) I'm using Carol Anthony's book at the mo and it's been very helpful (and ego bashing :)

Erm... how do we make friends with our egos? Is that what art is for? I guess the older we get the more we learn we don't need the things we think (our 'ego') we do. I guess our ego doesn't like our tortoise... initially...

Thanks again :bows:
 
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em ching

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You can always go deeper.

They took time to stay still and view the big picture.


Thanks pocossin. Yes you can build a picture of the situation and going deeper I find interesting (I like analysing!!). You can perhaps get sensible version of your present drama filtered by the Yi, if that makes sense. Sometimes I think I am indulging in asking questions though, when I should be doing other things though :rolleyes: but that's my lack of self-discipline.

:bows:
 

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