Should I forget him and move on, or keep the faith?

[leika]

Feeling pretty despondent, I asked the question "Should I forget all about him and try to move on as nothing much is likely to happen, or should I persist - even passively, simply by keeping the faith - because things may yet turn out well?".

I got hex. 34 unchanging. Could someone please help me interpret the answer?

 

[iams girl]

"The meaning of the power of the great shows itself in the fact that one pauses" (W/B, Book III). Would still leave me wondering about why, then what, etc. too...

Am taking Hilary's online class (recommend) and learning more about types of questions that lend more awareness. "What would be helpful for me to understand about my place in X's life to help me keep our relationship in proper perspective?" gave me an amazing answer recently. Maybe something like that would be helpful for you also.

 

[leika]

"The meaning of the power of the great shows itself in the fact that one pauses"

In other words, I should take care of my own business and let time do (or not do) the rest? "Pausing" is kind of ambivalent.

And thanks for your reply

 

[ginnie]

Feeling pretty despondent, I asked the question "Should I forget all about him and try to move on as nothing much is likely to happen, or should I persist - even passively, simply by keeping the faith - because things may yet turn out well?".

I got hex. 34 unchanging. Could someone please help me interpret the answer?

Hexagram 34 is about being strong but staying within the bounds of convention, as we do when we 'keep the faith.' So, I think Yi was simply reflecting back to you the question you were asking about: Whether to be strong and do the conventionally correct thing.

 

[Lavalamp]

"Should I forget all about him and try to move on as nothing much is likely to happen, or should I persist - even passively, simply by keeping the faith - because things may yet turn out well?".

34 unchanging

This hex points to persevering - but in what is right and correct. It talks about "not treading upon paths that do not accord with established order." This means you should take a conventional, not a non conventional approach to your relationship, for example monogamy not an "open relationship", not living with someone if they are not committed to the relationship, certainly not having a child with a man who is not committed to Fatherhood, etc....

If he's committed to you, it means stick around. If he's not, it means move on, or at least time to give fair warning.

 

[iams girl]

"Pausing" is kind of ambivalent.

Yes, exactly, that's why (guess it didn't come across too well) I was suggesting to maybe ask another question like what would be helpful to be aware of or what would be helpful to understand about your place in the relationship. It might allow for more of Yi Jing's perspective.

Like for me, the answer may fill in information you might never have considered otherwise. "Pausing" might make all the sense in the world then; even why, how, how long, etc.

 

[leika]

Thanks for your replies, ginnie, lavalamp and iams girl.
I asked a more general question, "what is the potential for this relationship, how well can it go?" and got 54.1.2>16...

 

[Lavalamp]

"what is the potential for this relationship, how well can it go?"

54.1
The relationship will always be second to other considerations, even with children. But if you are okay with beng second to his other interests and know when to hang back, it could work out as a stable long term relationship, even happily so.
54.2
He may not always be there for you, may be unfaithful, and it will be an unequal relationship. You may suffer loneliness and disappointments. if you can be faithful through that, it could work.
>16
You will need a support group, physically and spiritually to deal with this kind of a relationship.

Sounds like you could make this work, if you can carry all the pain of infidelity - although it could be a "mistress" other than a woman, if say he's in the military or a musician and on the road or something. If you are happy being in the background with the kids, because you love him so much you can put up with a lot of crap, and don't mind being wallpaper around others. Many women in history have had such marriages, for love, security, Country, wives of rock stars - but you may be better off looking for someone else.

Sorry.

- LL

 

[leika]

Thanks a lot, lavalamp. Great analysis and very accurate....

Sometimes I wish the Yi Ching wasn't always so right...

He's a hugely successful martial arts instructor, and the archetypical alpha male. He says he wants love, marriage and kids. But he's very much the "lone wolf" type of guy. With a very long line of short, passionate relationships that he cuts short as soon as they begin to morph into anything more "confining". He can be deep, tender and extremely charming. But he's def scared of commitment...

 

[Lavalamp]

"There used to be a street named Chuck Norris, but they changed it because no one crosses Chuck Norris and lives..."

http://www.metro.co.uk/weird/891319...ge-named-after-him-in-slovakia-following-vote

 

[leika]

"there used to be a street named chuck norris, but they changed it because no one crosses chuck norris and lives..."

lol

I'm more a Bruce Lee type of girl myself ;-)

 

[Lavalamp]

Well Chuck Norris was the "Lone Wolf" (McQuade), Bruce Lee was "The Dragon."

But to be fair, I don't see anything in the reading to suggest he's not willing to commit to you. He's just very committed to what else he is doing as well, and this could seriously strain things at times. 54 Marrying Maiden refers to being able to handle a polyamorous relationship, being able to share someone with their many "other loves", trying to "bury" the competition brings misfortune. Politician's spouses, Sports stars maybe, anyone who is a visible public figure might be this kind of a 54 kind of situation.

How much do you love him? How much does he love you? How much can you take?

 

[arabella]

Feeling pretty despondent, I asked the question "Should I forget all about him and try to move on as nothing much is likely to happen, or should I persist - even passively, simply by keeping the faith - because things may yet turn out well?".

I got hex. 34 unchanging. Could someone please help me interpret the answer?

Just agreeing with the new direction you've taken. I've invariably found that asking a "should I do this -- or that" question gives a skewed answer. As Iams has said, I'd look for a better question that is direct -- which you have done. Now that the anawer is more specific and includes hexagram 54, you've got something very particular to consider. From my experience, it's an impossible position to be in. Can mean you have love rivals, or he just loves his job, but you don't have priority.

 

[ginnie]

From my experience, it's an impossible position to be in. Can mean you ... don't have priority.

How important that is -- not having priority -- is something only Leika can know. Some women would be devastated by loneliness. Another woman might say, "Oh, he won't be around all the time and I can study the I Ching more." In other words, while he is doing what is most important to him, you also have the freedom to do whatever is most important to you. You might need to decide first: What is most important to me? Having a man who is attentive and present, or my other projects and interests? After all, happiness never comes from our relationships. It comes from within us.

 

[leika]

Thanks for your replies girls

Now that the anawer is more specific and includes hexagram 54, you've got something very particular to consider. From my experience, it's an impossible position to be in.

Well, it doesn't sound like the stuff that dreams are made of, that's for sure.

Actually I wouldn't mind spending lots of time on my own; I'm a "lone wolverine" myself, very busy with my work, my interests and my life. Sharing him with his work and his hobbies would mean more time for me to enjoy my own life. However, sharing him with other women would be totally out of the question. I am too emotional - and too proud - to accept such an arrangement in the context of a serious relationship.

Ours has been a "friends with benefits" relationship that slowly, over the course of a year, morphed into a closer relationship with a strong emotional component. I think it only got so far because I was very relaxed about everything and gave him loads of space and time, which other women weren't doing as he is considered quite a "catch" and women tend to become clingy around him.

lavalamp, funny you should mention Bruce Lee being The Dragon; this guy is a Dragon and I am a Tiger (in the Chinese zodiac)

happiness never comes from our relationships. It comes from within us.

I totally agree.

I have a further question to you all, though, and this relates not only to this specific question but to the Yi Ching in general: have you found the predictions to be cast in stone? Or do they sometimes change if you do the work (on yourself) and change?

 

[arabella]

How important that is -- not having priority -- is something only Leika can know. Some women would be devastated by loneliness. Another woman might say, "Oh, he won't be around all the time and I can study the I Ching more." In other words, while he is doing what is most important to him, you also have the freedom to do whatever is most important to you. You might need to decide first: What is most important to me? Having a man who is attentive and present, or my other projects and interests? After all, happiness never comes from our relationships. It comes from within us.

And there are ways and ways of "not being there." It's one thing to keep the house yourself or raise the kids yourself and quite another to have somebody who is just "out of it." There are just so many versions and as you say Ginnie, you have to research who the guy is and whether that fits in your idea of a relationship. I never minded doing it all by myself -- except when things got to emergency proportions and I was still there alone and any contribution resented. So there are extremes -- and there are versions that may even be a relief! I would also have problems with a "clinging vine" type of person. It's an individual call that's for sure. But the line means, be aware and see what's afoot.

 

[ginnie]

have you found the predictions to be cast in stone? Or do they sometimes change if you do the work (on yourself) and change?

They change.

Interesting that you got 16 as your relating hexagram. 16 is Harmonizing People. It is very easy for you two to be together.

54 is, I think, only one aspect of this relationship. When it comes to relationships, many hexagrams apply simultaneously.

By the way, I consider 54.2 to be one of the most fortunate positions of all to be in, because it gives one the freedom to develop on the spiritual level.

 

[arabella]

They change.

Interesting that you got 16 as your relating hexagram. 16 is Harmonizing People. It is very easy for you two to be together.

54 is, I think, only one aspect of this relationship. When it comes to relationships, many hexagrams apply simultaneously.

By the way, I consider 54.2 to be one of the most fortunate positions of all to be in, because it gives one the freedom to develop on the spiritual level.

That's a brilliant perspective Ginnie, really food for thought.:bows:

 

[dragona]

May I just add something...
34 I read is also pulling back, restraining with reason..him doing that not to hurt you by his ways more (that should tell you he cares about you) or you doing it because the situation does not bode well with you...
Coming second depends on the whole life situation, but you asked about the relationship aspect...it is like an strong spell, circumstances seem to be against you.
If it is possible, I would suggest an honest talk with that man, so you would know why you are in the 34 situation in the first place.
Best of luck, d.

 

[Lavalamp]

leika, you know Dragons tend to be very in your face types, if you were his only interest it could be a bit intense for some people. And the Yi could be describing just a slice of your relationship. I would take the reading as there to help you get some idea of what the issues are between you and maybe help you to work them out.

 

[ginnie]

if you were his only interest it could be a bit intense for some people.

Yes, and don't Tigers usually have plenty of their own projects that require time and attention -- while Mr. Dragon is off doing whatever martial arts instructors do best.

 

[leika]

Yes, and don't Tigers usually have plenty of their own projects that require time and attention -- while Mr. Dragon is off doing whatever martial arts instructors do best.

Very well said :bows:

Both Dragon and Tiger are independent, energetic and feisty - and that's why we are (or should be) so compatible with each other.

Not to mention that his martial arts school is called "Tiger and Dragon"

OK, I'm beginning to sound like a teenager now.

We'll see if & how it goes......

Thanks to everyone who replied.

 

[leika]

Update - your impartial advice please!

Further to this question that I asked a few days ago, and after spending some time with him yesterday, I have asked the I-Ching:

If I ask him "Do you feel we can have something more beautiful together (than the set-up we currently have)? Else I feel we should stop seeing each other" will that motivate him positively towards me?

I got 55.1.3>31. Is this basically a "green light" to go on and ask him...?

 

[arabella]

Further to this question that I asked a few days ago, and after spending some time with him yesterday, I have asked the I-Ching:

If I ask him "Do you feel we can have something more beautiful together (than the set-up we currently have)? Else I feel we should stop seeing each other" will that motivate him positively towards me?

I got 55.1.3>31. Is this basically a "green light" to go on and ask him...?

As "more beautiful" is entirely subjective this is a confused and potentially confusing statement IMHO. All the same, I think the Yi is encouraging you to be realistic, to capitalise on the positive, to make the best of what you have. From everything you've explained here, the guy sounds scared or, at the least, like he's not sure, how to go about this whole thing. You may have to do equal parts of leading the way and following your own path, you own idea of relationship, as suggested in 55.1 and letting him fall in with it and/or being the inspiration as suggested in 55.3. But the outcome seems pretty good if you continue. Maybe set a time-frame for yourself of seeing some result -- and then make up your mind.

 

[leika]

As "more beautiful" is entirely subjective this is a confused and potentially confusing statement IMHO.

True... But I phrased it exactly the way I intend to phrase it to him (to make it sound less "threatening").

You may have to do equal parts of leading the way and following your own path, you own idea of relationship, as suggested in 55.1 and letting him fall in with it and/or being the inspiration as suggested in 55.3.

You mean me or him being the inspiration?

Thank you arabella

 

[arabella]

True... But I phrased it exactly the way I intend to phrase it to him (to make it sound less "threatening").



You mean me or him being the inspiration?

Thank you arabella

I think you are clearly the inspiration for how to go forward and he may never "catch up." The thing is -- can you get enough from this if he is preoccupied and you keep the home fires burning forever? It sounds like he participates in selective parts of the relationship but isn't going to jump in with both feet. He has investment in several facets of life, including his profession and being in a highly competitive sport. He apparently gets a lot from that. You'd have to be similarly invested in something -- or willing to wait for him to get home and welcome him for whatever time he is there. it's not unheard of. It's not everybody's cup of tea. If it drives you up a wall -- maybe best to draw a line under it. But there is also the possibility this could be more enticing for him if he sees over time he's not going to get smothered and he gets to put more of himself into it without fear of disappearing.

There has got to be a certain mentality in a person who choices self-defense as the centre of his life. Think about it.

 

[leika]

There has got to be a certain mentality in a person who choices self-defense as the centre of his life. Think about it.

I'm very much into martial arts myself - in fact that's how I met him - so I can relate to that part, but it's funny; it feels like we're two positive poles, cancelling each other out, obviously I have to be the yin to his yang as he hints - pretty much all the time - that women should be doing instead of attempting to "act like men" (?). Anyway, having to convince someone to accept you into their life does sound and feel insulting. But apparently loads of "big romances" in history have started out just like that, with the woman going all yin and "masterminding" the fall of the guy.

 

[arabella]

I'm very much into martial arts myself - in fact that's how I met him - so I can relate to that part, but it's funny; it feels like we're two positive poles, cancelling each other out, obviously I have to be the yin to his yang as he hints - pretty much all the time - that women should be doing instead of attempting to "act like men" (?). Anyway, having to convince someone to accept you into their life does sound and feel insulting. But apparently loads of "big romances" in history have started out just like that, with the woman going all yin and "masterminding" the fall of the guy.

I thinkt it's a question too of how you visualise the partnership. Rather than it being a masterminding exercise, I think it has more to do with knowing yourself Because if you weren't truly and sincerely pleased with what you could have when he was willing to be there -- you are going to be angry if you think you bargained for or negotiated a future "payoff" -- and then there isn't one. It more comes down to what you want and what you relinquish to get it. Going into any partnership requires collaboration. It's never 50-50 that I'm aware of. But if it's 95-5 and you're giving 95 and getting 5 -- what is that about? The most brilliant marriages I know of involve people who have a higher belief system who agree to a standard of how to treat other human beings -- and what love means. Certainly most disciplines of martial Arts contain a lot about honour at the very least. So, maybe discuss it in terms he will understand. Because I think "something more beautiful" is going to elude him entirely from the sounds of it.

 

[leika]

So, maybe discuss it in terms he will understand. Because I think "something more beautiful" is going to elude him entirely from the sounds of it.

Point taken. Thanks.