Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom
Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).
As far as I know, LiSe & Karcher came up with the idea of tracing a path round four lines, using pairing and change, at around the same time .... The roots of the component ideas - inverse pairing and changing lines - have obviously been around for a while ....
Hexagram pairing is as old as the names of 41 and 42, or 63 and 64; line pairing is as old as the texts of 41.5 and 42.2, or 63.3 and 64.4.
What the 'single relationship' is? What does that mean?When you manage to put into words what the single relationship between all these swapped-trigram pairs is
I am sure this question has been asked and answered before (at least once!), but my memory is a bit fuzzy these days, so:
Where do the Line Pathways, or the Hexagram Mirrors and Line Reflections (as LiSe calls them) - or the Transitional Hexagrams (which Hatcher mentions and which I believe are similar, p43) come from?
About how long have they been in use, and who (or whom) developed, invented, or came up with them - if that is even known, or knowable?
I sort of, kind of remember that these are fairly recent - and that perhaps they are associated with Stephen Karcher? But on LiSe's webpage about the Hexagram Mirrors she mentions that the 'idea was known in the Yuan (Mongol) dynasty'.
Kind regards, D
I do not. Also, Hilary answered my question above. But thanks.... do you have access to Nielsen's "A Companion to Yi Jing Numerology and Cosmology"?
Line exercises? You mean with paired lines and such-like?Curious, do you have access to Nielsen's "A Companion to Yi Jing Numerology and Cosmology"? There are number of these line exercises listed there which are quite old.
L
Line exercises? You mean with paired lines and such-like?
Thanks. A question to confirm what you said above: is this how you see the "oppostite trigrams" - that they always show you something that's either opposite or complementary about the hexagram it's 'paired' with?... you (or we) can describe the relationship between all the pairs of hexagrams with all 6 lines different (3 and 50, 5 and 35, etc) by saying they are 'opposite' or 'complementary' in meaning .... Now can you do the same for all the swapped-trigram pairs?
Indeed I have, though the prospect of reading through 384 pages of entries on the off-chance is daunting, and if you happen to have done the work for me I will not be at all disappointed.I believe you have the book or a PDF to look for them in the pages.
That's how it's done. Open your journal to a point where you have full benefit of hindsight, and start asking yourself, 'If I'd looked at this hexagram then, what could I have learned?'So, for now the best way I can describe how am I making use of the reverse hexagrams is, I'm seeing if they provide any useful or insightful ideas or meanings for my reading (sort of 'filling it out') - but without making the reading be something other than what it is.
And based on my limited exploring so far, I've found that many times (but not all the time) the reverse hexagrams and lines are useful and are worth exploring more. At some point, I'll try to present more about my explorations.
... you can describe the relationship between all the pairs of hexagrams with all 6 lines different (3 and 50, 5 and 35, etc) by saying they are 'opposite' or 'complementary' in meaning.
That's how it's done. Open your journal to a point where you have full benefit of hindsight ....
Do you still mean trigram-swapping? And if so, are you looking at individual lines too - e.g. 10.2 with 43.5?
Indeed I have, though the prospect of reading through 384 pages of entries on the off-chance is daunting, and if you happen to have done the work for me I will not be at all disappointed.
Thanks for your response. To clarify, are you saying that these 'Opposite' (Hatchers' pang tong gua) hexagrams always describe an either opposite or complementary relationship?
And would this extend to the lines as well, e.g. 3.3 and 50.3, or 5.5 and 35.65?
Using hindsight was a suggestion. It's very useful if you want to make a systematic survey of the usefulness - or lack thereof - of any tool.You are correct, however, I am talking about something a bit different here. Not about looking at past readings, but looking at the "Reverse" hexagrams (Hatcher's jiao gua) - where the trigrams are swapped. And of course this could - but doesn't have to - be done in hindsight.
Yes, the Reverse Hexagrams (i.e. swapped trigrams), and also their lines - so I might look at Hex. 5 and 6 (which in this case are also a classic 'pair') and also lines 5.3 and 6.3 ... or Hex. 10 and 43, and also lines 10.2 and 43.2.
What you are quoting here is what Bradford says about opposite pairs, eg 10 vs 15 - pairs with all lines changed.Hatcher describes these Reverse Hexagrams (Vol II, page 15):
In Shao Yong’s circular arrangement of the Gua these pairs oppose each other on the circle. Taking a cue from later Yin-Yang theory, (it is) ... helpful to see these pairs as complementary opposites, as insights and attitudes which are fulfilling to the larger goal of wholeness and the personal integration of paradox - they should not be seen as mutually exclusive.
And I sort of used that as my jumping off point in my exploration ....
Best, D
Another one on the (infinite) reading list, then...Sorry, I'll owe you that one. I read Nielsen in detail and attention more than 12 years ago and some of those findings stuck with me as being there but I have no quotations to give you.
OMG! sorry sorry sorry! Early morning mind-fart. I corrected it above!What you are quoting here is Bradford about opposite pairs, eg 10 vs 15 - pairs with all lines changed.
Logically, wouldn't it make more sense to look at 10.2 with 43.5? The two 'dui.2' lines?
Ah, thanks.Using hindsight was a suggestion.
Yes - though it's not either/or.
Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom
Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).