...life can be translucent

Menu

Will he ever love me back? 64 Unchanging then 4.2.5>20

Chaosmos

visitor
Joined
Jan 10, 2022
Messages
8
Reaction score
5
I met a man last year who I fell head over heels for pretty fast. I'm 32 years old and I haven't dated anyone (for various reasons), but mainly because I'm happy to spend my time single, and I've rarely encountered anyone who I've wanted to be in a "romantic relationship" with. The few men I have fallen for in the past didn't feel the same way about me, so I've been riding solo for a lifetime now.

Well.. I can actually picture being with this man. We have tremendous chemistry and balance each other out almost perfectly. From our very first conversation, I was able to relax and be myself completely with him, which is incredibly uncommon for me. I felt extreme deja vu, that day we met, as though I had somehow known him my entire life.

Unfortunately, he was dating another woman at the time and was already almost a year into his relationship with her.

Over the last year, we've become very close friends. I even showed him the I Ching, which he uses regularly now. He tells me I've helped him figure out how to "go with the flow" in his life. He's in a much better place physically/mentally than when we met... and so am I. I attribute this largely to our time together and the ways we've helped each other grow as people. He frequently seeks me out for my "sage advice" during his hardest moments, and I'm grateful he trusts me like this. But I don't want to just be his teacher...

I've never made my feelings known to him because I'm afraid of ruining our friendship OR having my heart shattered by his potential rejection. His relationship with this other woman doesn't seem particularly great. He frequently vents to me about the horrible fights they get into, and how at times he feels uncertain that they should be together at all. He's said this to me several times now, including just a few days ago.

Lately, he's been particularly communicative, texting me daily, making plans to meet me, repeatedly expressing how excited he is to collaborate on some creative projects together, and saying how much he values the help I've given him.

I love this man and want only the best for him. But it hurts like hell to harbor these feelings knowing they may never be returned.

The other night, I asked the I Ching about him. Nothing specific. I just pictured him in my mind and thought of our relationship to each other to see what response I'd get.

64 Unchanging.

It gave me some hope. The various translations and the images like crossing a river or climbing a mountain, seem to imply that there could be some sort of resolution to this on the horizon soon, provided I don't screw it up like that little fox haha. (I did this with the Tarot too that night and drew the 9 of wands for anyone who dabbles in that).

His recent increased level of attention towards me over the last few days has made me think of him even more than normal, so tonight I asked the oracle directly "will he ever love me back?" and received 4.2.5>20.

I don't know what to make of this. 4 is not one I've received much over the years and the fact that it's the hexagram that kinda seems to tell you to "bug off and stop asking it the same question" is kinda weird. It feels like the oracle's telling me to go back and look at hexagram 64 again, the answer I received a few nights ago. That by repeatedly asking it about this man, I'm just going to confuse myself.

If anyone has some insight, I could use some help interpreting these two hexagrams and the relating 20. Thank you!
 

Trojina

Supporter
Clarity Supporter
Joined
May 29, 2006
Messages
26,920
Reaction score
4,426
First I want to make entirely non Yi related observations. I want to say this situation you describe is so common and the way it is affecting you is so usual I think it is of benefit to be aware of that as you may not be. Being aware of it, even if it does not apply in this instance, may as least provide some perspective and I also see the readings very much in the light of what I have observed and experienced. You don't say you know him through work but anyway.....

The common situation is that is mostly not recognised for what it is goes just as you described and it is invariably between men and women at work where the man is with a partner and the woman is not. The man's behaviour suggests subtly or not so subtly that he is very much on the same page as the woman, he pays her attention, there's chemistry, he often lets slip he isn't happy with his wife/partner and all these things add up naturally to the woman falling for him and hoping for something more, hoping it might go somewhere. The kicker is because he never makes any explicit moves he avoids responsibility for the woman's feelings and she's left wondering what's going on, feeling daft as she falls as she falls in love, she actually feels the burden of all these feelings wondering if she is making too much of it, wondering what he is thinking and so on. I have seen this so many times now I know the pattern of it and what's happening is not fair. Don't think for a moment he isn't aware of what he's doing, he's toying really with your feelings and then going home to his girlfriend while you go home alone to think about him. What is more this can go on and on and on without resolution or end (64uc) because the woman's hope is kept alive by his attention but it is never satisfied because he makes no explicit suggestion to get together. The truth is he is amusing himself with someone he likes and probably does fancy but he has no intention of doing anything about it. I don't know why this situation is so common particularly in work but I do think women need to be more aware of it since it can potentially waste years of your life since if you're focused on him you open yourself to ongoing pain and frustration.

Note. I am not saying he's a bad person or anything like that but it is a pattern so common you have to start thinking 'what is he actually doing with me?'. Currently you see him as innocent, not knowing the impact he has on you, but maybe you should rethink that.


As I said your situation may not be like that at all, I guess there must surely be these situations where the man actually asks the woman out, leaves his wife/girlfriend and has a proper relationship with the colleague, it must happen but my observation is it is rare!

This below raises a red flag as it sounds like a line from a man who is flirting

. He tells me I've helped him figure out how to "go with the flow" in his life. He's in a much better place physically/mentally than when we met... and so am I. I attribute this largely to our time together and the ways we've helped each other grow as people.
hmmm so he is making you his guru :rolleyes:
sorry it's just a bit of a well known line, he's leading you on I think....but that is only what I think. But consider it is all very well you helping one another grow but the fact is you are now in emotional pain through his lack of transparency

I love this man and want only the best for him. But it hurts like hell to harbor these feelings knowing they may never be returned.
But the script is already written and it's only your relative inexperience (4) that prevents you from seeing it. He knows full well what effect he is having, he gets to flirt and gets all the gratification of your interest but you dare not ask anything of him because of course he has never actually made a move to you. Very convenient for him. You could remain 'confused' for years this way.

The other night, I asked the I Ching about him. Nothing specific. I just pictured him in my mind and thought of our relationship to each other to see what response I'd get.

64 Unchanging.

It gave me some hope. The various translations and the images like crossing a river or climbing a mountain, seem to imply that there could be some sort of resolution to this on the horizon soon, provided I don't screw it up like that little fox haha. (I did this with the Tarot too that night and drew the 9 of wands for anyone who dabbles in that).
This doesn't say there will be a resolution soon it says 'not yet across' , one is suspended in the middle of things where nothing is in it's right place. Unchanging this can mean things kind of are forever in the state of 'Not Yet'. Some experiences here


You are in a state of 'not yet' and could go on being like that indefinitely whilst he puts over heavy messages of attraction while simultaneously putting the burden of all that on you and taking no responsibility himself.

His recent increased level of attention towards me over the last few days has made me think of him even more than normal, so tonight I asked the oracle directly "will he ever love me back?" and received 4.2.5>20.
Seeing this answer I don't feel too bad in putting over my observations because this is precisely what you are being counselled to do here. Observe. Look at it. (20) And look at your own naivety (4) You have 29/30 change patterns here so there's a tension between the depths of emotion and insight and clarity. The way forward, the yin pattern would be I think to look and gain some distance and clarity over his behaviour. Rather than just see this as he innocently shows you good friendship/admiration/lots of attention while moaning about his partner and that you just have these awfully strong feelings you have some shame about perhaps really look at what is happening.

This is Inexperience's Looking, something like that or maybe Viewing's Inexperience. The lines however are quite open and free. It's possible perhaps that if you get to see what is happening much more clearly (no he really isn't the innocent here) you could make a better relationship with him? I'd say at the moment he is operating with a level of deceit at your expense - not that he means you harm consciously but it's not really good for you-Well what if you uncovered that a bit, made it more conscious, even indicate to him you are wondering about the nature of your friendship, that looks like a direction of growth. Line 2 is very open to learning through experience as is line 5.

So with this cast I'd think there would be more of a chance of him loving you back if first you took a very good clear headed even cynical look at what his behaviour is communicating (20) and how it makes you feel. Don't think of your feelings as something to be hidden or shameful because he did that and he knows he did it on some level. And in looking at and contemplating the situation between you, there's a very great deal that isn't known(4) and that you need to find out in an open and honest spirit. The more you can both see what you don't know the more chance there is for him to love you back. I'm not sure he can love you back when there is such a lack of clarity about what is really happening between you. Perhaps you could bring things into the open more. I do not think it would be good for you long term to simply have these feelings and him go on making all these signals but not acting on them. I think this is a kind of hopeful answer but it does require changing how you view this, it needs properly looking at (20). It's time not just for you to feel the feelings it's time for you think and see clearly about this and perhaps invite him into the exploration of what is happening between you. If he runs from such an honest open conversation well that's your answer and if he doesn't, if he stays to explore it with you that is a good result.


If you don't start to express and explore what you don't know about his feelings, your feelings, together, you could end up just being in this undetermined relationship for a long time (64) which I isn't a good idea for a 32 year old woman since it's a fairly pivotal age where wasting time on people who can't give you what you need is not ideal.
 
Last edited:

marybluesky

visitor
Joined
Jul 28, 2018
Messages
1,441
Reaction score
1,006
Hello;

64 says you can't be together at this time (and probably near future).

4.2.5> 20 sounds likes there's hope, you are young and have time. 20 invites you to observe the situation well.
 

isacosmo

visitor
Joined
Jan 10, 2022
Messages
83
Reaction score
33
A narcissist, seems to be. Check 'narcissistic disorder'.
 

marybluesky

visitor
Joined
Jul 28, 2018
Messages
1,441
Reaction score
1,006
I know the pattern of it and what's happening is not fair. Don't think for a moment he isn't aware of what he's doing, he's toying really with your feelings and then going home to his girlfriend while you go home alone to think about him.
@Chaosmos , I'm your age and tend to agree with Trojina on this.

The biggest example for me is my own experience with a boy with whom I felt a special connection and was sure I had a special place "in his heart" so to speak. He entered into a couple of relationships while we were friends and I waited for that magical day we can be finally together.

In the end, I decided to confess feelings and start a relationship with this guy at a time he was finally available; and guess what? He kept up repeating the same pattern very soon: becoming unavailable and returning when it was convenient for him. At this point I realized he has been aware of his behaviour's effect on me and used/abused it. He then said he didn't want a relationship because "he wasn't ready" despite having accepted my offer at first. I then stopped responding to his messages and forgot about him in a few months. There was nothing special to regret for.
 

Trojina

Supporter
Clarity Supporter
Joined
May 29, 2006
Messages
26,920
Reaction score
4,426
A narcissist, seems to be. Check 'narcissistic disorder'.
I don't think we can label him that really, we don't know him. This is a very common situation and not all those who act as he does can be called narcissists.
 

isacosmo

visitor
Joined
Jan 10, 2022
Messages
83
Reaction score
33
I don't think we can label him that really, we don't know him. This is a very common situation and not all those who act as he does can be called narcissists.
Not labelling. I said 'seems'. Also, you'd be surprised at the umpteen numbern of narcissists bumping against one another out there!
 

Chaosmos

visitor
Joined
Jan 10, 2022
Messages
8
Reaction score
5
I don't think we can label him that really, we don't know him. This is a very common situation and not all those who act as he does can be called narcissists.

Thanks for the feedback everyone. And holy crap Trojina, thank you. It hurt to read your response but I think that's because it rang so true. I know 4 can indicate a “you don't know what you don't know you don't know" situation, that's why I brought this reading here. I guess it's hard to see your own blind spots, especially in matters of the heart…

I'm sure you're right about this being a very common experience between men and women who work together (we were sort of coworkers for the first 6 months I knew him, but not anymore). I don't think he's a narcissist or intentionally trying to hurt or mislead me, but he must have some awareness (even on an unconscious level) that he's stringing me along. He refers to me frequently as “dude” in our text exchanges, which makes sense in this context. He can message me to his heart's desire, but if his girlfriend ever confronts him on the nature of our relationship the paper trail shows he always simply thought of me as a “friend”… just another one of the guys. (Though he’s bisexual so even THAT line has felt blurry at times.)

I will think about all of this and on 64 unchanging. Your right it could indicate a perpetual unresolved limbo-state with him. Recently I’ve been doing a lot of work on myself and staying very open to the potential of finding someone else. I’m in NYC and there are A LOT of other fish in the sea now. I do still harbor these intense feelings for him, but I’m not waiting around for him anymore. My personal growth has largely come from my relationship (or lack thereof) with him, and I wonder if these changes in me, and my growing confidence in myself are what’s piqued this recent increase in communication and attention? We hadn't seen each other in a while up until recently and I feel like a slightly "upgraded version" of myself now.

Thank you for the info on the change pattern too. Never heard of that before but it is very interesting.

I’m still trying to suss out what 64’s warning about the “little fox getting its tail wet” could be in this situation? Maybe openly prying him about the nature of our relationship will bring clarity to both of us, and help bring things to completion. But as I said, I do really value our close friendship, and I don't want to lose that. Even if it never evolves into romance, I still want him to be in my life. And the pain/frustration I’ve been feeling about this situation has been lessening since I’ve been doing my personal homework and opening myself up to the possibility of meeting someone new. So is the fox warning about stagnation, doing nothing, and getting stuck in old patterns? Or maybe about confronting him too directly and losing his friendship entirely?
 

Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom

Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).

Top