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sittingcat

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I wonder if anyone here can help me.

I am a relative newbee regarding the I-Ching (or Yi Jing). I have used it a few times. Sometimes the answer is gives is quite clear ( as in 33 Retreat - locked when I asked about a certain situation) and sometimes it is not so clear, which is why I am writing now.

There is a woman I am very fond of, who, as of late I have had some tensions with, so I have been keeping a low profile, staying out of here sight. Well today I have a chance to see her, at least go by where she works (for legitimate reasons) so I asked the I-Ching:

"In regards to x, what about stopping by the dept?
It gave me 43 Break-Through (Resoluteness), with 5 line changing, to 34 Great
Invigorating

Then I asked about the opposite:

"In regards to x, what about not stopping by the dept?
It gave me 29 The Abysmal, with 3 line changing, to 48 The Well.

Now having written this out, I think I know which one I will choose. But just for my own edification, would someone like to comment on the 2nd option, 29.3 to 48?
And for that matter, if you would like to comment on the first option, go ahead.

Thank you for your time and effort.
 

jeg

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Hi, Sittingcat. I think you've given a classic example of a problematic phrasing of a question. It's rarely a good idea to phrase a question in the negative.

If you ask "What about doing this", and the Yi answers yes or no (obviously somewhat more subtly than that), then the answer is plain. If you ask "What about not doing this", and the Yi says yes, then is it agreeing that you should not, or saying yes, you should? Similarly, if the Yi says no, then . . . you get the point. It gets ambiguous.

Also, I think the answer was plain after your first question. You asked, "in regards to x, what about stopping by the dept?" Yi says "In dealing with weeds, firm resolution is necessary. Walking in the middle Remains free of blame." Don't let the commentary to the lines confuse you. Apply it to your situation. The weeds are, I think, the tensions you've had with x. Walking in the middle could be not having a view point that is excessively one way or the other ~ maybe compromise somewhere? This all happens in a time of breakthrough, leading to Great Invigorating.

Sometimes it's good to ask a question phrased positively and then negatively. However, ask positively first (you did), and if the answer is plain straightaway, then don't ask twice.

Hope this helps, and good luck in your love life!

Jeg.
 

sittingcat

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Thank you for your responge Jeg, I appreciate all the help I can get in understanding the I Ching. I will ask in the positive from now on.
 

heylise

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If you ask the Yi for a yes or no answer, it probably is indeed better not to ask in the negative. But the real use of the Yi is clearing up, making your own intuition speak up, and for that, a negative question can be very good. Even the Shang did that, before the Zhou: "will there be a good harvest?", and right after that "will there maybe not be a good harvest?". Often they made the one they rather did not want a bit weaker, instead of 'not' they said 'maybe not'. Always a good idea not to bring the spirits on wrong ideas.
But even they asked for a 'yes' (and please no 'no').

I think the positive question gave the answer: a good idea to do so. The line with the weeds has to do with hard work needed if you want to achieve something. And maybe that you will need more than only meeting her: a big effort too. The negative question: your intention will be drowned in all that 29-water, and you will need new 48-inspiration for a next opportunity.

LiSe
 

wanderer

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This note is not about the I Ching, but from my own experience.

When I experience tensions in a situation, or someone who is clearly negative, I usually tend to think it is about me. I wonder why this person is upset with me.

What I have discovered over the years is that most of the time, the person is upset over something else in their life and totally unaware of me. Perhaps someone they love is sick, or there is a split in a long relationship.

Often a simple showing of care or interest has a remarkable effect in tense situations. Sometimes the meanest acting person melts with a little tenderness. Of course sometimes they just get angrier, but I find that it is worth the risk.
 
C

cheiron

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What goes on in others is often about their own dynamics, true.

And what is going on in the Querrant is not always what the innitial question states!!!

And yes, showing a little care or interest is often good? When it is resolving small tensions which come before the life giving rains.

But the Yi Jing can take us to a far more advanced position than this!

For example... this bland advice would be unfitting if this person were in an inappropriate liaison with different lessons to learn from this meeting? You could be undoing lessons here. This situation could even carry dangers. N?est ce pas?!

People often have a sense of situations they do not report, at first? or ever!

Quick advice is poor advice ? Life and relationships are complex.

Giving council is a grave thing? never to be undertaken lightly? and Never, ever, without deep thought and reflection.

I know you have a lot of insight and wisdom on much in life? So this directness is said with respect. (OK cross too)

Advice giving is not the way of the Yi either?

Sorry to be so direct ? I am cross with this.
 

sittingcat

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LiSe, Wanderer, & Cheiron thanks for you insights and help. I really appreciate it.

Cheiron, would you give me your take on the hexagrams I got? And would you also elaborate on your statement "But the Yi Jing can take us to a far more advanced position than this!"

Thank you
 

wanderer

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Kevin,

there are indeed situations where avoidance is the best policy. But to infer inappropriate motives on one or both parties seems rather odd. Being a caring person when receiving negative energy is rarely wrong as long as the motives are compassionate and not selfish/ That judgement is beyond my (or your) knowledge.

to be cross and to label this observation bland seems to have more personal implications.
 
C

cheiron

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Dear Sitting Cat

First off - my apologies for crashing in and disrupting your thread.

I do hope you did not feel I was casting aspersions on you in any way? non at all were intended.

Sadly you have had the some of the best people responding and there is little I can fruitfully add to your reading.

However maybe these ideas may be of some use as you seem to have started to delve into the Yi Jing.

First thing: Everyone who persists in this ?difficult to access at first book? sems to develop a very personal relationship with it. These ideas are mine some will be shared with others and some will not? If I knew what the mainstream was I would try and keep in those waters. But I don?t.

Forgive me if you have these ?knowings? already.


Synchronicity:
One of the first things I started noticing after starting to explore the Yi Jing was the synchronicity of life. Things that are unrelated happen in such a way that some path opens or another event happens which is very helpful. As if they were all interlinked.

An example: You give a hitcher a lift in your car his wallet falls out of his pocket as he is leaving and you do not notice? but later you do? going through it tio find his address to return it you see a job advert torn from a paper? you need a job. You return the wallet apply for the job and get an interview? it is the very same man who shows you into his fathers office? and tells his father about your honesty?you get the job.

Synchronicity can happen in a myriad of ways!

My experience of using the Yi Jing over many years is that one not only gets to see it at the very earliest stage (before it unfolds) but that it seems to happen more often? much more often? almost as if we create it. This relates to the next idea.

Being in accord with the time:
This is an injunction that threads its way throughout the whole Yi Jing?indeed it may even be said to be one of its core principles. When I first started using the Yi Jing it seemed a sensible thing. One does not go to a wedding dressed for Scuba Diving (Well actually I do know people who would? best let that pass though).

But there is much more to it than that. By throwing the coins, or whatever, one can get a sense not just what is likely to happen, but also see these possibilities embedded in time and space which has particular qualities to it. Each Hexagram represents a certain time/space nature or quality and carries within it potentials for different things to happen depending on how you manage that time and space yourself.

Gradually one comes to recognise the feel of the time/space one is in one is able to feel the pitfalls and potentialities and the best way of proceeding outside as well as the best way to ?hold yourself? within. This is truly being in accord with the time.

Being Connected:
This is very similar to the ?Being in Accord with the Time.? ? When one uses the Yi Jing often there comes a growing knowledge / feeling that one is connecting to the time issue even though one is not present at the place of action. One may be doing a reading to find out if a distant love one is OK. For many reasons that connection is not there sometimes. One senses it as one is doing the reading? at those times I find the readings I am doing may reflect not the question I wrote down but the question I was holding in my heart? maybe something that was bugging me. Sometimes something urgent I need to address and which has not come to my attention.

Being Connected means a lot else too? these all become apparent in time.

It tool me a great while to develop a facility with the Yi Jing? and it still continues to develop.

Oh, another divination thing to watch? the Yi Jing has a hell of a good sense of humour? it will pull your leg and it will, if you let it, make you laugh when you wanted to know something you thought was deadly serious. With a bit of practice you will get the joke and see why it was making one. (Chuckles)


Destiny; Fate and Foreknowing:
Now this might be a little controversial. Many people, my self included, come to the Yi Jing, at first, to get an edge on what is going to happen? very useful it is too.

I do not believe the future is fixed? Well sometimes it is and sometimes it isn?t.

Borrowing an example of someone else who wrote on this site sometime ago. They told the story of some ancient captured soldiers who were imprisoned and were going to be sacrificed or executed.

These soldiers ?fate? was fairly well fixed. No, it wasn?t! They chose to die by rushing the guards in a bid for freedom. The chose their Destiny.

As one uses the Yi Jing one realises that there are times when things are fairly fixed. That is that the energies acting in a space time are so strong and flowing strongly in a given direction (or completely frozen) that acting within them to change things is all but impossible. The Yi Jing often advises one to wait or be still in these times? but not always. And sometimes one has to see the best way of being and cultivate stillness or an inner world posture which is most appropriate.

Often these ?fixed times? are indicated by a lack of ?transforming lines?, but again not always.

Sometimes seemingly bad things turn out for the best? Again someone on these threads told a very good tale which in part involved the Villagers consoling a farmer because his fantastically good mare ran off and was lost? he replied, ?What bad fortune do you mean. How is this bad?? They were bemused of course but said nothing. A week later the mare returned and brought with it a few beautiful stallions.

In this way what appears to be good is not always so as well. I have taken to wishing people ?What they need? It seems safer. (Chuckling).

There is a tendency, sometimes, for folk to forget they are creative beings and slavishly following the Yi Jing all of the time lessens their opportunity to be creative. We were all born with an independent will? it is my belief that we should develop and exercise that too.

Lastly. There are times when the Yi Jing will simply refuse to answer. Follow up questions might elicit: ?You don?t need to know that?, or ?Mon of your business, concentrate on what you need to address.? Sometimes it simply won?t say why!

Well, these opinions are free? hope there was something in them which is useful to you.

Hope you stick around? there are quite a lot of seriously able people here and there is most often offered when requested.

Hopefully we are all learning too ;)

Warm regards

--Kevin
 

sittingcat

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Cheiron, no apologies necessary. I am happy for the input.

I have been reading the various threads on this site for a short while and I have to agree with you that I have been lucky to have some of the best people respond to my question, yourself included.

Thank you for passing these ideas and insights along. I know I'm not the only one who will benefit from them. I hope by using the Yi Jing I can open up my intuition to these things.

I will stick around this site and continue to soak up what I can and ask more questions from time to time.

SC
 

gene

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I think what Kevin is saying is well documenting that the I Ching is not just an "automatic response system." It is a sage, in a sense, a higher being. It has an intelligence, and to a certain extent, a personality. Though not, I think, an attitude. It doesn't have to answer us. It is not required. The sad part is that it is so easy to misinterpret. So hard to get the full meaning. So tricky in its applications, yet usually there for us, and gives us what we can absorb in the moment.

Gene
 

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