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Credibilty - and 44 unchanging

Lavalamp

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So I asked the Yi about a person with grandious and extravagent plans and schemes. A person who near as I can tell, is a bit eccentric because of unusually high intelligence and life accomplishments, not because of living in a fantasy world or being out of touch with reality. Person is likely quite wealthy, yet has lived far from wealth or any such lifestyle for long periods of time.
How credible is X?
44 Unchanging.
Seems like the Yi is saying this person is a person of power, extremely credible, used to giving commands and making plans and has considerable vision and heavenly fortune. And this kind of thing could totally upset a person's applecart and daily life!
Assuming it is a direct answer to a direct question. What do you think? Thanks...
- LL
 

Lavalamp

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Look at that - a question about 44 posted at 4:04! ;)
 

rosada

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The image for 44 seems to describe someone who has traveled the world and has seen a lot. However the Judgement makes me think you personally should be careful of getting too caught up in their stories.
 

steve

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I agree with above, it depends also on how the oracle has answered you, is this your perception on the person in question or is Yi directly answering your question.
my experience with hexagram 44 is that things are not always what they seem.
Please update the thread if something changes I would be really interested to see what happens, I could be completely wrong.

Steve
 

Lavalamp

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Well - sometimes I think of 44 relative to Chinese Astrology, specifically the year of the Fire Horse. Asian men will not marry a firehorse woman, Parents will go to great extremes not to have a fire horse child because if it is a girl this is considered the worst auspice possible. Huge deal in Asia. But the character of the fire horse is actually considered a good thing in a man.
So here in 44 you have this odd dichotomy, a judgment of marriage/commitment to this woman being without use value, and an image saying yet, this is how a Prince carries out and proclaims his mandate. Perhaps this is similar to the firehorse aspect, an example of the rigidness of male - female roles in Confucianism - maybe even of Asian misogyny.
Men are expected to lead with a certain detachment when serving in a public way, but that is not the role of women to lead and command others, rather her role should properly be one of personal loyalty always and not detached like public leadership - or something like that?
The Prince will have plans and schemes he must advance to do what heaven expects. But 44 seems to say when it is a woman, it is not appropriate.
- LL
 
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Lavalamp

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Ah - I think I have it. Let's call 44 "The Power Of Persuasion."
The Prince has an agenda - an important public agenda - so he uses all his powers of persuasion to convince people how important it is, so they will go along. Here in 44, you have a person with an agenda that is also very persuasive. Lise says "Carrying out a mandate cannot be done alone, it needs the connection with the others, the understanding, the influence. The prince "gives directions", a goal, movement."
But the advice cautions one about forgetting that what is in the Prince's interest isn't always going to help or be useful to you. Yet - it could be the start of something big...
- LL
 

moss elk

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How credible is X?
44 Unchanging.

I want to translate your question into this:
Render a judgement/what do I need to know about joining with this person?
(Because that was what you were really asking)

Reading: 44 unchanging.
And translating that into this:
Don't do it, it would be more than you bargained for. (And not in a good way)
 

rosada

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Yeah, if hexagram 44 is describing a person I think it says he's a scoundrel. I'm not saying he is of course, I'm just trying to interpret the hexagram.
 

Lavalamp

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Moss Elk, I am of the school that questions must be clear in order to get a clear answer. I was not asking about joining, although that may be *a* question, I was asking about the credibility of the person.
Rosada, I wonder how "scoundrel" would apply to the idea that this is the way a Prince acts.
This hexagram seems a bit bipolar, on the one hand there is a powerful possibly negative influence - you could scale that down to "persuasion." The agenda for a loose woman could be to give birth to an heir, making her position solid. But what of the agenda for a Prince? What about someone who is trying to carry out a mandate - presumably heaven's purpose?
Maybe I'm getting too far away from a simple answer, but some translations differ a bit on this hex... My question was about credibility, being able to deliver on ideas and plans.
Most of that will become clear in due course though...
- LL
 

rosada

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I certainly hope you'll keep us updated on how this plays out!
 

Lavalamp

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Sure Rosada.
I wonder if 44 actually indicates a kind of personality, does not actually indicate whether they are altruistic or not, rather saying both altruistic and self interested people act in this way.
Certainly getting caught up in someone else's cause can cost you, whether it serves the common good or not, even if it is the Prince's agenda common people might rather not be so obligated.
Or maybe the "so does the Prince act" idea contains an aspect of someone acting above their station in life.
- LL
 

rosada

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By the way, I love the idea that hexagrams can maybe be a teensy bit bi-polar.
Also by the way, I was thinking about this thread and started hearing the song "Hotel California" in my mind. Doesn't that go with the idea of a powerful maiden one should not marry? "Welcome to the Hotel California. Such a lovely place...You can check in, but you can never leave." Oh, and consider the image: The Eagles flying about singing this song to the four quarters of heaven - just like princes disseminating their commands...
Anyway, I think the hex can be connected with the story of Ulysses and the sirens, so maybe the man you asked about is really very strong minded and able to resist distractions and stay focused. Or else he is the distraction....:rolleyes:
 

moss elk

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lavalamp,
if you keep focusing on the image,
you will miss the overall meaning of the hexagram.
 

Lavalamp

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I have read most of what people here have said on this hex Moss Elk. I love how sometimes Charly offers insight on translations. But if I focus on Lise's translation, she says
"Gòu, Birthing
Woman power. No use to grab the woman.
The great image says: Everywhere under Heaven there is Wind: the heir. The prince carries out his mandate, proclaiming it to the four regions."

One could take this to mean this is a powerful situation where the ONLY thing you can do is follow. You can't grab her - conform someone you what you want. There is something compelling going on that you cannot control, and there is no use in trying to.

-LL
 

moss elk

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One could take this to mean this is a powerful situation where the ONLY thing you can do is follow. You can't grab her*

You can refrain from grabbing it. If you do grab it, then you get dragged along by something you can't control.
(like a dog biting a car tire) So the smart thing is to avoid it.
 
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steve

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Hi again Lavalamp,

I used to get this hex often when i first joined the forum, it was about a girl I was seeing, she was quite a bit younger and really loved sex, what I found a later it wasnt with just me, I kept getting this reading and kept twisting the reading to suit what I wanted to see. I was a lot less experienced in the reading of the Yi. I have learned so much since joining.
So when I see the hex now I cant help but be wary depending on the context of the reading. I cant help thinking that maybe the stories maybe possibly exaggerated and thats all.
Yi maybe simply advising you to be wary dont go in hook line and sinker.

PS Rosada I love the image of hotel California associated with the hexagram thats exactly how I feel about the hexagram, that is really about things being not what they seem. " this could be heaven or this could be hell" I actually sung that song at karaoke about a week ago funny enough.
At the end he is running down corridors trying to get out of there. A bit like my experience.

Steve
 

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