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SHONNA_D

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Is iching always gives answers about our future or sometimes shows pictures from our past?
 

Liselle

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It can show you whatever you ask it, whatever your question is.

You could try asking it something about the past, and see what it says. Maybe something that you've never understood ("What was happening?") or for a time when something that went wrong, maybe you could ask "How could I have handled that better?" or "How could I have prevented that?"
 
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SHONNA_D

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Liselle I understand what you mean. The question is does iching answer about the past even if when you ask for the future?

For instance I asked yesterday if I will make a relationship with somebody who will love me.
The answer was 55.1> 62 The answer upsets me. I have seen line 55.1 for short term relationships such as my last one. Just wondering if iching answered me about my last short relationship... or one more relationship like this it's coming... :hissy:
 

Liselle

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55.1
'Meeting your partner and lord, Though for ten days, no mistake. Going on brings honour.'

Well...I see your point. Your question was about the future - will you ever have a good relationship - but the answer seems to be about your last relationship (or else telling you you'll never have anything more than short-term ones - hopefully not that).

By any chance did you ask that question while thinking about your last relationship? I'm envisioning something like: you're very upset about what happened, so you ask Yi, plaintively and in some despair, whether things will ever be any better. If your question and mindset were very bound up with what just happened, then it's possible Yi's answer is, too.

Yi might be saying that this last relationship - no matter how it feels to you now - was "no mistake," and in fact was a "partner and lord" - you can learn something important from it that will help you in future relationships? Yi might also be reassuring you that it was never meant to last more than "ten days" (a short time). In other words, don't blame yourself that it ended quickly.

"Going on brings honour" - I'm not sure exactly what this means, but it seems to say the honorable thing to do here is just to go on. Don't dwell on what happened. It's over, it's supposed to be over...something like that. Or maybe it means that actual honor of some sort will come from moving on - a better relationship?

Hexagram 55 overall says much the same thing:
'Abundance, creating success.
The king is present to it.
Do not mourn.
A fitting sacrifice at noon.'


Again - "do not mourn" - don't spend time lamenting the past - "go on."

Hexagram 55 itself is about a king dying just as he was about to lead his army into battle. His son had to decide whether to follow protocol - a period of mourning for his father - or to abandon that and immediately proceed with war. There was a heavenly sign (an eclipse, or sun spots), which he interpreted as "go forth!" He did, and successfully overthrew an oppressive regime.
 

regardie

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Hi!

If it answers on a past situation, or issue, what's the purpose of it? to remember and not repeat?
 
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SHONNA_D

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Liselle you shared some very interesting information about hexagram 55. Thank you!
Hmm do you think that the answer is about my last relationship? I have never seen Iching gives answers about the past when you ask about the future. So why I am wondering... Is it happening? But I have seen that iching sometimes points out sth different than our question.
Regardie I have the same question as yours. What's the purpose if this happening?
 

Liselle

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Yes, I do think the reading was about your last relationship.

Yi might be saying that this last relationship - no matter how it feels to you now - was "no mistake," and in fact was a "partner and lord" - you can learn something important from it that will help you in future relationships? Yi might also be reassuring you that it was never meant to last more than "ten days" (a short time). In other words, don't blame yourself that it ended quickly.


Of course that might be entirely wrong - it's just what I thought of when I read what you wrote and saw the reading.

But if it doesn't sound right to you, then that's probably not what it means. (Since it's your situation, not mine.)

But in general, yes, I think Yi can very well do this sort of thing - use the past to help talk about the present or the future. Line 1s (when the bottom, lowest line of a hexagram is changing) can sometimes be about the past. If there are multiple moving lines, sometimes there's a time progression through them. Lower lines can be nearer to you in time, and upper lines can be more distant.

(That's not always true, though. They're not always about stages of time.)
 

charly

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... I asked yesterday if I will make a relationship with somebody who will love me.
The answer was 55.1> 62 The answer upsets me. I have seen line 55.1 for short term relationships such as my last one...
Hi, Shonna D:

An almost literal translation of the received traditional text:


遇其配主
yu4 qi2 pei4 zhu3
MEETING ONE'S DESERVED HOST (1)


雖旬无咎
sui1 xun2 wu2 jiu4
EVEN_IF 10_DAYS/10_YEARS, NO WRONG. (2)
Even if for only a week or for ten years, not a mistake.

往有尚。
wang3 you3 shang4
GOING HAS MERIT. (3)
Going with purpose, behaving with a goal is worthy.

Nothing about that the relation will be short. Don't worry. What matters is if the LOVE IS TRUE. If both fit well, if he deserves you, if you deserve him.

But, of course, NOBODY'S PERFECT, though love be true it can fall short. Then, don't worry for the short or long term, ENJOY IT WHILE IT LASTS.

HAVE YOUR GOAL IN MIND, and if you have to take the initiative don't fear to take it.

At least that is what 55.1 says to me. I don't know if it fits to you.

All the best,

Charly

_____________________________________
(1) xu3 has many meanings: leader, master, lord, owner, host. Somebody wandering for love is like a fugitive looking for a refuge, that's why I prefer HOST/HOSTESS here.

(2) xun2 is a period of 10 days (the old chinese week) or also a period of 10 YEARS. Say, no matters if the duration is short or long. All is relative with time.

(3) wang3 has the sense of going in a direction, moving wit a purpose, to proceed.

FOR SEEING THE UNICODE CHINESE CHARACTERS GO TO THREAD TOOLS > PRINTABLE VERSION HERE:

Ch.
 

moss elk

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The answer upsets me. I have seen line 55.1 for short term relationships such as my last one.
This has also been my experience of the line.

Maybe you'll have one more short one before a long term one.
I don't think this is about the past.
 
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SHONNA_D

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Thank you all for your posts!
Just a quick question to Charly: Could you please share with us what you use for the literal translations? (books, internet sites etc.)

10 days and 10 years it's a big difference ;)
 
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SHONNA_D

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I think Yi can very well do this sort of thing - use the past to help talk about the present or the future. Line 1s (when the bottom, lowest line of a hexagram is changing) can sometimes be about the past. If there are multiple moving lines, sometimes there's a time progression through them. Lower lines can be nearer to you in time, and upper lines can be more distant.

(That's not always true, though. They're not always about stages of time.)

This is what I mean, If Yi use the past to help talk about the future... I have made a lot of questions about my future love life and sometimes I feel that Iching is referred to my last relationship. This is something that we have to learn through experience I guess.

Moreover, thank you for the additional information about the past present and future. I have read about the changing lines and the time reference. About questions with time reference I use to put a time limit like asking for a certain year or season or days etc.
 
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SHONNA_D

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This has also been my experience of the line.

Maybe you'll have one more short one before a long term one.
I don't think this is about the past.

Moss Elk do you see from my answer that?
 

moss elk

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Moss Elk do you see from my answer that?

Well, I can only say that my own experience and understanding of the line is like yours. It sounds like a fling to me.
As if someone is going to come in to your life for a short time, and it would be good. Not like a short relationship that ends badly, but is just short in duration, and is actually good for you somehow.
Life can be strange.

Here was my shortest romance, and it feels like 55.1.
In 1993 I was driving a taxi in chicago.
Around midnight a woman hailed me, with a suitcase in her hand.
She got inside and was sobbing. (And quite lovely) I asked if she was ok, and she said something bad had just happened. She told me how her ex-boyfriend called her in Michigan and told her to come in to town for the weekend to get back together. He bought her an airline ticket and she flew into town. When she entered his home, she saw another woman sit on his lap. (The man was cruel, he had her travel just to have her witness this, and then angrily kick her out of his house.) I comforted her and after a while she stopped crying and started laughing. She asked me how much money I would make that night working. I told her. She pulled out a big stack of money and handed some to me. ($300 U.S.) She asked me to keep her company that night because she didn't know anyone in town, and so she didn't have to be alone. I agreed. We went to a restaurant, ate and talked, later to two nightclubs. We drank wine. She had me dance with her. (I don't dance.) But I did that night. We socialized with other couples and spontaneously cocreated a story that we were married and that I was a sailor on shore leave for the week. (It was better than telling the truth.) Around 5am she asked to come home with me. We just held each other and fell asleep. It was sweet and loving. The next morning she told me that I was her guardian angel before she left for the airport. Twenty four years later I don't recall her name, but I won't forget the night.
 
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Freedda

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Liselle I understand what you mean. The question is does iching answer about the past even if when you ask for the future?

For instance I asked yesterday if I will make a relationship with somebody who will love me.
The answer was 55.1> 62 The answer upsets me. I have seen line 55.1 for short term relationships such as my last one. Just wondering if iching answered me about my last short relationship... or one more relationship like this it's coming... :hissy:

Shonna, I suggest you might want look at the sticky at the top of this forum about hexagrams being good or bad.

One way to look at the I Ching is as a book of divination, where you're asking about the future, for example: will I meet a tall handsome/beautiful stranger, etc.

Another way is more as a guide to what might be our best attitude or course of action. In this case, sometimes the Yi might point to a habit or frame of mind that we need to change, before we can gain an intended outcome. A gross example: that we need to learn to love ourselves before we can have a wholesome relationship.

Looking at it this way, past and future become less an emphasis - it might only be implying that we perhaps need to learn from the past to get the best outcome for the future.

As to your reading, I don't see anything bad or wrong with 55.1.

Regards, David.
 
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SHONNA_D

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Here was my shortest romance, and it feels like 55.1.
In 1993 I was driving a taxi in chicago.
Around midnight a woman hailed me, with a suitcase in her hand.
She got inside and was sobbing. (And quite lovely) I asked if she was ok, and she said something bad had just happened. She told me how her ex-boyfriend called her in Michigan and told her to come in to town for the weekend to get back together. He bought her an airline ticket and she flew into town. When she entered his home, she saw another woman sit on his lap. (The man was cruel, he had her travel just to have her witness this, and then angrily kick her out of his house.) I comforted her and after a while she stopped crying and started laughing. She asked me how much money I would make that night working. I told her. She pulled out a big stack of money and handed some to me. ($300 U.S.) She asked me to keep her company that night because she didn't know anyone in town, and so she didn't have to be alone. I agreed. We went to a restaurant, ate and talked, later to two nightclubs. We drank wine. She had me dance with her. (I don't dance.) But I did that night. We socialized with other couples and spontaneously cocreated a story that we were married and that I was a sailor on shore leave for the week. (It was better than telling the truth.) Around 5am she asked to come home with me. We just held each other and fell asleep. It was sweet and loving. The next morning she told me that I was her guardian angel before she left for the airport. Twenty four years later I don't recall her name, but I won't forget the night.

Moss Elk thank you for sharing your experience with line 1 of Hexagram 55! Indeed, it was a very short period of time!
My own experience with line 1 was a 4 months relationship . "No mistake"

I have one more question. Do you know from your experience how far in the future can iching see? I am sure for 6 months till 1 year.
 

Liselle

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Has anyone shown you this link?
https://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/fri...42-Blog-post-Advice-for-relationship-readings
It's a really good article Hilary wrote on relationship questions, although it's mostly for asking about existing relationships, not finding one.

(When I look at that in my browser, there's a lot of garbled characters. If it's like that in your browser, here's another place to read the same thing: https://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2011/04/25/advice-for-relationship-readings/ )

Anyway, are you saying you want to know something like, "Will I [have a serious relationship / be married / whatever] in the next 5 years?"

You could ask that question. Just put the time period in the question.

But yes/no questions aren't really the best. People do ask them, and even have good success with them -
the thing is, though, Yi doesn't have a way to say exactly "yes" or "no" like a person could. It might imply "yes" or "no" in amongst the other information it will give you. So just be aware of that, and interpret your answer accordingly. Or, you might be better off wording your question in a more Yi-friendly way in the first place, like:
  • "What is my potential for [a serious relationship / marriage / whatever] in the next [time period]?"
  • "How can I find [a good boyfriend / a husband] in [time period]?" (er - sometimes I ask things like, "How can I find my misplaced library book?" so maybe this might work?)
  • "What should I understand about my potential for marriage in [time period]?"
  • "How can I increase my potential for getting married in [time period]?"
  • Etc.
As with all questions, you do have to be prepared for Yi not to play along the way you want it to. It'll have its reasons, but it can be confusing, because it also doesn't have a way to tell you, "I'm changing the subject a tiny bit now." You just have to sort of recognize that maybe it doesn't seem like a direct answer to your exact question.

When you're writing a question, it might help to keep in mind other sorts of things Yi can and cannot say. For example, "Where will I meet my husband?" This may or may not even be knowable currently, but if it is, Yi can't say, "At the Starbucks on Maple Street." The best it could do is hint, which may or may not be satisfying to you.

E.g. it might say, "Waiting with food and drink. Constancy, good fortune." (That's the text for hexagram 5, line 5.) But think of the possibilities - it could mean:
  • The Starbucks on Maple Street
  • Any other eating/drinking establishment you might ever go to
  • The grocery store
  • Your best friend's Christmas party
  • Any place or occasion where you're relaxing (that line often means, while you're waiting, just relax and enjoy yourself)
  • Etc., etc.
So...it's not telling you nothing, but it might not be as useful in real life as you were hoping for.

If you really wanted to know if it would help to spend every spare moment at Starbucks, you could put the location in the question: "Potential for meeting my husband at Starbucks?" Who knows what Yi would say, though.

This is more than you asked about. I got carried away, sorry...
 
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SHONNA_D

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Actually Thank you very much! your post is so useful! ;)
I make all this kind of questions but the most of them is a yes or no answer but I absolutely agree with you.
You have given me ideas for questions.
 

rosada

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The question, "Will I make a relationship with someone who will love me?" is a "Yes or No" question, that is, the question is phrased in such a way that it requires a yes or no answer but the I Ching has no hexagrams that mean yes or no. All hexagrams can be interpreted to mean yes and all hexagrams can be interpreted to mean no.

When we do ask a yes or no question my experience has been that the I Ching seems to mirror your situation back to you. 55.1 describes two people who are very compatible and who will work well together whether their time together is short or long. As a response to the question, "Will I make a relationship with someone who will love me?" this answer appears to be saying that you are wanting this sort of relationship - it is mirroring back to you what you are looking for. I think this is a very encouraging answer as it suggests you know what you are looking for - a good solid relationship - and this is the most important thing - our intention - in creating what we want. Often we SAY we want something but our actions all show we are intending something different. So the I Ching is saying you have a clear intention in alignment with what you really want and that is the first step in manifesting. So from that I would deduce you could take this reading as a "Yes!"
Maybe 62. Attention to Detail is drawing your attention to the fact you did not include "long lasting" in your description of the relationship you are wanting to create.

So the I Ching seems to be saying, "You are looking for 55.1 a good relationship that will be similar to what you've experienced in the past except for this 62. one tiny detail - you want it to be long lasting." Although you might mutter to yourself after receiving such a response and wonder, "Great - how does that help me?" But knowing what you are looking for - being clear - can help you manifest it. And of course sometimes if the mirrored answer is negative it can help you wake up and realize how you need to change the signals you've been putting out.
 
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charly

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Thank you all for your posts!
Just a quick question to Charly: Could you please share with us what you use for the literal translations? (books, internet sites etc.) 10 days and 10 years it's a big difference ;)
Hi Shonna:

If you are interested in translation from the chinese I advise you to begin with the Zhou Yi, say the earlier core text without commentaries.

First you will need a reliable traditional chinese transcription in a usable support, copy / paste allowed:
Beware with the parsing. Dots didn't exist in the time of Zhous, you must put the dots where it make more sense to you.

1935 Harvard-Yenching Zhouyi, Unicode transcription by Steve Marshall, here:

Chinese Text Project. The Book of Changes in the site of Donald Sturgeon, here:

Matrix Translation in the second volume of The Book of Changes: Yijing (I Ching) - Word By Word, by Bradford Hatcher in free read-only pdf (there is also PayPal option). Here:

Second you'll need some online applications for annotation and consult

MDBG online dictionary and annotation tool, pasting a sequence of chinese characters will bring pinyin phonetics and english meanings for each character traditional or simplified. Here:

Lin Yutang chinese english on line dictionary accesible word by word using characters, pinyin, radicals or english, here:

Rick Harbaugh’s Zhongwen Traditional Chinese Characters Genealogy and Dictionary, here:

Rick Sears' Chinese Etymology, accesable by character, brings traditional/simplified, pinyin, english meanings, ancient calligraphies available in oracle, bronze and seal scripts. Here:

Being modern dictionaries what meanings were in use 3.000 years ago and what not is a problem.

A little help can be ABC Etymological Dictionary of Old Chinese by Axel Schuessler. Available in pdf here:

(to be continued)

All the best,

Charly
 
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SHONNA_D

Guest
Hi Shonna:

If you are interested in translation from the chinese I advise you to begin with the Zhou Yi, say the earlier core text without commentaries.

First you will need a reliable traditional chinese transcription in a usable support, copy / paste allowed:
Beware with the parsing. Dots didn't exist in the time of Zhous, you must put the dots where it make more sense to you.

1935 Harvard-Yenching Zhouyi, Unicode transcription by Steve Marshall, here:

Chinese Text Project. The Book of Changes in the site of Donald Sturgeon, here:

Matrix Translation in the second volume of The Book of Changes: Yijing (I Ching) - Word By Word, by Bradford Hatcher in free read-only pdf (there is also PayPal option). Here:

Second you'll need some online applications for annotation and consult

MDBG online dictionary and annotation tool, pasting a sequence of chinese characters will bring pinyin phonetics and english meanings for each character traditional or simplified. Here:

Lin Yutang chinese english on line dictionary accesible word by word using characters, pinyin, radicals or english, here:

Rick Harbaugh�s Zhongwen Traditional Chinese Characters Genealogy and Dictionary, here:

Rick Sears' Chinese Etymology, accesable by character, brings traditional/simplified, pinyin, english meanings, ancient calligraphies available in oracle, bronze and seal scripts. Here:

Being modern dictionaries what meanings were in use 3.000 years ago and what not is a problem.

A little help can be ABC Etymological Dictionary of Old Chinese by Axel Schuessler. Available in pdf here:

(to be continued)

All the best,

Charly

Back to school! lol
Thank you so much I have so many things to study!
 

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