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20.4 to 12 or 12.4 to 20

Lettuce

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Which of the above readings would be better for a relationship outcome:20.4 to 12 or 12.4 to 20They both talk about splitting apart (12). So are they both less positive readings for a relationship outcomeI’d love a bit of input. I have quite a strong idea about 12.4 to 20The blocages will give way if it serves a higher/greater good but not sure about 20.4 to 12Thanks in advance to anyone who replies
 
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diamanda

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Happy new year Lettuce and everyone :)

20.4 > 12 as applied to a relationship, would show a very temporary relationship, but pleasant while it lasts.

12.4 > 20 as applied to a relationship, would show that the two are in essence incompatible. One of the two has ulterior motives, or is functioning on principles other than love. The higher good that you mention is not exactly accurate. The character used in this line (ming) is the same character which in line 49.4 is translated as command, government, mandate. This same character can also mean life or fate. Line 12.4 says "there is ming". So, either there's already a decision, or there's already fate at work. As about the rest of the line text, that is also debatable. Wilhelm translates it as "partake of the blessing", however the actual characters say "departing from happiness". In my experience with this particular cast, there is no happiness (nor love) involved.

Which one would be better... tough choice. The first one gives a fleeting pleasure but results in bitterness. In the second one there's no pleasure and it results in thinking how different the two people are (or, one of the two is trying to get the upper hand). Neither 12 nor 20 are good for relationships. 12 is self explanatory, and 20 shows an imbalance in power.
 

Lettuce

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Thank you so much for giving such an I depth reading. I was really struggling with these lines
 

Lettuce

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Could 12.4 be a fated relationship. What you said is most certainly true - the two parties are unable to find the appropriate balanceAnd the the 20.4 relationship is ending bitterly so thanks for seeing what I could not
 
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diamanda

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I'm so sorry to hear it's ending bitterly... Line 20.4 does feel great while it lasts, so I guess the bitterness is a case of "but it felt so good, why is this not continuing?".

A fated relationship... maybe. It depends on how each of us sees fate. 12.4 shows that this is how things are - something is already decided upon. As in, there's no action to be taken which could alter the train of events at this stage, all we can do is look up to someone/something and await the verdict. This line also says 'no error', so if things are not working out as you wanted, then rest assured it's not something you did or didn't do. The theme of authority is strong in both these readings. Perhaps who has control is more important to this person than love.

What is fate to you?
 

Lettuce

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I wish one day I could master the iching with such depth. It feels like there is so much to learn! Thank you for sharing your knowledge it helps so much
 

marybluesky

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Hello Lettuce!

12.4 is pretty positive: "He who acts at the command of the highest remains without blame. Those of like mind partake of the blessing." The blockage ends if you act correctly: like-minded people join you- if the person in question is a good match, they come closer; if not, you'll meet better companions.

20.4 may be more positive: "Contemplation of the light of the kingdom. It furthers one to exert influence as the guest of a king." You are in a position to use your influence on the king to get out of the "blockage" (your question's context). You have more power as the subject of this line.

None is negative.
 

Lettuce

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Thank you Marybluesky for giving me further insight into this combo
 

rosada

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I see 12 not so much as indicating splitting apart but more like a situation where the energy, the enthusiasm has played itself out. In the sequence we go from 11. Peace to 12. Separation as if first we are all at peace with each other but then overtime we've been so peaceful, so quiet, that we start to drift apart. 12.4 suggests a feeling of rousing one's spirit, of recognizing that one must do something to revitalize the situation and if others feel similarly you will get a response. Then 20. View could mean that you drop in on an old friend and See what the've been up to, see if they are interested in continuing the connection.
I think 20.4 is less encouraging. You see possibilities but you are sort of outside the situation.
 

Lettuce

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12.4 suggests a feeling of rousing one's spirit, of recognizing that one must do something to revitalize the situation and if others feel similarly you will get a responseThus sounds very accurate to the situation at present. This does coincide with both your readings
 
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usilser

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Happy new year Lettuce and everyone :)

20.4 > 12 as applied to a relationship, would show a very temporary relationship, but pleasant while it lasts.

12.4 > 20 as applied to a relationship, would show that the two are in essence incompatible. One of the two has ulterior motives, or is functioning on principles other than love. The higher good that you mention is not exactly accurate. The character used in this line (ming) is the same character which in line 49.4 is translated as command, government, mandate. This same character can also mean life or fate. Line 12.4 says "there is ming". So, either there's already a decision, or there's already fate at work. As about the rest of the line text, that is also debatable. Wilhelm translates it as "partake of the blessing", however the actual characters say "departing from happiness". In my experience with this particular cast, there is no happiness (nor love) involved.

Which one would be better... tough choice. The first one gives a fleeting pleasure but results in bitterness. In the second one there's no pleasure and it results in thinking how different the two people are (or, one of the two is trying to get the upper hand). Neither 12 nor 20 are good for relationships. 12 is self explanatory, and 20 shows an imbalance in power.

Dear diamanda I love to read your posts. There are so many things we can learn from you. You have my appreciation.
I have a question. Is there any special meaning of the cast 20,6 to 8 applied to a relationship?
 
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diamanda

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Thank you usilser. I would suggest you start a new thread about this. The meaning of each cast largely depends on the exact question asked.
 

pooja123

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I wonder what happened in terms of 12.4 in lettuce's case?
 

Lettuce

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diamanda was spot on. The two people were incompatible and the outcome had already been decided when the reading was cast
 
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Freedda

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Which of the above readings would be better for a relationship outcome: 20.4 to 12 or 12.4 to 20? .... So are they both less positive readings for a relationship outcome ....
Perhaps this is just a broad exploration of certain hexagrams and lines, but the question seems very odd to me.

First, it sort of implies that there is a choice of responses - sort of like, 'among the Yi's many responses, do you want what's behind door #1 , door #2 or door#3 ?' To which you reply, 'I'll take what's behind door #2 because it's the 'better' answer.'

Second, it is completely void of a real situation with real people, and therefore the best answer you could come away with is ... 'it depends'. We know nothing of the people, nor their circumstances, nor even what they are asking ... so how could we then know if A or B is a better response?

And finally, why just these two? Why not also ask if 45.5 > 2 is 'better' than 47.2 > 45? Or is 2.5 > 8 better than .8.2 > 2, or better than 45.3.5.6, or .... ???

Best, D.
 

Lettuce

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they were both real life situations
 

Lettuce

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diana day i was referring to the 12.4 reading you made. it was spot on regarding the situation in all aspects
 

Lettuce

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diamanda, was referring to the 12.4 reading you made. it was spot on regarding the situation in all aspects
 

Lettuce

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diamanda, was referring to the 12.4 reading you made. it was spot on regarding the situation in all aspects
 

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