Hello dear all,
I happened to get a reading out of a dream, which is quite an unusual thing to do, so I decided I had to tell you about it. I also did a search before posting, and it seems as if nobody else wrote about this very special "method" before, at least on this site, but I'm sure it must have happened to somebody else, and I'd be interested in other people's experiences, opinions, comments, advice...

Monday morning I woke up from a dream in which I was looking at a page of an "illustrated Yijing for children"
- or maybe it was actually a card from a deck, I'm not sure. In any case, the picture on the page (or card) was a funny character with a square head all made of plants, as in some Arcimboldo's painting, and for some reason it also reminded me of the Tin Man from the Wizard of Oz.
In the dream I knew that it was the picture of an hexagram, but I can't remember any number on it, only what was supposed to be its name:

A man of herbs.

Note that I haven't translated this phrase, it was written like that, in English, in the dream. So, as soon as I was awake I realized that it was a mix, in some sort of exquisite corpse fashion, of two real hexagram names, as translated by LiSe:

34: A man of stone
22: Pot of herbs

Actually the name of hex 22 is now Flower Power, but I still have the lists of names copied from older versions of the site, so I could easily verify that I was remembering right.

So, based on how the phrase was constructed, I thought that the primary hexagram had to be 34, hence the complete response was:

34.2,4,6 > 22

Now the problem is: what was the question?!
One thing I can say for sure is that it's about my relationship with A., because the dream was set in her house, where I had really been a few hours before. My doubt is whether I should interpret this response as informative or as advice on what to do. The fact that I was just looking at a picture, in my dream, seems to suggest that I got exactly this: a picture of the situation. Or maybe I'd better avoid making any assumption
and just see what emerges from interpretation... easier said than done, but it seems to be the wisest thing to do.

:bows:

did you want an interpretation? all that comes to my mind right now is the tin man song "if I only had a brain: it seems like the image inside the children's yijing book reiterates 34 > 22 as well.

what were your own thoughts on it?

I did the reverse myself self last night, I drew the hexagram 25 on a piece of paper then put it under my pillow to sleep on (i do this with tarot cards, mostly ends up being a sleepless night) and I had a great dream:

I dreamt that I was walking home but before I arrived at my front door I really needed the loo so waltzed into my neighbours home first heading straight for their bathroom. They were hosting a dinner party ala carte and just as I got to the bathroom door one of the guests stampeded towards me with a punitive glare. But I just looked up at my neighbour as if to say "whats the big deal" and went about my business.

When I came out I saw my 1 year old niece on their couch, so I picked her up and cleaned out the lint from her belly button (...dreams huh!) then we went down the beach and pretended to be aeroplanes with me holding her up in the sky running in and out of the waves and this part of the dream was all like a close up, all I could see was her smiling face, eyes closed, feeling the wind as shards of yellow sand and blue sky wedged around her in the background.

Tonight I will sleep on hex 18...

buzzurro said:

Now the problem is: what was the question?!

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good luck, buzz!

you're suggesting me right now that, it's right, i should have a more careful look within some kind of dreams of mine...

Mr Buzz,

I love the imagery in your dream, the man of herbs and an illustrated IC for children. Couple thoughts. First, I wouldn't assume that because you had recently been to A's house, that the dream pertains to her or her house or your relationship necessarily. But then, it might. Most often a house symbolizes ones own bodily experience and what's going on inside of it.

To me, it depicts a refinement of power, using images of innocence and nature. I'm kinda surprised you didn't get 25 somewhere in regard to this. There's also a possible element of trying too hard, as in 34.6. If it's to be understood by a child, it must not be demanding or unnatural.

Applying it practically. If it does pertain to this relationship, you might try turning up the roses and toning down the thorns. There's a saying: a man can only love a woman when he's understood; a woman can only understand a man when she's loved.

buzzurro said:

a funny character with a square head all made of plants

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Sounds like the Green Man:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Man

I would like Xun in the hexagram. Maybe hexagram 53, with Ken's visual suggestion of legs. Is that your "relationship with A"? So the question would be, "Will my relationship with A become permanent and lead to a renewal of my life?"

First thing which popped into my mind was Sponge Bob SquarePants.



I also considered the square or cube as a symbol of earth, as in 2.2, which is related to the flourishing 22.

sooo said:

There's a saying: a man can only love a woman when he's understood; a woman can only understand a man when she's loved.

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I've never heard that before, but I find it beautifully eloquent and true . .

rodaki said:

I've never heard that before, but I find it beautifully eloquent and true . .

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Thank you, Dora. I'd forgotten where I'd read it until I remembered that I wrote it. It also applies to understanding and reckoning with both halves of our selves.

A similar saying (which I did not write): I don't care how much you know, I just want to know how much you care. That's written (theoretically) from the female principle to the male principle. (I may have incorrectly assumed Mr Buzz is a mister, and A a miss. If so, I apologize for the error.) But within us, those two principles are always dialoguing, irregardless: I think, I feel, I think, I feel. One directly or indirectly effects the other, and back and forth. And it can be greatly amplified through cranking up the excitement - h16.

Someone more technically aware can explain it better, but in guitar amplification, the power tubes are either 'hot' all the time (class A) or it uses a push/pull circuitry (class A/B). Class A's duality is a simple on/off switch, but when it's on, it's always on/yang. Class A/B, the push/pull tube circuitry, is far more efficient, generating twice the output per tube, and adding girth to the tone of the amp, all with less effort. The difference between the two can be felt by the player, since class A (yang/on) has a fast response to the pick attack on the string. Class A/B has some "sag" or slight delay, which a listener and player feel as well as hear.

I think the Yijing philosophy, if one dare say it has one, is an A/B model circuitry, and the biasing of each side to share equally the cause of the effect or output, and thereby become many times greater than the sum of its parts, and generally last longer.

Didn't mean to hijack this thread with my rambling. I hope something is helpful in it to buzzurro.

sooo said:

Someone more technically aware can explain it better, but in guitar amplification, the power tubes are either 'hot' all the time (class A) or it uses a push/pull circuitry (class A/B). Class A's duality is a simple on/off switch, but when it's on, it's always on/yang. Class A/B, the push/pull tube circuitry, is far more efficient, generating twice the output per tube, and adding girth to the tone of the amp, all with less effort. The difference between the two can be felt by the player, since class A (yang/on) has a fast response to the pick attack on the string. Class A/B has some "sag" or slight delay, which a listener and player feel as well as hear.

I think the Yijing philosophy, if one dare say it has one, is an A/B model circuitry, and the biasing of each side to share equally the cause of the effect or output, and thereby become many times greater than the sum of its parts, and generally last longer.

.

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unio mystica

anemos said:

unio mystica

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"The image of integration is the unio mystica, the fusion of opposites."

sooo said:

There's a saying: a man can only love a woman when he's understood; a woman can only understand a man when she's loved.

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For petty grammatical reasons, before this insightful saying goes into your published works, you might change it to: a man can love a woman only when he's understood; a woman can understand a man only when she's loved.

sooo said:

Thank you, Dora. I'd forgotten where I'd read it until I remembered that I wrote it. It also applies to understanding and reckoning with both halves of our selves.

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I see what you mean;

Today I saw an image that reminded me of 16: it was that of a piece of land that slowly revealed a big slab of stone with some text written in bas relief . . the whole thing made a lot of 2.4 sense. The interesting part of bas relief is that the more intense the difference between light and shadow, the more distinct the image . .

In listening there are also two ways to amplify the effect of sound: either turn up the volume or deepen the silence (of course I often listen to music with headphones so things get easily amplified )

anyways thanks for your saying, it 'smelled like rain'

oh and Mr Buzz(?) thanks for sharing your dream! If it's of any help, whenever I saw readings in dreams they usually described an inner reality . . which actually doesn't exclude the possibility of you receiving some thing from A. I also thought Pocossin's 'Green Man' idea sounded very much like it!


(p.s: I'm not sure about grammar but could be poetic license also has a say here? . . )

The square head and "man" are the strength of 34 (the moulding box for making rectangular stones!), and the herbs hex.22, with its beautiful life-energy - could it be that the combination expresses a desire in you to be both? Not just a strong 'square' man, not just a handsome bunch of life-energy, but both at once. And of course that applies usually to how a man feels towards a woman, or the woman towards him. The situation where both are most of all woman and man, and can show that most of all. Where both are closest to their real "nature". Beyond everything which society demands them to be.

If the dream represents 34 > 22, maybe it could also represent 22.2.4.6 > 34. a lovelier sequence and one that almost makes for a love story. trimming your beard, coming on a white horse as a suitor and in 22.6...the culmination of marriage! 34 the proposal!

this fits with my first intuitive flash of the dream...a man who is suddenly exploding with 'being in love' and all it's soft manifestations. The Tin Man fears he has no heart...in the dream, his "heart" is emerging, almost involuntarily, sprouting out all over his square head ( his logical brain). The Tin Man is recognizing he has a heart, that he loves

the Green Man is supposedly a very profound symbol to receive in a dream. transformation.

I suppose to go a little crazy, you could look at the steps of change for 22.2.4. 6> 34
22.2 trimming the beard (getting ready to woo), changes to
26.4 restraining the impulse until the time is right, changes to
14.6 blessed by Heaven

If you can remember the feeling-tone of the dream as well as the content, it might be interesting,to cast a hexagram and see what Yi says it means.

bamboo said:

If

this fits with my first intuitive flash of the dream...a man who is suddenly exploding with 'being in love' and all it's soft manifestations. The Tin Man fears he has no heart...in the dream, his "heart" is emerging, almost involuntarily, sprouting out all over his square head ( his logical brain). The Tin Man is recognizing he has a heart, that he loves

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I woke up 15 mins after the time you posted, because of a dream. the first thing i heard myself saying was "has anybody in that thread mentioned Tin Man?" I had to open clarity from my mobile and check it and I saw your post .:

Lovely post, B

Hello, thank you all for replying! :bows:

rodaki said:

oh and Mr Buzz(?) thanks for sharing your dream! If it's of any help, whenever I saw readings in dreams they usually described an inner reality . .

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Well, you're welcome... but I notice you say you did see readings in your dreams, and I opened this thread above all to read about this kind of experiences, so... feel free to write something about this, if you wish!

neegula said:

good luck, buzz!

you're suggesting me right now that, it's right, i should have a more careful look within some kind of dreams of mine...

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Hi Neegula, long time no see!
I want to tell you, in this case I didn't take a particularly careful look, the references to the Yi were all too clear, kind of slammed right on my face... uch:

sooo said:

First, I wouldn't assume that because you had recently been to A's house, that the dream pertains to her or her house or your relationship necessarily.

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This strikes me as kind of weird, but it's my fault, since I neglected to explain the situation: I was in A's house, in reality, until around midnight; then I went to sleep, and in my dream I was again in that house, and the scene was unusually realistic, the only detail that differed from reality was that "IC for children", substituting the astrology review that was actually on that table!

And that's not all, I didn't even hint at what kind of relationship exists between me and her, because I find it really hard to talk about it, sorry, and that's also the main reason why it's taking me so long to reply, sorry... we've been together for many years, possibly too many...

So, you can take for granted that the dream was about me and her. I'm also thinking that this reading came into my dream because I didn't dare to ask for it in reality, if you understand what I mean...

To me, it depicts a refinement of power, using images of innocence and nature. I'm kinda surprised you didn't get 25 somewhere in regard to this. There's also a possible element of trying too hard, as in 34.6. If it's to be understood by a child, it must not be demanding or unnatural.

Applying it practically. If it does pertain to this relationship, you might try turning up the roses and toning down the thorns.

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As a matter of fact yes, that's how I understood this reading so far, and that's what I really did, in a very spontaneous way! :bows:

heylise said:

The square head and "man" are the strength of 34 (the moulding box for making rectangular stones!), and the herbs hex.22, with its beautiful life-energy - could it be that the combination expresses a desire in you to be both?

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This got me pondering a lot. As a matter of fact I'm very confused about the situation with A, to the point of not knowing what do I really want. So this must have been the unexpressed, implicit question behind the dream-reading...

This idea also explains the association with the Tin Man, who sings "if I only had a heart". Many thanks to Bamboo for reminding this, for I couldn't remember! :bows:

Anyway, I forgot to tell it in my first post, but I immediately understood what the square head meant, because I could remember this passage from your commentary:

But man prefers to be a stone, so he bakes himself into a brick, strong and invulnerable. Rigid and square, a foundation that supports the building of mankind.
http://www.yijing.nl/i_ching/hex_33-48/hex_e_34.htm

You know that I use to consult several different translations of the Yi (and by the way, I do agree that Hilary's one is excellent!:claps, not relying on one exclusively. So, I can see many reasons why this dream-reading presented itself by means of the text in your site: I'm familiar with it, the hexagram names are original and particularly fit to suggest visual images... but I also believe that it must be particularly appropriate to this case, that is, your commentary on the hexagram is probably the one that offers the most enlightening perspective in regard to this dream-reading. One more reason to thank you infinitely! :bows:

buzzurro said:

Hi Neegula, long time no see!

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hhhhiiii!!!!
thanks for being you :bows:

buzzurro said:

Well, you're welcome... but I notice you say you did see readings in your dreams, and I opened this thread above all to read about this kind of experiences, so... feel free to write something about this, if you wish!

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hello again Buzz

hmm, . . truth is I didn't make any comments on that cause I haven't found a particular way to deal with these dream readings . . sometimes they foreshadow situations, sometimes they're messages from people I know (the first one I had was one of such) and other times are just my own inner 'conversations' so it's difficult to say . . . . Often I find however that what was more important in a dream was identifying and conversing with what I felt, the emotions I had in its duration rather than the symbols . . maybe if you revisit your dream and look there for any emotive clues things will become clearer

just my two cents -let us know if you find out more about it!

rodaki said:

hmm, . . truth is I didn't make any comments on that cause I haven't found a particular way to deal with these dream readings . .

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...and yet you were able to understand what they meant!

Well, I can't say I'm fumbling in the dark either, on the contrary, I have a fairly clear idea of what this dream-reading meant.
My main doubt is: was it really an Yijing reading, even if it came into a dream...?

Or have I only dreamed of having a reading?!

And does it make any difference, after all...?

Ok, I'm not expecting anybody to have a definite answer to these questions. I'll add a couple more details from my own experience instead.

Apparently, I wasn't feeling any particular emotion in this dream. But, as I wrote before, the dream was the (almost) perfect reproduction of a moment I had really lived a few hours before, and I remember very well what I was thinking and feeling in that moment. That's how I know what it was about, even if I can't phrase a specific question - which I would have found very useful for interpretation, but I already replied myself that it's not right to assume there was a question when there wasn't one.
(By the way, isn't it weird to look for a question when you have an answer?! )

And there's one detail that I don't know why I didn't take into account: the funny character called Man of Herbs was upside down, except for his smiling face, which was facing upright... that is, it might have been posing as Chagall's Acrobat:
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_OLskT-GO5VE/TTAqF7zxmMI/AAAAAAAABiw/JB5qVZxhW-0/s1600/Marc-Chagall-Acrobat-102498.jpg
So, this image was very joyful and playful, as it's usual in illustrated books for children...

buzzurro said:

...and yet you were able to understand what they meant!

Well, I can't say I'm fumbling in the dark either, on the contrary, I have a fairly clear idea of what this dream-reading meant.
My main doubt is: was it really an Yijing reading, even if it came into a dream...?

Or have I only dreamed of having a reading?!

And does it make any difference, after all...?

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I fumbled with the same question myself the first time I had a dream reading so I did the best thing I could and asked about it (!) I don't remember the exact answers but they all seemed to point to the fact that this was as valid a reading as any other -maybe even more so because it was something that needed to 'be said' without a question.
Besides, if asking Yi is a connection to what lies sleeping in our waking life, seeing one in dreamtime makes a lot of sense . . in an upside-down way

But if you're so sure that phrase was a reading, I think you should take it as one and not tangle yourself overthinking about it . .

btw, I'd like to say welcome back to neegula too. i have missed your lovely whimsical posts and your cute profound tags.

the tin man hanging upside down...he is not standing on his usual foundation. the hanged man's life gets turned upside down, the former things he 'stood on" are changed. new ways of thinking, doing.

bamboo said:

btw, I'd like to say welcome back to neegula too. i have missed your lovely whimsical posts and your cute profound tags.

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you know, bamboo, that whimsical in italiano means bizzarro: very funny that it popped out in a post written by buzzurro