martial arts and 44.3>6

bruce · May 6, 2013

Hey guys,

I've recently joined an MMA school. In the past I've done other martia arts,but MMA seems the more practical for now. I think I want to enter competitions once I get better and build my stamina,
I asked the Iching:

What are the prospects of my time at this gym?
44.3>6

Does it say I shouldn't enter competition? I think it says that in the changing line. Isn't hexagram 6 good for martial arts competition since it indicates conflict/battling?

gene · May 6, 2013

Hexagram six is considered in martial arts to be the point where the young student starts competition. That being said, I would not recommend it. Why do you want to get your face all rearranged? For what? I would just practice the forms.

Gene

meng · May 6, 2013

You'll have to fight your way in.

Your reading is a perfect picture of being a contender (6) in a power struggle. It also shows the degree of determination and spirit MMA would require, as though fighting for your life (line 6).

bruce · May 6, 2013

gene said:
Hexagram six is considered in martial arts to be the point where the young student starts competition. That being said, I would not recommend it. Why do you want to get your face all rearranged? For what? I would just practice the forms.

Gene

I think competition is about testing your skill. I don't think it is possible to really test yourself in forms. Btw, MMA doesn't have any forms. That being said, I'm not sure yet if I want to enter competitions in the future. I have some psychological problems that hinder me from performing the way I want to anyway.

wind · May 7, 2013

I feel a bit mixed about this, much like Gene and Meng's answers.

I'm going to take the high road on this casting. Martial Arts is about focus, discipline and personal achievement... saying this as a student of Ishinryu once upon a time, myself. Unlike the majority of most "sports", accomplishments are measured by your own personal best and not necessarily by the group effort of a team.

I see it as you should go with whatever test of your ability you'll be satisfied with. After all, you are only measuring yourself.

Best wishes.

meng · May 7, 2013

I'm an MMA fan so I guess I'm looking down the low road, chuckle. But I'm not against any skill-set of martial arts or yoga type exercises. I love that Bruce says 'there are no rules', there are only skills. Again, nothing against Tai Chi or other disciplines, but MMA is about winning, with very few holds barred. It's the closest to a "real fight" there is that's legally promoted, employing martial arts and street fighting from all over the world, like Brazilian jiu-jitsu.

But I was not enthusiastic to hear of mental problems, Bruce, and only you can settle any conflict of interests within you. Like Gene said, it would rearrange your face, and your brain. Frankly, I think you have to be a little nuts to go head-to-head with those guys anyway. That's why I'm a spectator, not a participant, lol.

gene · May 7, 2013

I disagree that you can't test yourself with form. The form is the basis for everything. Hexagram 22 talks about this in detail. One must study the form in order to find the content. The masters do not compete, but no one could take them. Is it so necessary to test your skills that you get beat up on a regular basis? That is not what martial arts is about. It is a spiritual discipline, and one must let the ego go. Beating people up or getting beat up just augments the ego, if there is enough left of you to think anyway. I do not recommend it. Most of these people, while being really tough, are nothing compared to the masters. And these people have lost their way. How much love can you have for others if you want to beat them up? How much love can you have for yourself to let yourself get beat up? Is that really the way?

Gene

meng · May 7, 2013

Ego, shmeego. Like those who want to remove scoreboards from high school ball games. Give me a break.

It reminds me of sitting next to my dad in his big chair (the aroma of Old Spice), watching the Saturday Night Boxing matches. Even back then Gillett was a sponsor, and Pabst Blue Ribbon beer. He took me to a Golden Glove event at Madison Sq. I can't imagine any of that if there were no winners or losers.

Again, no disrespect intended to other forms of martial arts, but they usually are more art than martial.

gene · May 7, 2013

If you look at martial arts as a sport, I can understand your answer. That is not what it is. That is what the west makes it, because they can't understand the true meaning. Ego is ego. No matter how you look at it. If you want a good sport, boxing will work fine. Good boxers would usually tear these guys apart anyway. But let them try doing that to the masters. Not having ego works. This art goes back millenia, and they know the best way. Nobody cares about the person. They only care about a winner, and they will root for you as long as you win, but once you lose, they couldn't care less about you. Where does your ego get you? Its a fools game. These guys develop a lot of skill but they reach a point beyond which they can't go, because their mind and their heart is not right, and the I Ching reminds us of that over and over.

Gene

meng · May 7, 2013

Eastern martial arts were originally taught solely for the purpose of warfare, and predates the philosophical (not "spiritual") practice by a few thousand years. Besides that, Chinese boxing can be reliably traced back to the Chou Dynasty (1122-255 BCE).

The association of Bodhidharma with the martial arts only became widespread after the 1904–1907 serialization of the novel The Travels of Lao Ts'an in Illustrated Fiction Magazine.[23]

The discovery of arms caches in the monasteries of Chang'an during government raids in 446 AD suggests that Chinese monks practiced martial arts prior to the establishment of the Shaolin Monastery in 497.[24] Moreover, Chinese monasteries, not unlike those of Europe, in many ways were effectively large landed estates, that is, sources of considerable wealth which required protection that had to be supplied by the monasteries' own manpower. - Wiki

Not quite your modern neighborhood Dojo.

A modern skilled MMA fighter would decimate a modern boxer with their gloves off in a real fight, btw. He'd know techniques the boxer had never ever heard of and would submit him on the ground in the first round. This is a whole new league of professional fighting, not usually as pretty as those qi balancing forms, but far more realistic and effective in the real world.

bruce · May 7, 2013

You both make good points. I'm just trying to do the best I can with what I have around me. There aren't real masters here, and this gym I'm going to is a decent enough school that is closeby. I'm not even sure this is for me, I'm just trying it out. It is true that most MMA fighters could beat a lot of traditional martial artists, as there is a lot of versatility in MMA, and it is usually more practical. But yeah, a lot of MMA fighters have some ego problems for sure. I know how it works.

meng · May 7, 2013

There's a WHOLE lot of ego often wrapped up in the whole spiritual image and dance too. As you say, Bruce, there are very few genuine masters of the more aesthetic forms of martial arts.

As for centering and balancing exercises, a yoga mat will be more helpful than the Octagon.

Good luck in your endeavors, Bruce, whichever path you choose. Thanks for sharing your feedback.

...life can be translucent

martial arts and 44.3>6

bruce

visitor

gene

visitor

meng

(deceased)

bruce

visitor

wind

visitor

meng

(deceased)

gene

visitor

meng

(deceased)

gene

visitor

meng

(deceased)

bruce

visitor

meng

(deceased)