laylab said:

or in my case, a cold one

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Your wisdom, yet again. lol

You have a good mind and insight. I'd trust that most of all. I also believe that's what Yi has been going about showing you, too.

Don't be misled or dazzled by the mysterious wonder-powers of folks on this board (or anywhere else). We're all scrambling and groping in the shadows to find our own way - perhaps those of us who've spent the longest time in the Yi, most of all.

Maybe this helps. http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=3335

If you still have questions about 7, be sure to ask. I'm sure others will offer what they can.

Hi Bruce,

Thanks

I had looked through some of the other threads, like the link above regarding Hex 7 but my problem with it, is that it always seems like something for an organization, a company or a project.

How can Hex 7 describe someone's relationship? Specifically someone's feelings
??

it seems like such a non-feeling hexagram ..more about order and leadership..

laylab said:

Hi Bruce,

Thanks

I had looked through some of the other threads, like the link above regarding Hex 7 but my problem with it, is that it always seems like something for an organization, a company or a project.

How can Hex 7 describe someone's relationship? Specifically someone's feelings
??

it seems like such a non-feeling hexagram ..more about order and leadership..

Click to expand...

You're right (again), it isn't a very touchy-feely hexagram. If I got 7 in regards to my feelings, I'd interpret it as saying: get your feelings in order with the rest of your life. Feelings obviously play a big part in our lives, but they need to be assigned a proper place in a well organized life. This is shown in 7.1.

I think with regard to a relationship hexagram 7 can indicate one regards it as ones 'project', there is an agenda an outcome one wants to reach and theres a certain amount of planning, determination and manipulation to get it.

laylab said:

How can Hex 7 describe someone's relationship? Specifically someone's feelings
??

it seems like such a non-feeling hexagram ..more about order and leadership..

Click to expand...

Yes and no. Everyone has feelings yet that does not mean everyone will show their emotions to the outer world in the same way.

There are also many ways reading a hexagram. The unchanging line in this case is to me the key message, which happens to be the ruler line of the hexagram. One way of interpereting this line could be not letting of things/thoughts, being attached to the old, not allowing exchange with self and others.

Fan gua of this hexagram( if you replace yin with yang and viceversa) you will get Hex 13 Tong Ren and reading line 2 one may see the difference.

Another way of looking into this is via trigrams. Earth blocking water. Upper being earth is more with the negative aspect thinking too much, making circles but arriving no where, a feeling of being knotted. This affects the intention of the person and the intention does not have the power to move forward the will to make the change and the yang line in the middle of the water trigram which is the fire within the water the connection to heart who shall express the will freely is unable to do so.


Hope this is helpful

Togan

Hi laylab

Just in case the comment could be useful

Despite I don't use to undertake any consultation by my own initiative; this time I made the suggested dialogue on your behalf.

RELATION BETWEEN LAYLAB AND X
1.- General diagnosis. 51>34
2.- Laylab's position 26.0
3.- X's position 64>10
4.- best thing for laylab to do 13.0

INTERPRETATION
The relation is facing a stormy period of instability, a mixture of excitation, confusion and risk. If you face this time with superficiality, there is danger; if the storm makes you start discernment (to examine your own life, as it recommends the image), everything will end well.

There is a tendency to end entangled in mistaken ways, due to stubborness.

In order to avoid that, it is necessary to understand that between November of 2006 and January of 2007 the relation underwent some type of loss; and that is useless to try to deny it or to recover by force what you lost. "What belongs to you, cannot be snatched from you; what it does not belong to you, cannot be conserved by force".

Because this has not been understood, between February and April of 2007 the relation has faced thunder on thunder; it is a call of the destiny to reflect and to change your course, to be free of misfortune.

Your position is like feelling a great inner impulse to go towards ahead in the relation, but it is prevented by the external circumstances. The temptation is to think that your inner force is enough to continue advancing. The image recommends to take advantage of this period of external obstacles, to renew your own character; mainly, to learn the lessons of the previous experience.

The position of X is like one who wants to leave the past in the past, and to open himself to a new situation; but who needs to advance with much caution and very slowly to avoid end damaged. He wants to walk step by step, without rush.

This shows the deep conflict in the relation: while laylab wants to advance in a determined and powerful form, X wants to advance step by step. It is necessary to discuss this difference openly and to find a satisfactory solution.

The best thing you can do is to speak openly with X; and not to accept a "secret relation". To accept this relation only when it can be developed in an open way (please take in mind the warning against a secret relation in 13.2)


Best wishes

laylab said:

How can Hex 7 describe someone's relationship? Specifically someone's feelings
??

it seems like such a non-feeling hexagram ..more about order and leadership..

Click to expand...

Hi laylab,

Looks like this thread has developed a bit Very interesting stuff about predictions Trojan was talking about. It's always a good thing to throw in a "maybe," "possibly" or "perhaps" etc. as there really are only probabilities and possibilities. It's really true that the more one knows (or thinks one knows) and a wider awareness of things develops one realises just how little one knows. So, the more you know in fact, the less you know! There's a Cosmic Joke in there somewhere said the dust speck...

Anhyhow, regarding Hex 7 when I got this a few times earlier this year it talked about independence and the warrior self - getting your act together and standing on your own two feet. It seems to be about taking care of your inner and outer resources in order to embark on a battle for your true self. I see it as the "learning your lessons" Hex par excellence - something that has to be done as part of our sojourn here in this big school we call Earth Call it getting to grips with some karma and utilising the wisdom that lurks within us. Experience draws it out. This is one of those occasions perhaps.

Topal

laylab said:

How can Hex 7 describe someone's relationship? Specifically someone's feelings
??

it seems like such a non-feeling hexagram ..more about order and leadership..

Click to expand...

It covers issues with rejection/rejecting (Water base) in which is operating fear (earth base) that expresses itself through a devotion to others and so a sense of protection by group.

the water base has generic roots in covering boundary issues, us vs them, with a focus on protection. The 'uniforming', uniformity, focus covers sameness as compared to the dangers of difference.

WIth issues on rejection/rejecting comes a focus on containment/control issues.

the infrastructure of 07 is described by analogy to the general characteristics of 41with ITS focus on concentration, distillation (which is what an 'army' represents, the sameness, the concentrated form that, if not done properly is literal decrease)

Chris.

Hi Trojan,

I don't take your commentary as judgemental in a negative sense at all. In fact, I completely agree with you! First of all, "judging" is a necessary part of the human existance, the I ching is at the center of this, we use the i ching to help us 'judge', the best course, the present situation etc.

There are two judgings though, one is cynical ..which may very often be completely realisitc..not all situations lead to or originate in altruistic idealism.

The second judging, as I see it, is judging based on mercy, understanding of human weaknesses. Not characterizing a person as either, right or wrong, good or bad according to their behaviour.

For me, when analyzing Mr. X, I am trying to strike a balance between the two. Between realistic cynicism (he IS lying and cheating) and mercy (he IS still a human with feelings and confusions like all of us). but in the end, one ending or solution must prevail.

I am glad you posted what you did.

@Toganm, you said,

Upper being earth is more with the negative aspect thinking too much, making circles but arriving no where, a feeling of being knotted.

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Thinking too much is what I have also been doing, and this "feeling of being knotted" makes me think of the necessity of the "cutting or biting through" hexagram.

@Jesed,
your reading was impressive to the point of being stunning. Because those dates are about my life, not his!!
The EXACT dates. however the feeling felt like the two were reversed From November 2006 to Jan 2007 thunder after thunder with my boyfriend (now my ex) who I had been together with for a few years. It was shattering and thundering is the perfect adjective to describe it. From Feb to April it felt like loss but I felt at ease with it. I can't believe the dates are so accurate.

I met Mr. X in March. I don't know what he went through the months before...

thank you for doing that on behalf of the situation for me.

You asked for "the best thing for Layla to do" - that's incredible. It may not even be referring totally to this situation. I got that answer recently twice, referring to aligning myself with a group of people or organization that is focusing on the greater good and not just the individual. Also, here I am communicating with this community. getting extremely sound advice and learning also, by reading the other threads. This also makes me think of how important it is to join friends or organizations when things are difficult in our own lives, focus on others or a purpose and things clarify themselves. In other words, dont be so self absorbed.

@Topal, cosmic joke indeed!!! I thoght that yesterday when I had so much info from the IC that I thought, "damn, I know all of this but really know nothing!"

@LightofReason: thanks, that containment/control referrence sound like what Mr. X is trying to do. Whether for honorable or self-protection reasons remains to be seen.

Hi Laylab
Just in case the coment could be useful

laylab said:

your reading was impressive to the point of being stunning. Because those dates are about my life, not his!!

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Well, in the tradition I have learn, this is normal. I mean.. even when the question is about one relation, the answer "speaks" to the consultant. That's why I wrote you to ask first about yourself, and only then ask about others

laylab said:

I met Mr. X in March.

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Could it be that asking so much about X's feelings for you, wishing a relation with him, is a way to regain something you "lost" when you break with your former boyfriend? Some kind of substitution?

Taking in account: a) no regain by force what you have lost; b) he wants to walk step by step; and c) 13 advice, not only about this, but even other times...
maybe is not the best time to focus on romantic couple... but focus on other forms of comunity. Does that ring any bell?

Best wishes

HI everyone,

I promised to update on the developments and something has already happened.

Mr. X surprised me, by showing up in the city I am in, saying he couldn't sleep, appearing nervous but happy and said, "it just hit me. I care for you, I can't sleep, I love you actually. This has never happened to me before, so fast like this".

I am pretty surprised, "shocked" in fact. I am also very happy about it, about the visible signs of his sincerity. So, I will see what happens next.

oh, and I am guessing this is one time when Willowfox was right?

however, perhaps not entirely right...will have to wait and see how things play out.
But I am taking the IC advice for Hex 13 regarding fellowship with others, will explain later.

best regards to everyone

laylab said:

oh, and I am guessing this is one time when Willowfox was right?

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umm ... lets see, willowfox will be right 1 in 64 posts on average ;-)

poor Willowfox, everyone picks on her!

well, at least she was right about the first part...he *does* care deeply for me. I am happy about this obviously. But still...more waiting...to see what happens.

last night I fell asleep for about an hour and then woke up with the weirdest sensation of i ching being on my wall. for some reason I woke up, reached up to the wall and expected some kind of i ching symbols to be there..it was so weird..it actually took me a couple of minutes to get my bearings and realize that there were never any hexagrams on my wall.

I felt completely disoriented with this sensation that I had fallen off track but it was time to get back on.

but then I had an overwhelming need to get up and clean and organise my flat. as I was doing it i thought, "I NEED to join a yoga group of some kind and I NEED to join a class of some kind..to learn a different language"

So that's what I am doing now..

strange but after I cleaned my flat (late at night) and had those things clear in my mind..I slept like a baby. Finally..because I havent slept well in days.

your seeking order and by that a focus on starting something to elicit such. This ties you to problem solving and the digram that leads to the trigrams of thunder and fire. Emotionally this covers issues of surprise (thunder) and acceptance (fire).

Go through those 16 hexagrams and see if any 'resonate' strongly:

24,27,03,42,51,21,17,25 36,22,63,37,55,30,49,13

Chris.

Of those above mentioned hexagrams, (from Chris) the following are the hexagrams that I have gotten over the past two weeks as answers from the IC specifically in regards to this situation:

49, 51, 03, 24, 42, 21, 17, 25, 22, 36, 37, 30, 13

49 was advice from the IC on what I needed to do to shift his perception of me and our relationship

51 was the answer to three questions: "how does he feel about me?" "does he love me? " "and what is he going through right now?"

03 was the answer to a question about the nature of our relationship

42 was the answer to: "what does he want to happen now" and to "what has he told his friends about his feelings for me?"

I have to look up the details of the questions for the rest (I keep records)

but really it doesn't matter because as Chris said, I AM seeking order and peace.

how would you interpret the following phrase?:

"Solidarity among all elements is essential for success at this time."

Dobro gave the best explaination for Hex 7 in regards to a relationship, I found it on another thread:

he/she said,

" I would read it this way: the Yi's telling you how to handle the current state of the relationship. Hex 7 isn't about going to war, it's about mature management of a powerful force.* In other words, you should approach this relationship with well-controlled personal force. Armies often aren't for war, remember. They're often for maintaining territorial integrity in the face of threats, real or imagined, from parties that might not respect that integrity. For avoiding war, in other words. When you're the strongest organized force in the immediate vicinity, there's much less chance of having to deal with attacks or violence."

*bold is mine

Question about Hexagram 51 also

I am a complete beginner at understanding how to interpret the i-ching, so I'm not sure I'm even framing my questions correctly - but I recently had a sudden change in a friendship and I am trying to determine how best to proceed. I moved halfway around the world and happened to make friends with someone 20 years younger than I am and suddenly on my birthday things became unusually tense. We had been laughing and joking, texting and talking several times a day, when suddenly - nothing. I sent him a text message - teasing, asking why he didn't say happy birthday (we were at work) and he replied that he thought I was trying to pick a fight. I didn't think that I was, and answered back that I had not meant to offend him - thought I was just joking around and haven't heard from him since. He is away on vacation for a month. So I had done a few i-ching casts (online) and before this occurred the 1st one I got Hexagram 24 "Returning" to my question about what kind of friendship we were in (my question was more about the age difference). Then on the day of the strange text message about my birthday, I cast again and got the exact same Hexagram #24 - Returning to a similar question, this time I asked if our friendship would continue. Today my question was very direct - Should I contact him or not? and I got Hexagram 51 - Shock. I'm thinking this is either a very strong YES or a very strong NO. Does anybody out there have an idea which it could be?

It is a strong yes.

I know this thread happened a long time ago. So does anyone know what ever happened?

24 most often signifies return to self and true values. He dropped you without rhyme nor reason so why spend anymore time thinking about it.

Its better to start a new thread to save confusion

still curious about the best way to interpret #51

Thanks for the reply, Trojan. I took your advice and placed the question under a new thread. I see your point about the meaning of 24 and since I am still very much on the fence about making contact, I am hesitant to do so. I was just curious about the meaning of #51. If you have any insight on what #51 implies I'd love to hear it. It seems rather negative? Or is that my naive beginner's understanding?