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Hello to all I-Ching practitioners.
I'm trying to solve the mystery of the sequence... ok, I know it's impossible, but I like working on this project, and it changed my thinking completely over the years.
Here comes my question:
We know that the sequence is somehow connected to the Later Heaven bagua, but can we prove this connection? Or it's just the tradition?
Thanks in advance.
I guess I don't understand your question. What 'connection' are you trying to prove? By way of an anology, to me what you're asking sounds something like, 'what is the connection between John Smith and John Smith?' Isn't the later heaven bagua the sequence? Or at least a sequence?We know that the sequence is somehow connected to the Later Heaven bagua, but can we prove this connection?
This is what we are told and probably also the truth about it. But again, "He sits up there smiling" and we got (up to now at least) no chance at all to ask him....Too bad we don't know King Wen's real intentions. I can't believe it's just a joke.
Or maybe just now he looks down at me from the Palace of Heavens, laughing: Look at this fool! 3000 years have passed, and he won't give up! He stays up at night, trying to solve my riddle! Hilarious!
I don't really know.
It is possible that he was the first one who wrote down and ordered all the hexagrams. If that's the case, I won't blame him for the disorder anymore: at least he tried
But before the hexagrams were all collected and written down, you could only see them emerging into the world through casting the yarrow stalks... That could have been magical. How many great signs are? Who knows? Their numbers are possibly infinite.
I read a bit of this article, 'The solution of the King Wen sequence?' but pretty quickly got lost in the math and computations. That said, I did read some from author József Drasny's conclusion:.... an UpDate showed up from the birocco.com (Yijing Dao Update) homepage with this LINK
So, what we seem to have here is yet another unproven (and unprovable) theory about the sequence.
That said, people are of course free to explore the Yi in whatever way they want to (regardless of how I might feel about it), but I don't really see how this exploration, or an answer to the 'how and why' of the sequence - or to solve its 'mystery' (if one even exists) - would in any way help me in actually using the Yi.
Are you saying here that you're József Drasny (whom wrote the review of Cole's book)?joseph (alias dryjoe) .... the author of the review
As I said, people are free to do whatever they want with the Yi. However, here it seems you are doing a great deal of if-ing: if Cole's book leads people to have more insights into the sequence, and if we get more infromation and background about the sequence, and if this leads someone to discover the solution to the mystery of the sequence, and if that mystery actually contains anything that might change or add to how we use the YI, then ... maybe ... we might have more successful divinations..... Maybe just Cook's arrangement will help to find the right solution. If we receive some more information about the philosophical or historical background of the King Wen sequence, perhaps the divinations will be more successful.
Regarding what's in Alfred Huang ... there is something similar in Wilhelm, third section, where he talks about the sequence for each hexagram - this is from one of the Wings.There are those though that use the king Wen sequence in practical divination, Alfred Huang*) to example ....
[As an example to how I myself once got entagled: LINK, but this was an attempt to find the co-ordination between the 64 hexagrams and the Sun-cyclus - and the only valuable in this pdf are the tables given in the end originating from various chinese philosophers]
Do You think that king Wen have had any intention to make his hexagram order fit with the calendar (Solar- Moon Cyclus) ?
I don't really know, and as I've said, I'm not all that into the 'mystery of the sequence' ... however, there are a number of hexagrams which have associations with different months and seasons - though I don't know if any order is implied (all from Bradford Hatcher):Do You think that king Wen have had any intention to make his hexagram order fit with the calendar?
... and I'm sure there is more to this ....
Thanks. I downloaded the calendar and will take some time to take a longer look. However, at first glance, and from what I understand you to say, the seasonal cyclic order of the hexagrams in this calendar don't have any chronological sense or have any immediately discernible order as related to how the hexagrams are ordered in the Yi (1 through 64).Those twelwe hexagrams king Wen didn't incorporate in his hexagram order in the logic sense without which they will give no meaning. He did not use them at all. (Here they are in their logic order but with their places numbered in the king Wen order: 1-44-33-12-20-23-2-24-19-11-34-43. And their logic order shown on this page: LINK. )
Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom
Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).