The Future -- Fixed or Static?

[bodhidogma]

I can't find who posted it, but someone here said essentially, each situation is different.

I totally agree with that.

There have been times when I have asked a very crude, fortune teller question—expecting not to a get a serious response—and yet, lo and behold, I got a very serious, useful answer.

And there have been other times when I was ridiculously humble and focused and the question was a very serious matter and I got an absolutely nonsensical, discombobulated, useless response.

But I must add, that usually it doesn't work like this... for me anyhow.

 

[bostonian]

I'm not sure what "fortune telling" means for you.

If it means answer "will x happen", of course the answer is yes. You can use the Yijing to answer that question.

But the diference, in my opinion, rest in other place: fortune telling, as I understand it, is all about fortune or destiny. The outcome or the future is external to the people's actions.

If you understand fortune telling this way, then the answer is no; that's not the way the Yijing works when it can help you to forsight the future.

Best wishes

Not sure I understand the distinction. But anyway, would you say that one can ask the i Ching "Will I get that job interview" "Will my missing cat come home" or or even "If i bet on horse x will I win money?"

 

[lloyd]

The question may be whether you want change
- in/for yourself
- or in your theories about yourself and others.
In the first case you take your intentions/actions (self) as a starting point for questioning.
In the second case your starting points are the objects of your thoughts in theory.

In the first case the future may flow from the correctness of the source: “If he beginning is known, then the end will surely be known”, and ends lie in futures.
That is to say, the answer may be incorporated in what you feel/think. I Ching values quiet contemplation on the question as much as thoughtfully considering the impact of the answer on your being; it gives clear suggestions not to let the answer replace your thinking and subsequent actions.

In the second case an awful lot is possible, in theory ..

 

[pantherpanther]

The question may be whether you want change
- in/for yourself
- or in your theories about yourself and others.
In the first case you take your intentions/actions (self) as a starting point for questioning.
In the second case your starting points are the objects of your thoughts in theory.

In the first case the future may flow from the correctness of the source: “If he beginning is known, then the end will surely be known”, and ends lie in futures.
That is to say, the answer may be incorporated in what you feel/think. I Ching values quiet contemplation on the question as much as thoughtfully considering the impact of the answer on your being; it gives clear suggestions not to let the answer replace your thinking and subsequent actions.

In the second case an awful lot is possible, in theory ..

I agree with this line of thought.
For myself , the Yi depicts all and everything in the 64 hexagrams - no different from other traditions in essential content. Reading one hexagram invokes the others - they all are related. The real hope of answers lie in one's body and its energy state, that is, the degree of awareness that is present at the time. This is preparation,that is, a matter of cultivation, although sometimes shocks in life may raise awareness at the time. Approaching the Yi as a "spirit" suggests it is more than a metaphorical representation of a higher level of consciousness. No. That is human projection. An icon or statue may contain high energy and heal the sick . There are chants and rituals ,as the Mass, that may bring down high energy . Basically, the I Ching is a means to relate to a higher level, as are other sacred texts , art and so on. Conscious work with the body and mind (which requires precise knowledge and practice) is where free will begins : it takes work and suffering to have will. To access a higher level of consciousness begins with being present to one's own level. The 64 hexagrams describe all situations. It can be a guide to understanding my situation and the environment in time and place. It can help relate me to a higher level of intelligence that governs possible changes. It is possible "to change oneself," yet I cannot "do it": a relation to the Unknown or Silence can lead to change.

The Chinese philosopher Liu Dajun of the Center for Zhouyi & Ancient Chinese Philosophy, Shandong University , recently cited on another thread, expresses well how to approach the I Ching in a conscious and practical way:

In my opinion, the reason why it was difficult for Jung to empirically account for synchronic phenomena lies in that Jung did not recognize the relationship between synchronicity and causality similar to the relationship between “the dark and light”, between “tracing back to the beginning and pursuing them to the end” conceived in the images of the 64 hexagrams. Jung said: “We'd better assume it stands on some rule.” In actuality, though synchronicity differs from causality, both of them can be included in the Yijing 's rule of visibility and invisibility. This rule implicated in the images of the 64 hexagrams often discloses itself in this way: “it manifests itself as kindness but conceals its workings."

It is necessary to "begin at the beginning," to be present in one's body and then turn the attention within in order to relate to "the end," the inner awareness. Then relate "the dark and light." This is like being between Heaven and Earth, open to both energies.

 

[jesed]

Not sure I understand the distinction. But anyway, would you say that one can ask the i Ching "Will I get that job interview" "Will my missing cat come home" or or even "If i bet on horse x will I win money?"

Of course you can ask those questions.

But, the knowledge and skills to get a correct interpretation in such cases.... well that's other issue

In fact, it is there -in the knowledge and skills level- where you learn the diference I talked about.

Best