The Secret of Wen-Wang Gua by Jack Chiu

[peterg]

I prefer a more casual approach to WWG.
If I have a book or see a thread I will read it all once maybe, or save it as reference material.
I dont like the idea of rewriting books. But I do create simple rough charts of key material for quick reference and keep them to hand in a file or copy book
Eg: the Chinese names and characters for key words like elements branches stems relatives h.creatures etc. Eg: keyword meanings for the six relatives.
Eg: the kind of charts I posted.
When I cast I will study examples about that cast or similar casts. Since the hexagrams recur you learn gradually by repetition.
I dont like being too busy.I need idle times in between to absorb the material and to make room for intuiton.

 

[peterg]

The six colours

Applying the six celestial creatures or six colours in practical divination is tricky. It might be something you get a feel for over time.Here is an example by Long yi in which the fiery red bird and the metallic white tiger are antagonistic : http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?15536-Argument-with-friend-63-gt-3
Alex Chiu at Superiching calls them the six colours and they crop up from time to time in his examples.

 

[forty two]

Hi Peterg.,
I`m not sure if I understood you right, but I guess this means I have to write the WWG explanation post by myself. No problem. I just asked.

Thanks for the example by Long Yi. It`s anyway a good idea to study his posts. At each you can learn something new. As far as I know he is the only one who is showing Wen Wang Gua in action in public, at a forum in english. We should use this chance

Best wishes Yvonne

 

[forty two]

Hi all,
a very bad censoring of my posts at the Five Arts Net forces me to post here what I wish to say.

It seems that it is not allowed at the Five Arts Net to offer another member an email contact in public and my communication with the member Romyudong is very disturbed now, because the moderators censored my posts there, although I haven`t said something wrong or immodest at my posts. Seems that the moderators of the Five Arts Net try to separate and isolate the members from each other and this is highly suspicious in my humble opinion.

This is the first message I have got for you all: Take care when posting at the Five Arts Net. I wrote a message to the moderator that I never will post at this forum again and now I hope that the moderators here at Clarity are still know what is right or wrong.

I repeat here what I wrote at the Five Arts Net for Romyudong and hope that he will get the idea to check out this thread here too. If not, the moderators of the Five Arts Net has won.

@Romyudong: If you will ever get this message: I can`t contact you at the Five Arts Net, because I have no permission there to check out user profiles (what is strange enough) so you have to write an email to me if you wish to talk about Wen Wang Gua in a more private way.

This is my answer to your recent post and I suppose that it will be censored again, because when I tried to post it then I got a message that the post is awaiting the moderation before it will be public and I again didn`t write something wrong here as the whole world can see now. Here it is:

@Clurker:Thank you so much, you rescued me *bow* lol.

@Romyudong: I just can agree to all what Clurker said. A hexagram is an oracle. It is a message from divine power and it is up to you to interprete the signs right. There are rules which help us to interprete the message, but you really have to look at the hexagram, see what happens there and interprete right what you see.

For example at a combat situation it is probably a good sign if the self line devitalizes the object line. At another case this can be a bad sign. Same with the relatives sometimes the Children means happiness, sometimes it means "you get nothing" which can be also a good or a bad sign. For example: The Officer means success, but it also means trouble. Therefore: This "you get nothing" (Children) can also mean "you don`t get trouble" and this is obviously a good thing.

At combat situations you can check out self and object line but Alex Chiu said that it is even more important to look for alliances of relatives. Because this is a sign. I said it already: Look for signs!!!! Look for obviously things at your hexagram. If one relative gets supported by such an alliance it is probably the winner although it is neither on the object line nor on the self line.

You are very focused on this self and object line issue, but for to understand the whole oracle you have to look at all what happens there.

Try to understand the message in different ways.

The rules are for to find out which line is active and which not, which is bound to which or which strikes each other and for to find the right point in time when something will happen, because this also depends on all this rules. The rules mainly say something about the strength of the lines and when they will move, but the meaning of the oracle is to find by interpreting this and by looking at the relatives, their several meanings, there position, their strength (determined by the rules) and especially how they behave. Look what the lines do!!!

Who supports who, who kills who and what could this mean.

You have to bring it all together to a meaning: Your question, the feelings you had while you asked, the meaning of the relatives and their behavior at the hexagram, self and object line, active and inactive lines, dead lines, strong lines and so on.

Last but not least: As Clurker already said most of all it depends on your question. There are questions which make the subject and object lines more important as others for example if you wish to know something about someone you don`t know. But this also can`t be generaly said. You have to be very flexible when practise WWG.

All this meanings are not really fixed.

It is similar to the interpretation of the texts of the I Ching. I dealt with them over 20 years and that was all I had for to know what I should do or not do. It worked, because I really tried to get the message, to understand it right. You can also interprete the texts of the I Ching in a different way. A certain line can mean this or that. It is up to you to get the message and there is a good way to reach this goal and it is: Be honesty to yourself.

Same with WWG. Be honesty to yourself if you try to understand the message. Don`t hope, don`t fear, but recognize what is told to you by divine power.

At the beginning I was thinking same way like you. I thought: "Wow great thing this WWG, I don`t need to interprete, but only to apply rules." This was completely wrong as I recognized later

Each hexagram is an own and absolutely individual message. WWG is damned complex and all this rules and determined meanings of some parts of it shall just help you to find the right meaning, but you neverthless need creativity, instinct (intuition) and a very open mind for to actually get the message like it is meant.

Alex Chiu wrote this 1000 pages and 5000 examples for to show us how damned complex WWG is and all examples there confirm what Clurker said and what is my own experiance. The general answer to all your questions is: "It depends on.........." lol. Sorry, but that is the truth.

Experiance is helpful here. By time you get something like a feeling for the message told to you in "WWG language". Practise, practise, practise.

Try this: Ask the same question 3 times. Check out the 3 hexagrams you will get and then you will see that the answer was given to you in 3 completely different ways. This is the moment when you start to understand something.

Another great way of learning is sharing hexagrams and the analysis of the hexagrams with others. I do this already and that`s just great and very funny. Everybody sees different aspects of the hexagram and this is very intresting. Sometimes yourself are blind for certain things, but others can see. I don`t expect you to post your hexagrams here because probably each WWG practitioner here knows that such a hexagram is a very private thing, but because of that I told you that you can also write an email to me.

We can discuss and share general WWG questions at the public, but hexagrams and sometimes also the questions asked to the I Ching are very personally and private and not each oracle can be discussed in public for this reasons. I really admire Alex Chiu for his brave open mind, lol. Sometimes I feel like I would read his diary when I read his examples. I`m not as brave as Alex Chiu, lol. Sorry 8) But I`m open to discuss my hexagrams with others in a more private atmosphere, of course. I`m also open to share the results of this cooperation someday, but if I would post a hexagram for example, I wouldn`t say the name of the querent for example. I would just post it as an example by anonymous.

WWG is way more complicated than I supposed in the beginning. I really had no idea about what challenge this will be when I started to learn it. A very experianced WWG Master warned me, but I didn`t mind and wished to learn it neverthless but in the meantime I really understand this warning very exactly, lol. Learning WWG is a long road, a very huge challenge and one has to practise probably many years very intensely for to become really well in prediction by using WWG. Better you know this and just walk this road very patiently. Take it slow, there are no fastly progresses possible.

Another hint: Care more about the appointed than about subject an object line. For example: If you ask a money question, look what happens with the Asset!!!! Is it supported or killed? What is about the Sibling (because this is the enemy of the Asset). Does the Children help the Asset? Is the Asset bound to another line (or month or day branch), or struck by another line and/or day or month branch. After you checked out all this you can care about: Is the Asset on the self or object line and if there are intresting bondages between and so on....

The first thing you should be focused on is the appointed. The appointed contains the answer to your question. After you checked out all effects of day and month branch and other active lines on your appointed you can deal with the position of the appointed. Like: Is it at the lower or upper gua/trigram, is it on self or object line, or is it in the near of the self line, which lines surround it and so on. After you checked out all this try to come to conclusion. But first then. It isn`t enough to check out what happens on self and object line. Self and object line is only one part of the whole thing. It is an indication, but not the whole message.

Hope this helps

Greetings to the Philippines

Chinese Characters: Lol, yes you are right. By the way I find chinese language very inspiring. There are a lot of "word combinations" which are very intresting. I don`t know if this is to see if someone translates chinese into english but the translation into German is very intresting. Why do you learnt geman once? *be confused*lol. German sounds really ugly, lol. But one can express a lot of things in german, this is on the plus side. I find it hard to pronounce chinese oh my god. I have got a lot of fun by trying to pronounce it and I`m sure no chinese will ever understand what I am able to talk in chinese, lol. But reading chinese characters works better in the meantime

Best wishes Yvonne

@Hilary and moderators: Sorry for "abusing" this forum for to send posts which are meant for another forum, but the content here is intresting for all Wen Wang Gua practitioners no matter at which forum they post and so I hope you understand and allow me to do this here. I hope that freedom of expression is still a high value here. My information about the Five Arts Net is also intresting for all.

Edit: Ps: I recognized right now that the moderators of the Five Arts Net even edited the posts of Romyudong and so I even don`t know what Romyudong wished to tell me. Wow, this is........ I find no words. I just hope that Romyudong will become a member at Clarity Online now, because here we can share our thoughts, our experiances and our knowledge freely. Amen.

 

[forty two]

Hi all,
sorry again for offtopic, but I have started it, and now I have to bring it to an end. I have got an update of the Five Arts Net "desaster". I got answers by the moderators in public and they also posted my recent posts (which calmed me down). Seems that they have got a very strange forum rule there and it is that it is actually not allowed to ask members in public for private contact. Because the I Ching told me to walk the path of peace I followed this advice and accepted this strange rule, but not without a comment as you can imagine. If you wish to follow the "issue" you can do it here:

http://www.fivearts.net/index.php/topic,12475.50.html

I hope that I don`t need to bother you with additional updates now and that I can go on posting my Wen Wang Gua stuff still in both forums without any trouble. Thanks for letting me speak here

Best wishes Yvonne

 

[pocossin]

Hi, Yvonne,

I went to the Five Arts site. It contains interesting material. I attempted to join, and now after 24 hours my application for membership has yet to be considered. Clearly this site is not closely administrated. Do you know who owns this site? My guess is that it is Hew Yon Long:

http://www.ziweiuniversity.com/?page=founder

He has his own theory of Zi Wei Dou Shu, which involves Chinese astrology and ideas from modern physics. I understand why Hew (if I have guessed correctly) does not permit links to be posted to his site. If links cannot be posted, then there will be little or no spam.

 

[forty two]

Hi Pocossin,
I have absolutely no idea who owns this site. Can`t answer your question. I will also stay at the Five Arts Net although I`m not enthusiastic about a couple of things and so I just said honesty what I`m thinking. I was afraid that they could censoring also other content of my posts, but they don`t, so my fears has been a bit paranoid, lol.

It seems that they only censoring posts where actually this rules are broken. I think that this behavior is a bit paranoid from their side, but okay no reason for me to leave the forum or making a big thing out of it.

So: Not everything is perfect there (in my humble opinion), but that`s fortunately not reason enough for me to leave the forum. The content on the site is great, they have got a huge amount of information concerning a lot of intresting themes and in the meantime I also could get into contact with some very nice members there and so I can say I feel good in staying there now.

Sometimes some clear words has to be spoken, but that not necessarily means endless conflict or dividing/separation in the end. Often it is the conflict which brings people closer to each other in the end The conflict makes us aware for each other, it clears the borders and intentions.

Therefore: Enjoy your membership, but take care not to offer your email adress in public, lol. You can post your email adress at your profile and then it is to see at your avatar and others can at least contact you if they wish.

Best wishes Yvonne

 

[pocossin]

Enjoy your membership, but take care not to offer your email adress in public, lol.

Thanks, Yvonne, but nobody there is taking care of the shop. I continue to receive the message: "Your account is still awaiting admin approval." Maybe admin is off on vacation. They aren't online. Perhaps I am supposed to stand in the snow until the monastery doors open. Whatever, there is much interesting material there, but almost everything is left incomplete. For example, somebody is taking Moon L. Chin's correspondence course in MeiHua Divination, yet he doesn't bother to show up and describe the ultimate benefits or liabilities of the course, which is exactly what a prospective subscriber to Moon's course would want to know. Some posts require that a member have 360 posts before permission to read is given. I doubt even the list owner has made 360 posts. Anyway, it's an interesting site, but anyone who goes there may expect a hassle.

 

[forty two]

Hi Pocossin,

Thanks, Yvonne, but nobody there is taking care of the shop. I continue to receive the message: "Your account is still awaiting admin approval." Maybe admin is off on vacation. They aren't online. Perhaps I am supposed to stand in the snow until the monastery doors open.

Lol, probably only until the leaves fall from the trees. I also waited a couple of days until my account was activated.

Whatever, there is much interesting material there, but almost everything is left incomplete. For example, somebody is taking Moon L. Chin's correspondence course in MeiHua Divination, yet he doesn't bother to show up and describe the ultimate benefits or liabilities of the course, which is exactly what a prospective subscriber to Moon's course would want to know.

Can`t say anything about this, because until now I only checked out some material I can use for learning WWG and that was complete so far.

Some posts require that a member have 360 posts before permission to read is given. I doubt even the list owner has made 360 posts.

WHAT???? Lol. Oh my god you made an new discovery. I already find that this "you must be logged in for to see the hidden post" sucks, but I often enough complained about it, I guess.

Anyway, it's an interesting site, but anyone who goes there may expect a hassle.

I guess now you understand better my critique on the system there. I actually don`t know why they handle all this way. I would have been glad if someone would have explained me in a calm and peaceful way, maybe I had understood. Maybe not. Who knows. But as a final conclusion: They won`t change their system at the five arts net just because I don`t like it. I just can ask myself: Can I accept it or not and for my intentions (to share wen wang gua information) there are no borders as far as I can see. I also get what I need and this is mainly information about the 5 elements.

Can`t say anything about the other themes, I just have recognized that they deal with lot of topics and that there are also endless threads concerning the topics. But I can`t say if the information is complete or not. I`m busy enough with this wen wang gua theme, lol. My plan was also to deal with Mei Hua later. Sounds really intresting. Got a bit information from others about it in the meantime.

But when you will be a member then you can also make your suggestions for some improvements, if you dare

Best wishes Yvonne

 

[heruKaeric]

I just signed up here @ onlineclarity. Have been lurking for a few months.
I needed to join, as i was banned for life from fivearts.net!
All i did was post 3 book reviews. One about david Twiken's "Introduction to Qi Men Dun Jia"
Was scaithing. I suggested it was easier to look up the type of day ( yin dun, or yang dun)
At an online web calculator.
A. Either mr. Triken owns the forum, or
B. The "Shanhai mystical union" (wink) felt threatend.
So i will be keeping my opinons to my self here.
I have been building a notebook of najia facts, and was reading this thread.
I also am interested in references to "light and dark" for my yin and yang notes.
I hope this will be a good community for me.
5Arts had good sections, on feng shui, and qmdj. But as i am trying out
Hetu loshu hexagrams, and now 6 line theory, this forum has been where i've spent most of my reading.