Hello,

I was wondering what your thoughts are on literal symbolism? For instance, today I asked about a situation where I'd met and chatted to a neighbour while in my garden. I'd been wanting to meet the neighbour and - I must admit - was loitering deliberately knowing he was about to pass while walking his dogs.

I received: 22.2.5 > 9. Not only does line 5 talk about wishing to make an acquaintance, it is specifically about gardens.

I have had a similar experience once while drinking wine and cast the Yi only to receive a line that was not only relevant to the situation but was specifically about wine. (64.6)

Typically we read the Yi as metaphor, but it does feel particularly uncanny when the line not only reads symbolically but literally. Jung for instance regarded the I Ching as being an example of synchronicity, although consulting the oracle never normally feels to me like synchronicity - except when the symbolism is literal. Then it feels as though past, present and future just collided.

I just wondered if anyone had any thoughts on that.

Hi Veavea,

I'm really glad you posted this. Your experiences are very interesting and I too have encountered literal symbolism. Last month I went blind in my right eye, queried the I Ching about treatment, received 46.6 - numerous translations of line 6 specifically mention blindness.

Another occasion happened yesterday. In the morning I received some excellent financial news and then went about my day. I live in a large city with many panhandlers. Usually I give money to anyone who asks but, interestingly, only one person per day seems to approach me. Yesterday three people asked me for money and I gave them each a small amount of cash. Because of the good financial news I received I went to the grocery store and splurged on a few delicacies for myself (this is unusual because in recent years I've needed to be very frugal.) After coming home I had an extra nice lunch, asked I Ching for general guidance, received 53.2 for my reading. Amongst various translations of line 2 are these:

LiSe: "Eat and drink full of joy."
Confucius/Legge: They eat and drink joyfully, but not without having earned their food.
Wilhelm/Baynes: He does not merely eat his fill.
Blofeld: Good fortune in the form of delicate and plentiful food.
Wing: You are in a secure position. The activities that lie on the road ahead will further consolidate your development. You may feel free to share your good fortune and security with others.

The reading felt like almost an exact picture of my morning.

Today I asked about attending a large meeting of psychiatrists which I was very ambivalent about. I got 57:2-53; the changing line says, “many priests and magicians.” Now I know what the Yi thinks of us . . . .

—Russell

russell said:

Today I asked about attending a large meeting of psychiatrists which I was very ambivalent about. I got 57:2-53; the changing line says, “many priests and magicians.” Now I know what the Yi thinks of us . . . .

—Russell

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Quite! Thanks for these contributions, I came back to add this, for what it's worth: I woke up this morning feeling a bit overwhelmed by life generally, but keen to get on with the day. I cast the Yi, and received 28.2 > 31 - I didn't fully read the interpretation. I logged on to facebook and after reading one or two messages watched a video a friend had posted showing a forest submerged in water in Russia.

Anyway, after pottering in the kitchen for half an hour I am about to tackle the day's tasks. I check my Yi reading for a fuller interpretation and read:

Blofeld: This hexagram symbolizes a forest submerged in a great body of water.


(FYI - this is the video... https://www.facebook.com/playgroundenglish/videos/283983581934979/?pnref=story)

Wow! I love this thread. Forest underwater is amazing. On June 10 I received 10.3 which has foreshadowed upsetting events for me in the past:

Liu: A one-eyed man can see; a lame man can walk. But when they step on the tail of a tiger, the tiger will bite.
-
LiSe: Tailing the tiger, he bites man, pitfall.

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On June 13 I encountered a stray kitten in my neighborhood and tried to zip it inside a pet carrier after coaxing it halfway inside the carrier. Scared kitty went bananas, biting and scratching my arms from the elbows down. Yesterday I had to get a tetanus shot and start a cycle of antibiotics due to the wounds. Other neighbors and I are still trying to get the kittens (turns out there are two of them) but we are now proceeding with help of an animal rescue group who has proper traps. Several different people are interested in adopting them so we just need to get them to the vet for shots, spaying/neutering, etc. Wish I had remembered the 10.3 warning before approaching first kitty with bare arms

In many of the systems of Chinese metaphysics, there is the idea of Images.
Every Stem/Branch, or line of hexagram have Images that come with them. We look at the Images and when we see something occurring often we say it will happen.

For example Yang Metal(Geng/Shen/Qian) have Images of large machine, big city, vehicle, something cold and many other things.
If we see that Image coming from somewhere else as well, we know the situation that it's showing us will be related to that specific image.

While in some systems like Mei Hua there is the idea of signs, if you have understood what is happening you will see conformation, like for events related to fire may see a woman dressed in red color if you walk specific amount of time etc.

Overall from what I know it isn't exactly literal, by itself, it's just showing very specific Images, that when used right start to show whole situations(especially when adding the 10 gods from their equivalent of our astrology, in whatever system is used).

Just my view, of course. : )

That is very interesting, Nevermind. Thank you for posting info. If one wanted to explore this more how would he/she look up symbols associated with a certain line? For instance, I received 37.5 as my daily reading today. Do you know of a resource where I can look up symbols for 37.5? Thanks in advance for any help.

galatea11 said:

That is very interesting, Nevermind. Thank you for posting info. If one wanted to explore this more how would he/she look up symbols associated with a certain line? For instance, I received 37.5 as my daily reading today. Do you know of a resource where I can look up symbols for 37.5? Thanks in advance for any help.

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Hey. : )
Problem is to use images for the lines, have to be able to assign the elements to that lines.

We have a few different sources of Images in a normal Hexagram.
For this case, the hexagram is 2th generation wood. That means that you will be on the second line, while what you are asking for is the 5th line. What you are asking for is changing.

However when we assign the elements, we see it changes from Si Yin Fire to Si Yin Fire.
So in reality no change.

There is Image related to it's element(Yang Fire, because that's in Si roots), there is Image related to the position in the Trigram(in this case it's human related things, if it was 6th line, would be ideas, concepts, believes etc.), there is lots of Images related to the relation of the whole 2th generation Wood hexagram to that line(in this case the relation is called Child, or Hurting Officer/Rob Wealth in BaZi and chinese astrology), and there are Images for all relations it can have.

The last part, basically means that it has specific relations to other lines, in this case Si Fire on 5th line is clashing Hai Water in 3th line. More Images there etc.

Overall for the Images to the line itself you need some info about Liu Yao or Wen Wang Gua(that system includes assigning the branches from the chinese calendar to the lines).

For that any book about Wen Wang Gua is good(can also check the basic rules in the link on the bottom of the post), or if you can find good calculator that isn't in Chinese. One good book is "secrets of wen wang gua" by Jack Chui. He is using it in very different way then what I'm used to, but for assigning and the pre-read part of the divination all is same everywhere it seems.

About the images, well books for WWG or BaZi have the basic images for the elements. But for Yi Jing alone, probably best source is Shuo Kua. That is the 8th and oldest wing of Yi Jing(wings are commentaries on the text done from the point of view of Confucianism). can find it in many places around the net, at least 4-5 different translations were out there a few years ago, probably still are. Must read for people interested in Yi Jing and the whole Five Arts, in my view.

Other nice book for more modern images to the elements is The Tao of I Ching: Way to Divination by Tsung Hwa Jou.

And many BaZi books, blogs etc. will have many images related to elements and relations.
When we know the principles we can assign images without text, for example things that grab attention/easy to see - fire. Weapons, things we see as beautiful, the Sun and many, many other things...

So it all depends how deep you want to go into the system. Chinese Metaphysics is very big system, so if you want basic images related to the Hexagram, can just use the text with the lines. If you want the lines and their relation to the other lines and the Hexagram overall you need Wen Wang Gua, that is very similar rules to Chinese astrology, but instead of looking at specific time, we look at the lines of a hexagram. However the time of asking the question is also important.

I guess it may be lots of info, if you have specific question for any of it, feel free to ask.

For Wen Wang Gua, some basic info here, based on Jack's book:
http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?16339-The-Secret-of-Wen-Wang-Gua-by-Jack-Chiu
http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?16452-Wen-Wang-Gua-Rules

For general Images - Shuo Kua, it can be found around the net, also any BaZi book, blog etc. usually have many images for many of the relations. Important to keep in mind, the names sometimes are different, for example Jack Chiu calls "clash" "opposition". And what people call Child there is Output etc. but generally same thing with a few more minor differences. : )

Thank you so much, Nevermind, for such a detailed answer! I really appreciate your time/effort and will explore some of the references that you mention, starting with the links regarding Wen Wang Gua.

galatea11 said:

Thank you so much, Nevermind, for such a detailed answer! I really appreciate your time/effort and will explore some of the references that you mention, starting with the links regarding Wen Wang Gua.

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You are welcome, it is very powerful system once we get used to it, although a little complicated at start.

39.6>53

Just had another experience with very literal symbolism from the I Ching. For the past few weeks I've felt a lot of pressure inside my ears but kept hoping the situation would resolve itself. Yesterday morning, in response to my daily request for guidance, I received 39.6>53. Immediately I sensed that Hexagram 39 "Obstruction" referred to my inner ear problem. On LiSe's site I saw these words about Hexagram 39 character JIAN: "The character represents a man upside down with a big mouth." That struck a chord with me but I didn't understand why.

Unwisely I proceeded with plans for the day (Wilhelm 39.6: - "Going leads to obstructions") and suffered a terrifying attack of vertigo while driving. It took every ounce of my will to safely guide the car to the side of the road where I could crawl into the back seat and lie there until the attack subsided. Much later - it took a long time to get home - I consulted Dr. Google for info on vertigo. Many medically-sanctioned remedies consist of hanging your head upside down (like the JIAN character) in specific sequences and positions to dislodge foreign particles from the ear canal.

Today I feel like a new person. Left ear feels completely clear and I am proceeding with head-hanging exercises (Hexagram 53 "Gradual Progress") for the right ear which has already improved tremendously.