Yesterday I did something rather radical and, I think, completely changed a relationship with someone. I'm wondering how they felt about that, whether they are pleased about it, or even noticed what was, for me, a hard choice to make. To me, it was something of a relief because this has been hanging fire too long and I think they had the wrong idea of how far i can be pushed. For them? No idea. So I've consulted the IChing. What effect has it had on X that I have simply retreated?

The casting was: Hexagram 63.1.4 changing to 31. I've looked high and low in the archives and elsewhere for any clue what this means. So far, I'm stumped. Suggestions please?

Like some folks who are far-sighted and unable to see what is right under their nose, sometimes when people are too close together they don't really see each other and take each other for granted.

63.1.4
Then it's necessary to stop tolerating inconsiderate behavior and pull back.

31.
Hopefully this pulling back will bring things into proper perspective and create the possibility of Influence once again.

Sounds like a case of He wont know he misses you until you go away!

Rosada

Thanks Rosada. Yes, I have felt entirely taken for granted in this, and kind of ego-building because I just stay on and encourage where I should have probably been rapidly pedaling in another direction that serves MY interest. Which is what I started to do. There seemed to be a little confusion like -- "Oh, don't you want to do this and this and this now?" And I said I didn't see the point, I have so much on my plate and had better get on with it. And there has been what feels like a stunned silence. But again, I was thinking, maybe just silence and no real thought or care about it. So I HAD to know -- does it even matter -- or only matter to me?

I don't get Hex 63 and never have. Before completion -- so what part of a process is THAT? Almost complete? And, can you tell me, or can someone, just what line 63.4 means?

63 is After Completion, not Before. Did you mean 63 or 64?

63.4 is a temporary fix, which is likely to not hold up in the long run.

While many hold that 63 refers only to what is already completed, I'm convinced it can also mean a process of finishing something, refining or even perfecting it.

If you really meant 64.4, that is trying to do too many things with too few resources, including time.

Hi Meng, it's 63.4 So it's AFTER completion. My casting is for what effect it has had on this other person that I just retreated, basically shutting down our communication, not going through with plans we had and saying not to invite me anymore thanks. I guess it means it is perceived as finsished? In a way I thought he'd be relieved -- I am. But he seemed surprised at some of what I said. Which gave me a certain satisfaction to be honest. It had seemed I was always the one waiting to know what came next. Now I was announcing what came next -- nothing!

No offense, but guys so often think they are entirely adorable and that you will hang endlessly by a thread. Surpriiiiiise!!!!

So here we are then-- completion -- but then how on earth can Hex 31 be the outcome? Isn't that a further influence? Looking above on the thread, Rosada seemed to think this resulted in a more balanced and proper influence or connection. But I don't exactly see how we get there from 63.4

31 was likely the context. To put it in reductionist terms, you called an end to the way this relationship was going. Maybe something further can develop, and then maybe not. My gut says, based on your comments, that you cut the cord which he was stringing you along with.

arabella said:

What effect has it had on X that I have simply retreated?

The casting was: Hexagram 63.1.4 changing to 31.

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Line 63.1 indicates that you have indeed surprised him, shook up him up somewhat but he feels no guilt as he believes that he has done nothing wrong.

Line 63.4 indicates that he realizes that this sort of happening can occur, that's life but he feels that with time you will get over it and everything will be back to normal once again. What he should be doing is looking for the root cause but won't as you will need to enlighten him. Ask yourself what has he done "wrong", some people are lousy at guessing games.

Hex 31 He still has feelings for you as shown by this hex but as he feels that he is not guilty, he believes its that emotional "women's thing taking over your head, but after a few weeks you will be back to "normal".

Yeah, what Willfox said, is right, let me just add that he will tend to back away at least somewhat. The commentary on line one says, "He may indeed not remain altogether untouched...He will not suffer any harm because his behavior has been correct." Line four commentary says, "Then everything is forgotten and peace apparently reigns once more."

In actuality, arabella, I suspect that you have been hurt more than he. If he was pushing you, I doubt he realized it.

Gene

Lets put it this way, some men are "blind", they need a guide, a neon light, and some women feel that a man should be the "breadwinner", so she gets upset when the guy cannot see the writing on the wall as the signals are just not obvious enough for him. She gets frustrated and upset, walks out in a huff because he's forgotten her birthday, so he thinks, what the hell have I done, and then wanders off down the bar to chat with friends.

Romance is/can be a guessing game, and that's what makes it hard, as some people just don't read body language, some of them expect you to speak up if you "want" something, not play tip-toe.

arabella said:

Hi Meng, it's 63.4 So it's AFTER completion. My casting is for what effect it has had on this other person that I just retreated, basically shutting down our communication, not going through with plans we had and saying not to invite me anymore thanks. I guess it means it is perceived as finsished? In a way I thought he'd be relieved -- I am. But he seemed surprised at some of what I said. Which gave me a certain satisfaction to be honest. It had seemed I was always the one waiting to know what came next. Now I was announcing what came next -- nothing!

No offense, but guys so often think they are entirely adorable and that you will hang endlessly by a thread. Surpriiiiiise!!!!

So here we are then-- completion -- but then how on earth can Hex 31 be the outcome? Isn't that a further influence? Looking above on the thread, Rosada seemed to think this resulted in a more balanced and proper influence or connection. But I don't exactly see how we get there from 63.4

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why on earth would 31 be 'the outcome' ? http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showthread.php?t=10108


I don't even think the answer is about him, i think it shows this is a temporary fix for you You think making this ending speech or whatever it was somehow resolved things...and it hasn't really. You haven't finished with him, you are still thinking about him all the time. What you did was a kind of temporary fix to get a reaction. But the very fact that you are asking this question shows its not working for you, you are still 'hanging on by a thread' as you put it because you now ask how hes responded to you...you are still clinging to his reactions even though you think you have ended it...but there is a continuation of the problem in your own mind. This action was an attempt to plug the leak in your boat, to fix things, its not working too well for you so if its an action you intend to go through with you need a bit more than this..otherwise there is no complete completion

Looking at your first sentence in the thread "yesterday i did something radical..." your answer shows me you didn't, not as much as you thought. The 31 shows strong influence, pull, attraction to him...and that remains there for you.

63.1 also says to me this was not a radical breakthrough at all..it was a sort of failed attempt at completion, your tail got wet...you say its over but it isn't over at all in your head.


Of course bearing in mind what Luis said to you on the other thread http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/friends/showpost.php?p=113244&postcount=16 you must realise the only person who can understand this answer is you...anyway.

. . . they had the wrong idea of how far i can be pushed.

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Isn't there a gender confusion in the discussion? Arabella could be speaking of her female boss.

Just a general comment on 63, based on how I've watched it play out repeatedly. Running or swimming a lap completes a cycle, but it doesn't always complete the workout or race.

I think it's a frequent error to look at these things to always represent something final. With 63.4, this is certainly the case. However, the next lap may be a different course than the last, maybe swimming butterfly strokes rather than freestyle, or jumping hurdles rather than running a hundred yard dash.

The end of one cycle typically means the beginning of another. I've received 63 regarding relationships which ended in the form it was previously, but continues on in a new way. Sometimes a better way: refined or even nearly perfected for the time. At least being better understood. But, being the needy creatures of habit we are, sometimes we'll return to the old ways, unable or willing to end old habits. That's an example of 63.4 too.

arabella said:

Hi Meng, it's 63.4 So it's AFTER completion. My casting is for what effect it has had on this other person that I just retreated, basically shutting down our communication, not going through with plans we had and saying not to invite me anymore thanks. I guess it means it is perceived as finsished? In a way I thought he'd be relieved -- I am. But he seemed surprised at some of what I said. Which gave me a certain satisfaction to be honest. It had seemed I was always the one waiting to know what came next. Now I was announcing what came next -- nothing!

No offense, but guys so often think they are entirely adorable and that you will hang endlessly by a thread. Surpriiiiiise!!!!

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pocossin said:

Isn't there a gender confusion in the discussion? Arabella could be speaking of her female boss.

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Not unless she callls her female boss 'he' rather alot !

trojan said:

Not unless she callls her female boss 'he' rather alot !

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Yes, Trojan, Arabella does eventually say 'he':

arabella said:

In a way I thought he'd be relieved -- I am. But he seemed surprised at some of what I said.

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But isn't her relationship to this 'he' remarkably similar to the relationship to her boss? I can't tell them apart

pocossin said:

But isn't her relationship to this 'he' remarkably similar to the relationship to her boss? I can't tell them apart

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I don't know.., I don't think so.maybe I'm not up to speed on the plot of this one. The female boss as i recall was way out line making out she had received an unpleasant letter about Arabella when she hadn't. As far as I know her friend hasn't done anything like this...I thought he was just being non comittal and she doesn't know if he wants a relationship or not. I could be wrong...

Thanks for all this feedback, I just have so much to sort out right now. Remember the 51 readings end on end? Well dare I wonder why when I think about it all on one page? Here's the state of play -- the house I rent has just gone up for sale. I have a house in another country a friend is occupying for the moment, hoping to leave he says in the Fall. All my assets are tied up there, which is a true worry.

You all know how the job thing is right now and the status with my boss who, by the way, is acting like nothing ever happened. There is an alternative job in the wings that is far more secure in some respects but involves moving, almost literally, into a war zone. It could be great, it could turn around and bite me in two if I try it on for size.

And then there is this man, whom I know is a generally good human being, but we've been in a holding pattern for over a year now in which half the time we're together we socialize and the other half I hear about his deceased wife. Having said that, I like him and he's one reason I would stay here and put up with the job. So in the past few days I did Jesed's reading scenario for relationships to see where it took me. [See Exploring Divination]

And one thing that struck me was the question about "general diagnosis of this relationship" which was hex 38.1.2.6 becoming Hex 16. And this casting I took to mean that I was overlooking obstructions to the relationship and getting enthusiastic about nothing. Beyond that....Qualification of my position w/in the relationship was Hex 20.4.5.6 becoming hex 16. Qualification of HIS position was Hex 61.5 becoming Hex 41. What should I DO relative to the relationship was Hex 43.2.5 becoming Hex 55. So I was basically seeing that the basis of the relationship was questionable and that I needed to DO something. So I pushed it. Maybe not off the radar screen entirely, but I gave it a shove.

Before doing any of these castings, I had invited him to dinner [it was my turn for some variety of hospitality and we're up to dinners now] and he didn't even answer my invitation for three days. This is getting TOO lackadaisical. And it's so sporadic, one minute I'm like his long lost best friend because we meet in the street, and then no response to a direct invitation. I'm trying to make four major life's decisions with practically nothing to work with, and he's messing about like the King of the May.

Practically everything anybody has offered here is making good sense. All true. I haven't really just ended it. My feelings are plainly hurt and everything else hurts already. Hexagram 51 anybody? I've got it coming out my ears.

trojan said:

. . . . maybe I'm not up to speed on the plot of this one. The female boss as i recall was way out line making out she had received an unpleasant letter about Arabella when she hadn't. As far as I know her friend hasn't done anything like this...I thought he was just being non comittal and she doesn't know if he wants a relationship or not. I could be wrong...

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Like in the business, here again Arabella is being undervalued. It's depressing and unfair. There ought to be a better presentation of her position. Two old saws come to mind: " The squeaky wheel gets the grease," and "Absence makes the heart grow fonder."

Thanks pocossin for putting your oar in. I'm not good at squeaking, maybe that's why I went for the "absence" solution. And even there, I'm more worried than he is -- obviously.

If anybody sees something in the Jesed diagnostic that I have ignored at my peril, please say. I know it's a lump to look at and maybe I didn't dissect it enough to come out with a good plan. The Hex 43 just jumped out at me. BUT when he didn't even answer for three days to my invitation I think I kind of lost it and simply reacted the way I felt, regardless of all else.

Arabella, please take this as candor without any personal agenda.

I'm seeing, including in the general diagnosis, that you're relying far too much on the validation of others (38 is the hexagram of "others"). Line 1 says you can't lose what belongs to you. Line 2 says to gird up yourself and be strong within so that you can handle whatever others may think of you.

I'm concerned that now, in addition to these other people, you may be relating to the Yijing in the same way: seeking an affirming reading. The only real affirmation that's going to move you through these difficult situations has to come from you. That's what 43 means. 43 is speaking and standing up for who you are, sans intentional offensiveness. But that does not always mean getting your own way. Sometimes you have to yield and give the others their rights to do whatever they choose for themselves.

I do not see you as a victim here but as a participant. And I see self reliance as your preparedness to handle these other people and circumstances, better than you currently give yourself credit for.

cuz we all need one sometimes

I know what your saying Meng is true. And I don't feel victimised really, normally I'm prepared for just about anything. Lately, it's like Willow Fox said somewhere along the way: it's like doing the wash without a bucket and water, suds, running everywhere. Meanwhile, are the clothes even getting clean? Pure frustration and, as you say, no control over any of it -- no way to assure or even predict an outcome.

Frankly, I'm a bit off my feet and nothing seems to be working, in a new country, having counted on backing at least from the relatives who invited me here. For the most part, it's been that way until recently and I think my business knowledge got a bit threatening because, after all, it is THEIR business and I was hired simultaneously as an "underling" and as a consultant to solve their multiple internal issues. So they have problems, and ego issues of their own in relation to my opposing roles at either pole.

The housing problem has sort of topped it off: total instability. I'm told I can expect viewings on the place I'm living in to begin next week and I feel i've got no haven at all now. That privacy and relaxation of any sort is about to go out the window.

A social/romantic relationship would have been nice, but not something draining and without reciprocity of any substantial kind. And, again, I've apparently chosen somebody who, however competent in normal circumstances, is even more at Sea than I am. It's just overwhelming I think, but it will get better. Nothing remains 51 --- or 52, or 12, or even 38, so far as experience says. Thanks again all for commenting. I appreciate any suggestions on these readings -- I'm doing what I can think of but, so far, it isn't a happenin thing. Advice taken for the "boss" from contributors on Clarity seems to have kept things workable anyway and that has blown over, at least for now.