For a section of the book that I am working on, I need as much feedback as I can get on the issue of vegetarianism vs meat-eating.

I think that being a vegetarian for many years myself makes me a bit biased on the subject and so it seems like a good time to ask others, from both sides of the fence, what they think of the I Ching castings that came up for me on this matter.

1.
Man as a meat-eater, in general? 37.5.6 >36
Affect on health & longetivity? 46.2.5 >39
Affect on spiritual growth refinement? 43.3.5.6 >38

2.
Man as a vegetarian, in general? 36.3 >24
Affect on health & longetivity? 8.5 >2
Affect on spiritual growth refinement? 10.6 >58

I will so appreciate the sharing of any and all ideas on all these questions/answers overall. However, could someone specifically comment on why they believe hx 36 might have shown up for both types, when inquiring in the general sense? Thank you for your time.

Demitra

"could someone specifically comment on why they believe hx 36 might have shown up for both types, when inquiring in the general sense?"

Probably because you're not qualified to ask questions on behalf of the entire species. Or more specifically, you're not qualified to know that stuff at this point. I'm going to put a question to you now that will sound pretty rude, but it's not meant to sound that way, it's meant to be delivered in a kind and gentle way: who are you to ask questions for everybody?

I think you'd get way further ahead asking the same questions of and for yourself.

Demitra,
I cant comment on all your readings but the one for man as meat-eater in general......37.5..that's "the king in his castle" line....for me, it is the image of a lion, the ultimate mammal......a hunter and a meat-eater....

36: there is more to this topic than can be known right now

I have known quite a few vegetarians who look pale, anemic, have unhealthy dry-looking hair. This reflects an incongruence to me.......beyond being just a reflection of their not getting all the proper protein...

vegetarian food has a finer energy and perhaps is conducive to spiritual growth refinement, yet there are probably many mammals who are not ready for this boost into higher realms.... who need to be grounded, first, as mammals ..... whose natural state is to be a meat-eater........ before they can make their natural progression -46- into the realms where vegetarian eating will come naturally to them and not be a forced attempt to be "healthier."

I too think that there cannot be an across-the-board conclusion about the benefits of eating vegetarian....

that last reading 10.6 kind of says that too...Yes, it is conducive to spiritual growth refinement but perhaps only when you have reached that point, put in the leg work... can look back at where you have come from and find yourself naturally in the position to assume this kind of "higher" stance in congruence with the whole of your being.
Otherwise, you find yourself -38- Looking Askance at your anemic reflection in the mirror....; )

Man as a meat-eater, in general? 37.5.6 >36
Man as a vegetarian, in general? 36.3 >24

On the species level, the human family (37) needs meat. But the portion of the meat required in our daily food consumption is on the top level of the "pyramid". You do not need much. Care(line 5) have to be taken to meet its limit for metabolism (line 6).

Why 36?
36 is the fire beneath the earth, the metabolism in the human body. In this light, 36.3 is about the function of vegetable in our metabolism. If you notice carefully, the fire trigram is converted into thunder. Energy is released. So, what Yi is saying is that the enzymes in the vegetable is helping in the chemical chain processes during the metabolism to release energy to reinstate 24 in the body with the surrounding (homostasis?).

Man as meater eater:
Affect on health & longetivity? 46.2.5 >39

Man as a vegetarian:
Affect on health & longetivity? 8.5 >2


46 is about growth .
Man need meat during growth period esp. at the age 10s ~ 20s. This is line 2 of 46. After age 25, the Oracle recommends going lightly with meat. Take sparingly(line 5).

39 draws a profile of body's need for meat as we age. It is a declining trend as "obstruction" suggests. If you refer to Karcher's translation, 39 also implies "impeded circulation".

Man as a vegetarian:
Affect on health & longetivity? 8.5 >2

Vegetable a passive choice for TASTE.
It is a "passive" food in attracting people (hex 2).
Man has to stop to check his craving for taste in the effort to include vegetable as his main supply of energy and nutrients (Hex8). With the help of various modern cooking methods and the availability of various spices and herbs, the hunt for tastes could be achieved even with the tame passive vege (line 5).

It may sound disgusting at first, but the meat our bodies are built to consume seems to be insect meat--that is if we look at it from a purely physiological point of view.

Our fingers are long and delicate, we have a nice mix of teeth which includes some forward placed incisors capable of cutting through some tougher material, but these are not quite up to snuff when it comes to large game meat. In addition, our bodies do not respond well at all to cooked red meat, when cooked over an open flame, all the fats and oils in many types of game meat create large and unwieldly organic molecules--some of which are damaging at the cellular level, and identified as tumorigenic or carcinogenic. On the other hand, raw and uncooked, red meat is equally as corrosive and brutal on our digestive system, we just dont appear to have the metobolic rate, tissue linings, resident microbes and "juices" needed to make red meat extremely useful to us.

As a final straw, we lack the strength, speed, agility and stomach volume to justify eating huge amounts of game meat, but our brains (well maybe all of our brains put together haha) put us at the top of the food chain, so go figure.

If you look at the diet of our closest biological counterparts you would find they eat small things and things that can be picked and pulled apart, like fruits, nuts, roots, and bugs--general forage material, and not much, if any, fresh kill. Its probably not going out on a limb to say thats probably the diet mother nature wants us on.

As an interesting side note, in some circles it is thought that insects got kicked off our menu and became generally considered "gross" as a byproduct of the rise of agriculture, chiefly from the development of domesticated animals, and food store houses--as people began to realize relatively stable and nourishing food supplies by their own efforts the wild versions began to fall out of favor and flavor.

Insects, such as the locust, and many larval states of flying and burrowing bugs became seen more as competitors and opponents, scurges even--insects in general also became associated with filth, trash, feces and disease the closer and closer we got with our hooved friends, and the higher and higher we piled our grain--in addition to this, as human population densities increased, there came a seemingly out of control bloom of pests such as lice, fleas, flies, mites, weavels and ticks, vermin which came to define the catagory of life we call "bugs", whose digusting and detrimental attributes came to completely overshadow any positive forms of bug life out there.

I guess one could also say that sticking to a diet that consumes most of your day is not a sound evolutionary plan, especially when you have a giant brain capable of doing so much more then looking at ground patterns and finding food items--but then again if "we" directed our agricultural efforts on insects rather then live stock and the grains we grow exclusively for those big lunks to eat maybe we would not be devouring the land at the rate we seem to be doing so these days.

Man as a meat-eater:
Affect on spiritual growth refinement? 43.3.5.6 >38

Man as a vegetarian:
Affect on spiritual growth refinement? 10.6 >58

I happen to notice something interesting about 38 vs 58. It is like two methods, both having different degree of popularity and acceptance.

10.6 is about a method with proven records. No doubts about that.

43.3.5.6?
For me, it is like saying that the spiritual growth is about determination.
Line 3 and line 5 together form Hex39 - a passing obstruction/difficulty
Line 6 form Hex23- the relevation of truth.
Unchanged lines form Hex54 - realizing your hidden potential - spiritual growth!

Overcoming an obstruction (of craving to meat) with determination will open one to the truth in the process of spiritual growth.

I personally have not found too many vegetarians to look bad, or be sickly. If they are, it is probably not because they are vegetarian. On the other hand the strongest and most physically capable men I know are vegetarians. A large portion of the human race needs meat only because the continual eating of meat over the centuries has weakened our DNA. Meat eating species have teeth that are pointed and work well for tearing or ripping meat. Vegetarian species have teeth like ours that are relatively flat, useful for grinding down vegetable and fruit. The largest animals, gorrillas and such are basically vegetarian. Those that aren't have digestive tracts that can handle meat in an uncooked state, and not be affected by things humans would be affected by under the same circumstances. Cooking kills enzymes and such that are catalysts in the stomach to break down the food into useful materials for the body.

It is a misnomer to think we need the protein from meat. Where do you think cattle get their protein? And we don't need that much of it anyway. The covering of cancer cells is made of protein as most of us have way too much of it in our system.

I have not had time to really study these lines and hexagrams. I do think it is interesting, the first three have reasonably positive primary hexagrams and lines, but the relating are more negative, the reverse can be said for the second three.

Gene

Dobro.. Micheline.. Yly2pg1.. Brian.. Gene..

(Dobro) The fact is that I am seeking knowledge that goes out and beyond my immediate ego-self. You will notice that I am not asking questions FOR everybody, but rather asking questions REGARDING everybody as a whole. And since I see everybody together as my WHOLE self, then my questions are indeed of and for myself (though anybody reading this discussion could potentially benefit from it as well).

Regarding the interpretation of hx36 having to do with being qualified enough to ask certain questions in life: I believe that if a person can come up with a question then they are perfectly qualified to know the answer. One thing I have always found to be true of the I Ching is that it will always provide me with an answer that will shed LIGHT on my inquiries - Yi has always handled my questions by responding to them directly and factually. In my experience, a response from anyone that emphasizes personal deficits and places limitations on how much I'm allowed to know, is someone who, at this time, prefers the state of unknowingness over the possibility of change that the question provokes.

Having said that..

There is a great deal to consider here - so much knowledge and insight, too. I found your definition of hx36 as "energy releasing" especially helpful (thank you Yly2pg1). I am sincerely grateful for every response that was clearly given in the spirit of generosity and so I will begin by thanking you all for taking the time to reflect and consider, and then return to express it here.

I've done a great deal of research on the human physiology and the effects of different diets on it. I used to eat meat myself and for a number of reason that kept cropping up, I gradually began switching over to a more vegetarian diet approximately 15 years ago. So I have a personal before and after experience to drawn from.

Over the years, I discovered that my new diet not only satisfied every possible dietary need I had (and as a fitness & weight-lifting enthusiast, diet is critical), but opened my taste buds up to a vaste array of so many other flavors I didn't even know existed. More recently, it has sensitized me anew to the animal kingdom as well, so that I am now beginning the process of communicating with animals telepathically and they are in turn communicating back with me. But that's another story altogether.

Part of my research shows that the reason I took to vegetarianism, like a duck takes to water, is because of my blood type. Here too, there is too much to say on the subject at this time, so I will not go into a whole lot of detail. In my case, as a Blood Type A person, I have a predisposition to thick blood that allows fat to build up on my artery walls, and attempting to subsist on the typical Western diet, which is very high in saturated animal fats, was a deadly choice for me considering the implications. Blood Type O's, on the other hand, because of their natural high stomach acids, have thinner blood which means that a high animal protein diet won't create the same kind of damage to their bodies as it does in mine. Anyway...

All in all, I agree that protein is a vital building block - our bodies need it as a primary fuel for re-building and healing. The questions I posed here were mainly for understanding whether or not the protein needed for optimum health had to necessarily come from *animal* protein. In terms of blood type, clearly we all fall into different categories, but does that mean that some of us MUST have animal protein for optimum health, or does it mean that some of us physiologically just need MORE of it than others, but that it can come from other sources?

Which leads me to ask the following questions:

Is *animal* protein ideal for optimum health for all? 36.1.5 >39
Should one remain a meat-eater then? 23.4.5 >12

Is *vegetable* protein ideal for optimum health for all? 2.3.6 >52
Should one aim towards vegetarianism? 3.3 >63

If anyone would like to comment on these as well it will be much appreciated.

Basically, I agree with a lot that has been said here. However, (Micheline) though some vegetarians do have some health issues, some meat-eaters do, too. On the issue of hx37: I think it may have something to do with the fact that in order to kill and eat an animal we must view them as 'other'. Meaning, we view our species as a FAMILY that is unique and separate. Perceiving ourselves as different from other species, we justify the "rightness" in consuming them. As Brian said, we have the brainpower and all the technology we need to provide ourselves with a comparably superior diet. Gene (and others) I hope you return and share whatever (more) ideas you have regarding the hexagrams. You have no idea how useful this all is to me. I have a lot of background study and experience but would like to have a better understanding of these things as they compare to what Yi is saying. Again, much gratitude to you all!

Demitra

The family as meat eater. It is common to sit at the dinner table and eat according to traditional wisdom, the four or five basic foodgroups. I forget which. Unfortunately, western wisdom isn't so wise, and it seems the east has lost it. It used to be in China and the East meals were cooked in accordance with five element theory. Nowdays many have never heard of that. The five basic tastes (five elements) were included in every meal. Nowdays it is chop suey with a load of msg mixed in. Here where I presently live it is even worse, every Chinese restaurant around is basically a buffet. Where we pick out the foods that may taste good to us, but are not balanced by five element, and is too much food. So we get fat, and dehydrated with msg. But I digress. At any rate, it is typical to sit at mealtime with the family and eat a meal that is supposedly balanced but usually is heavily overbalanced with meat, with only a touch of vegetables, usually microwaved or such, so slowly, and unnoticeably, we weaken our bodies and even our dna, and generally get fat. (hexagram 36)This is the tendency of the family (hexagram 37) in the western world.

39 restricts. health and longevity suffer.

Gene

(meat) Affect on health & longetivity? 46.2.5 >39

(veggie) Affect on health & longetivity? 8.5 >2

Interesting that both responses are positive. Perhaps, from the perspective of our species as a whole, the Yi is taking into consideration how many of us don't have enough food. Thus meat, which causes health problems when consumed in excess particularly in affluent societies, is still generally beneficial.

Cute answer, 8.5, "letting the game escape" ;-)

- Jeff

There are few ways to explore these lines and theme(s):

Man as meater eater:
Affect on health & longetivity? 46.2.5 >39

Man as a vegetarian:
Affect on health & longetivity? 8.5 >2

(1) 46(nutrients for growth) vs 8(catalyst) in metabolism and their relationship with 39 and 2 respectively?
(2) Line2 and line5 of 46 in human lifespan.
(3) Line 5 of 8 in the metabolism process.
etc...

I believe with sufficient relevent data on hand, you are able to dictate a "pattern" which is useful to the reader.

I think that being a vegetarian for many years myself makes me a bit biased on the subject and so it seems like a good time to ask others,...

You can try this website because it is designed to bring back the bias (sort of?). And you do not have to worry whether your question is out of your own personal realm or across the board of human species because the answer is "consistent". Consistent in the sense you get the same answer today, tomorrow or coming years if you do not change your values (or embrace the same values throughout).

ICPlus

Is *animal* protein ideal for optimum health for all? 36.1.5 >39

Line 1 is about real harm it could incur on man. But man can take precautions - (taking flight! three days without eating!)

The lordly people has words to use!
Is that you, Demitra?

Line 5?
What come to my mind now is that Line 5 in the template 2 (or Hex 2) is Hex 8.

When line 1 (of 36) gives way, it means man resorts to avoid meat. What comes in replacement is 8, seeking alliance with an alternative source of protein with inner clarity.

Is *vegetable* protein ideal for optimum health for all? 2.3.6 >52

Generally veggie is benign to our human biological system (2). However, as line 3 indicates, it is the major player in maintaining the optimum health, but its contribution is always eclipsed and not very much appreciated.

Line 6?
My own opinion, do not try to push too much to create a pure veggie realm! Sometimes it may create needless struggles as the veggie is always benign and powerless by nature.

... it seems the east has lost it. It used to be in China and the East meals were cooked in accordance with five element theory.

It is still very much relevent today my dear friend!

What Gene points out reminding me of the old saying in Chinese - take the foods within the circumference of hundred li of one's dwelling. Why?

If you understand Chinese language, here is a story about a veggie in an area of China where one of its veggie changes its taste beyond ten_li.

The fact is, as Gene points out, the art of Chinese cooking is what the five elements in action. To cook a herbal soup for example, the Chinese will use a "clay" pot which is of EARTH element. FIRE must be maintained at a rate which is conducive. It is found that the WOOD is a suitable source to produce the right amount of heat at the pace that promote gradual dissolution of the content of herbs (METALs) into the WATER. The Clay could hold the minerals (METALs) in the water with min. chemical reactions if any.

The end results, a herbal soup in harmony.
But, that of course, within the scope of a dish.

BTW, there is a job in the West where a person has to use his tongue to taste the red/white wine(s). He can tell, which year, which region, which farm and some said, the landscape where the tree lies ... I think this bears some analogy to the veggie story in China.

Gene,
That was a great point you made about cooking and the five element theory. Something for me to look into.

Yly2p1,
Your comments are most enlightening and helpful. I for one love a good story - wishing I could read that Chinese story, too.

Jeff,
I love your sense of humour!

Hi Dobro,

:b

I understand what you mean when you say maybe there are questions we are not qualified to ask or not qualified to understand. I can think of a few: "Does God exist", "What happens after we die?", "What's the meaning of it all?" (!)

But I don't see how Demitramm's question enters that realm... I really like Micheline's interpretation, for instance, I think it makes a a lot of sense. On the other hand, I am not vegetarian but I do think that being a vegetarian "would be nice", so to speak.
What I find interesting is that when a question like this comes up the interpretations vary more widely than when a personal question (that is impresonal to the people participating in the forum) is asked. With the 'species' question, I think people tend to tint the readings with their own POV's, even if they don't do it conciously.

Even if the Intelligence behind the I Ching is very personal to each one of us, even if it is nothing more than our own subconcious mind, I don't see how I am more qualified to ask or interpret "What should Dobro do...." than "What should the human diet be like". At least in the second question I have a stake and some insight. In the first quetion, I don't, although I might care and I might come up with good advice even without tossing the coins.

Keeping in mind that the question is not "What should everybody do" but more like "What's ideal".

My bias is this: I believe the Yi responds best to questions that are sincere attempts on our part to harmonize with the universe spiritually. That means a question that is focussed on the here and now, the next step I take in my attempt to live life meaningfully.

Questions beyond that scale are a waste of time, I believe. Asking smaller questions ("So - should I buy the black shoes, or the brown ones?") is a waste of time, I believe. Asking bigger questions, like the examples you gave, is a similar waste of time I think. That's my bias. I think a lot of people would agree with me though.

See, I think the Yi's purpose is spiritual, in the sense of being a tool that helps us harmonize with the cosmos so that we can grow and learn.

So, maybe Demitramn needs to know about vegetarianism to develop spiritually. I mean, it's a serious possibility in my view. Learning how to discriminate about what to take into your body can produce not just better physical health, but can work a kind of attitudinal shift as well, so that you start only taking in good impressions to feed your mind on. No more video games, no more soap operas, no more horror movies - that sort of thing.

But when somebody starts asking questions on behalf of the entire population of the planet, it seems to me that isn't necessary. Or at least, it isn't the sort of question you should ask the Yi. That's my bias. So, if you work for the WHO or something, or if you're a nutritionist, then that's stuff you want to know, for sure. But asking the Yi about it? I dunno... it seems like overstepping the bounds to me. The scale's gone too big. It's wanting to know big stuff too easily. It's using the Yi as a magic crystal ball that reveals secrets, and that makes me uncomfortable. It seems like a misuse of the oracle. Again, that's my feeling and my bias. No hard feelings?

Oh, and yourself lol.

Me? hard feelings? (looking over my shoulder)
... me?
My opinions are so random, anyway.
So, maybe, you believe in Micheline's interpretation, after all. Because what you are saying is that it is okay for you to ask 'Should <u>I</u> become vegetarian' (but it's not okay to ask 'Should <u>the human race</u> be vegetarian. Her interpretation pretty much says vegetarianism is good for some of us but you have 'be there' to benefit from it.
By the way, I know some people reacted to her saying that some vegetarian people get anemic by pointing out that you don't have to be vegetarian to be anemic or to be very, very, sick but what is being pointed out is that - if you want to become vegetarian -you have to be extra careful to get a proper nutrition, specially since you were a meat-eater all this time and you probably don't realize that you will have to now find other sources for protein, etc. Some kids become vegetarians and they will only eat french fries, for instance!

And no more sticking out my tongue, I forgive you for laughing at me



And I forgive Martin too! (Isn't it grand of me)
I'll even dance with him

"My opinions are so random, anyway."

LOL - no, not random! Anything but random! There's meaning and pattern behind everything! lol

And 'grand' is a grand word.

<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

But when somebody starts asking questions on behalf of the entire population of the planet, it seems to me that isn't necessary. Or at least, it isn't the sort of question you should ask the Yi. That's my bias. So, if you work for the WHO or something, or if you're a nutritionist, then that's stuff you want to know, for sure. But asking the Yi about it? I dunno... it seems like overstepping the bounds to me. The scale's gone too big. It's wanting to know big stuff too easily. It's using the Yi as a magic crystal ball that reveals secrets, and that makes me uncomfortable. It seems like a misuse of the oracle.<!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>

Holy cow!

At the risk of being repetitive, I am writing a book. It is a spiritual health book -hopefully a unique one that people will find useful and practical. I'm certainly not interested in going to the trouble to write yet another book on health and diet that covers the same things that so many other health books already cover.

All my research has led me to where I am right now. Many of the "voices" I've researched are pretty much agreeing with each other but there are a few that are conflicting and contradicting the whole process. Of course, I could just ignore them and set them aside but I feel that what they have to say makes a whole lot of sense. I need to account for them in some way.

This is where I Ching came into the picture for me. Could it be so inconceivable that perhaps what I seek here myself, is one of those "nudges" you are so generous in offering others under other more personal circumstances? And why exactly is my request for assistance from I Ching in writing my book any less "personal" than someone's love relationship?

I find it curious that my efforts stand out in your mind as "overstepping the bounds" or some kind of underhanded misuse of the I Ching. Perhaps I did not make myself clear enough when I said that I have spent a long time researching and studying health and diet. How exactly did you come to the conclusion that I was using the I Ching like some sort of mystical crystal ball to access the secrets of the Universe?

In any case, it seems that this thread has been hijacked into new territory where the subject is not so much about what the hexagrams mean but whether or not I should be asking my questions at all. What a drag.

*grin*
Sympathising with Demitra, as I've had a few people tell me I was asking Wrong Questions also, from time to time. (See one response to my blog entry with a reading on the two-slit experiment.) Though I think Dobro's made it pretty clear that he's talking about his feelings and how it seems to him, not about Wrong Questions. (Phew.)

Anyway...
It does strike me that just as you say, different diets suit different people. If you look at the colossal variety of traditional diets across the globe (from no plants to no meat), the idea of finding what's best for humanity as a whole begins to look daft (erm, to me, that is ).

It wouldn't surprise me if these readings reflect the 'politics' of the world your book will be published into, where vegetarians in general learn that hiding their light is the most intelligent strategy by far.

I don't know about 'man' as vegetarian, but the prospective reader of your book as vegetarian is going to be joining the minority. Jizi felt that what went on at the Shang court was wrong, and so he found a way to opt out without subjecting others to the full glare of his insights - which wouldn't have changed anything, except to get him hurt.

The core possibility of 36 is Release: step outside the system, and you can see your own way more clearly; you're not obliged to fulfil anyone's expectations (your own included).

And then 24 - Returning - following your own path according to your own timing, regardless of where anyone else goes. One thing this reading is not about is any kind of mass movement - I think that despite the question, it's talking about individual decisions.

Looking at the line:
'Brightness hidden hunting in the south.
Gets their great leader.
Hasty steadfastness not possible.'
Well... what it says to me is that as vegetarians, we've decided to Do Something, to seek out a cause of injury (whatever kind of injury). And we've caught it! Hit the nail on the head! Only thing is that hitting one nail doesn't build many cities. Changing back to Yi's metaphor - not a bad idea, that - catching the leader makes the rest of the conquest possible, but doesn't mean you can complete the work overnight. You need a longer-term and broader view, also.

I think you'll enjoy what Jack Balkin says on this line:

"You come face to face with the source of your difficulties and you now understand what has been holding you back. Gather your wits about you. The time has come to act with determination. You must take control and reform the situation. Nevertheless, you must also proceed carefully. It is dangerous to try to remedy everything at once, especially when you are fighting against ingrained patterns of behaviour. The problems you face - whether due to negative thinking, bad habits, or outmoded practices - have not arisen overnight, and they will take a long time to rectify."

OK, meat eaters probably enjoyed it a whole lot less. However, there is not so much for the vegetarians to enjoy in the parallel reading about 'man as meat eater'. People in the home - which is literally a pig under a roof, and it's not being kept as a pet, is it? A home is where you keep and share your meat.

Nor is there anything negative in the moving lines: emphatic good omens, in fact. Only I do get the feeling these are images of mastery and responsibility, willingness to take on and be present to the whole process. We have a local butcher who stalks, shoots and prepares for sale the deer from a nearby estate: this seems more in tune with lines 5 and 6 than the cellophaned packages of factory-farmed misery at the supermarket.

I don't know why these two lines changing would reveal brightness injured 'underneath'. Maybe something to do with the fact that the home is a refuge: the sequence says that when you are injured in the outside world, you naturally turn towards your home. And there you eat in harmony with your family and your culture: you don't throw a political-moral-spiritual wrench into the age-old works of human relationships.

I hope this throws some useful ideas into the pot.

Another idea for the pot (the soup is vegetarian, I hope?) about 36 is that it might refer to wounds that are inflicted on animals and more generally the harm that is done by the mistreatment of animals to the relationship of man with nature. And, as man is part of nature, to the relationship of man with himself.

37 to 36 also makes me think of the family in dark times, at the dawn of humanity. When eating meat was perhaps the only way to survive. The changing lines are both yang, they refer to the man of the household, who goes out hunting?
And/or to the link between meat and yang?

It is remarkable, by the way, that the theme of hunting comes up in two answers to questions about vegetarians, 36.3 and 8.5.