Radiator bug screens can be practical for the reason you sight, Tom, whether from the southeastern love bug or several other species that proliferate during summer. Even big 16 wheelers use them, and I've had to pull off country roads and highways to wash the face shield of my motorcycle helmet on occasions. Some bras have radiator screens built in, however a regular bra shouldn't cover a vented radiator, as that would defeat the purpose of preventing them from clogging with bugs and would cause overheating themselves. Of course the rear engined, air-cooled VW Bug doesn't have these issues to deal with unless one was to drive down the highway in reverse.

I've never seen Vegemite sold or served in the US. The first time I heard of it was in an 80's song from Men At Work, and it was about coming from "the land down under". The only time I tasted it was during a trip to New Zealand. It must be an acquired taste, which I have not acquired.

Car and truck bras have been around in the US for decades. It was a fashion statement in the 80's (hence my fetish comment), with a practical function of protecting the paint from chipping and squished bugs. I had one that came with a small truck but always thought they were pretty silly, especially since the, um, headlights poked through.

But now it seems some have really gone too far. She's a dirty girl.

Ah I got ya now - Yes I've seen this sort of thing. Lol to pokey headlights!

Well I guess us Aussie grow up with Vegemite so never had to acquire the taste. - Liss

Sometimes Vdubs only work in reverse

goddessliss said:

Sometimes Vdubs only work in reverse

Click to expand...

Now we must add "Vdubs" to the list.

Are they also called "bugs" there, as here?

Vegemite in Aussie is Marmite here in UK....isn't it ? also known as 'yeast extract' well it is just a brand name for 'yeast extract' isn't it.

I love the stuff so much that when the jar is nearly empty I stick my fingers in and lick it off.

ah here's some info


http://britishfood.about.com/od/diningdrinkingtradition/a/marmitevvegemite.htm

now you've made me want a marmite sandwhich.

oh well in the article they say there is a difference between vegemite and marmite


I so love marmite

sooo said:

Now we must add "Vdubs" to the list.

Are they also called "bugs" there, as here?

Click to expand...

Yes they are called bugs here, haha when you write it down it sounds funny!

Trojina said:

Vegemite in Aussie is Marmite here in UK....isn't it ? also known as 'yeast extract' well it is just a brand name for 'yeast extract' isn't it.

I love the stuff so much that when the jar is nearly empty I stick my fingers in and lick it off.

ah here's some info


http://britishfood.about.com/od/diningdrinkingtradition/a/marmitevvegemite.htm

now you've made me want a marmite sandwhich.

oh well in the article they say there is a difference between vegemite and marmite


I so love marmite

Click to expand...

Oh yes definitely a difference in taste. I don't like marmite but I love vegemite on toast or very fresh bread.

It seems this is a distinct difference between a phrase from the UK, NZ, and possibly Aussie (don't know about the last), and the US. I notice it is used very casually, even on UK news or interviews on public TV: making a statement of a question, such as "..isn't it." "..doesn't it. "..wouldn't it." This, after making ones point. It makes sense for you to go, doesn't it. After all, people will be expecting you, won't they. Notice this is not posed as a question to the person being spoken to but as an obvious fact. Yet the Brits pride themselves on being polite and proper. It's always struck me as odd.

I see this quite a bit on this multinational forum, mostly from the British, and I noticed the same while in New Zealand, which considers Britain to be their mother. It's always made me cringe. Yet I'm quite sure there are things those of us from the US casually say, some of us more than others, that likely come off as rude, improper or downright crass.

In the US, where people are often considered blunt and downright rude, the only time I've heard this kind of word structure is a "hard sales" technique, called an "inverted tie down," and even then it's considered condescending, presumptuous and pushy. A regular sales "tie down" question is a softer "trial close", such as, don't you agree? Don't you think so? The idea being that if someone agrees with a number of small feature/benefit questions, the "yes momentum" makes the big closing question result in a natural yes answer. An inverted tie down is risky to use, as people here don't like to be told what they think, feel, want or should do.... do they.

It seems this is a distinct difference between a phrase from the UK, NZ, and possibly Aussie (don't know about the last), and the US. I notice it is used very casually, even on UK news or interviews on public TV: making a statement of a question, such as "..isn't it." "..doesn't it. "..wouldn't it." This, after making ones point. It makes sense for you to go, doesn't it. After all, people will be expecting you, won't they. Notice this is not posed as a question to the person being spoken to but as an obvious fact. Yet the Brits pride themselves on being polite and proper. It's always struck me as odd.

Click to expand...

Mmm it is an antiquated idea that 'Brits pride themselves on being polite and proper'. Britain is a multicultural society hence a lot of people are descended from other nationalities...but also it just isn't a stereotype that I or anyone I know would identify with. Not these days anyway.



Secondly there are many ways to use the phrases 'isn't it ?' or 'doesn't it' and so on. Which I will go on to below.

I see this quite a bit on this multinational forum, mostly from the British, and I noticed the same while in New Zealand, which considers Britain to be their mother. It's always made me cringe. Yet I'm quite sure there are things those of us from the US casually say, some of us more than others, that likely come off as rude, improper or downright crass.

Click to expand...

That idea of how Americans are seen by Brits is pretty quaint, Victorian....out of date....cutely antiquated. I think Americans might have been seen, stereotypically, that way maybe 50 years ago or more. Now if I had to say what Americans say casually that can grate....well it's nothing specific said other than 'have a nice day' and other such terms of being almost over polite which to Brits can seem false and shallow.(uk service givers prefer to be offhand when giving service...something to do with a reaction against deference to class I imagine) Also the general US tone of over 'positivity' can seem shallow, lacking in depth or substance. I am speaking in caricature terms here just as the idea of brits being proper' is an old fashioned caricature.

In the US, where people are often considered blunt and downright rude, the only time I've heard this kind of word structure is a "hard sales" technique, called an "inverted tie down," and even then it's considered condescending, presumptuous and pushy. A regular sales "tie down" question is a softer "trial close", such as, don't you agree? Don't you think so? The idea being that if someone agrees with a number of small feature/benefit questions, the "yes momentum" makes the big closing question result in a natural yes answer. An inverted tie down is risky to use, as people here don't like to be told what they think, feel, want or should do.... do they.

Click to expand...

These terms can be used in very different ways....and are not at all aggressive except when trying to make a point in debate situations.

Some examples of every day use.

Me. It's hot today isn't it
Greengrocer. Yes, I couldn't sleep last night

​

Click to expand...

or

Me. It's hot today isn't it

Greengrocer. Mmm no I feel quite cool actually​

Click to expand...

As you can see this would be perfectly pleasant chit chat and have nothing at all to do with tieing anyone down. Perish the thought. It is just being friendly

(Just in case it's not a known term 'green grocer' is a shop selling fruit and vegetable...and the man or woman presiding also is called the greengrocer')


Another way 'isn't it', 'doesn't it', 'wouldn't it' might be used is as a straight question. Like this example

Me. You are coming at 12pm tomorrow aren't you ?

My mum. No I will be coming at 1pm.​

Click to expand...

Again there is no rudeness in the exchange.


Another common way these terms are used is in debate. Often when one person is trying to find agreement on one fact so that the argument can proceed towards clarification. There may be an element of aggression in this if you call debate aggressive....but it isn't a 'tie down' at all, it's someone inviting someone else to either agree or disagree.

Interviewer. But all these immigrants are a strain on the health service aren't they ?

Politician. Well we have to look at the actual figures (or whatever they might say)​

Click to expand...

The interviewer's job is to put the question to the politician that the people want to know. But you know that don't you .....hehe


Another way is more about trying to help someone understand or see your point by offering something you think is obvious, so obvious they have to agree. But of course they won't always agree so they aren't tied down are they So usually that might be used in a debate type conversation where someone thinks what they present is a fact the other can't disagree with

.."....the sky is blue isn't it ?"​

again a person who doesn't wish to concede any ground might say

."..well it all depends what you mean by blue"​

Click to expand...

which is always irritating when people are just game playing and disagreeing, making long boring arguments for the sake of it when they know perfectly well what you mean.


Mostly all these terms are part of everyday conversation and not rude.

The idea of sales people using these terms seems bizarre. I can't imagine a salesperson saying 'these are nice shoes aren't they ?' it would sound totally lame....no sales person would ever say that here.


I think somewhere you asked about US phrases or speech mannerisms which grated . The one that bugs me is the whole "I am humbled" thing. You know someone says something nice and the other person says "I am humbled".

why ? What's that all about ? Why do Americans keep saying they are either humble or humbled ?


Trouble is with that example I think I've heard it here too...from Brits on TV. I shout at the TV "what do you mean you are humbled ?" How can someone saying nice things to you make you humble

But I think this may be a term of speech the UK has unfortunately picked up from the US. But I could be wrong. Maybe you picked it up from us ?

Either way makes no sense to me. I mean if a person is really humble they wouldn't go around shouting about how humble they are would they ? Aha there is the 'would they ?'...here 'would they ?' is a direct question I am asking.

Why do people say they are humbled when they are praised by others ? To me making a show of being humble is not humble.

Nationality aside....direct question coming....why do people say they are humbled when they are complimented or given favours and so on ? Like an actor will say he is humbled to be asked to do X Y or Z.

A regular sales "tie down" question is a softer "trial close", such as, don't you agree? Don't you think so? The idea being that if someone agrees with a number of small feature/benefit questions, the "yes momentum" makes the big closing question result in a natural yes answer. An inverted tie down is risky to use, as people here don't like to be told what they think, feel, want or should do.... do they

Click to expand...

I have never come across this kind of sales technique. But sales aside this pattern of trying to find agreement on one point so that a debate can progress is pretty universal IMO. It's what people do when they debate. It is what one does in discursive essays in universities everywhere I would have thought. It is in fact one main way all intellectual debate proceeds, all polemic.....this really is not a pattern for debate only used by the British.

You say 'people here don't like being told what they think , feel' . That's funny because if the US has a stereotypical trait to outsiders one of them is conformity...in cultural things anyway.

Anyway stereotypes are in the end caricatures.

But I won't be adapting my speech mannerisms to US taste any time soon ....or be made to feel they are wrong or pushy and all that. So if you want to say you are humbled at any point don't mind me.

Trojina said:

I mean if a person is really humble they wouldn't go around shouting about how humble they are would they ?

Click to expand...

Made another thread with a 15.6 tangent...

Re: stereotypes - they certainly can be caricatures, but if there was no truth to them they couldn't exist, could they. (See what I did there *groan*) I mean, there are things that make American culture different from British culture, and it's not just that you have Marmite and we don't.[SUP]*[/SUP] Same for every other culture on earth. Same for subcultures within a country. Just because there is some overarching "American culture" doesn't mean all Americans are the same. That's where the problems come in - taking the basic character of a country and assuming that every individual who lives there behaves that way all the time. Of course they don't, but it also doesn't mean the basic character doesn't exist.


[SUP]*[/SUP]Not that I could define it. Am terrible at such things. I couldn't even pithily define my own culture, and I live in it, lol.

....and BTW I saw you asked Liss about the term 'pushbike'' we use it here too...it's a bicycle.


I think this thread in terms of translation must extend beyond UK/US as I am the only brit on the thread, and I am half Ukrainian at that.

So I think we need Aussie translations too and any other country...even for literal translations of any words/speech mannerisms we don't understand.

I literally don't understand it when people, from any country, say they are 'humbled' if praised. If anyone can enlighten me as to what it really means that would help. I think it's quite a modern expression, at least I don't recall hearing it much before the last few years.

No one I know here in UK would ever say they found it humbling to be praised. I think I heard some celebrity on TV say it....

okay let me exercise my brain cells

Do people say they are 'humbled' when praised or made offers to because they don't feel they are worthy of that praise or recommendation ? You see no one in my daily life would say this. It is only celebrities who seem to say they are humbled or Americans.

I think it is like saying, "i am honored" accompanied by a bow.
when we bow we humble or lower our heads a bit.

Trojina said:

I literally don't understand it when people, from any country, say they are 'humbled' if praised. If anyone can enlighten me as to what it really means that would help. I think it's quite a modern expression, at least I don't recall hearing it much before the last few years.

Click to expand...

I honestly think it's a trend, at least in America. It's fashionable right now to be humble. No one is allowed to be better than anyone else, even if, you know, they are. That's where we get things like, "We should have a president who's like me/the rest of us/normal people." Well - no we shouldn't (IMO). "We" would be disastrous as president. What people mean (I think) is that they want a president who can empathize with normal people, and then do things to fix things. But "we" would have no ability to even try, as we would find out in about five seconds if we were actually elected.

I mean, I get that everyone is the same as everyone else in some ways, and people who are blessed with extraordinary talents shouldn't think that means they're perfect, and so on and so forth. But I think the "forced humility" schtick needs some common sense applied to it. (The world is going through a dearth-of-common-sense phase in a lot of ways right now, IMO .)

How very dashing ! How noble !

I see...sort of . I don't see how feeling honoured is like feeling humbled at all. When one is honoured one feels well honoured, grateful, happy if sometimes slightly embarassed doesn't one ? No ? Why would anyone feel like a piece of **** on a shoe because they have been honoured ? Why would anyone feel lowly because they have been honoured ?

I think as it doesn't make total sense it's a figure of speech, a mannerism.

Trojina said:

I think as it doesn't make total sense it's a figure of speech, a mannerism.

Click to expand...

I think that's a good way of putting it.

Thank you for explaining Moss Elk my dear fellow

I am humbled that you responded to me

Your faithful servant

Trojina


:bows:​

Click to expand...

Oh and thank you Lisa. I just saw your reply too. What you say is interesting..


I'm glad I wasn't imagining the whole humility trip. I have noticed here that if a beautiful actress or singer is being interviewed she will always take care to point out her flaws. So the interviewer may compliment her but she will point out her wonky elbow or something. I think they do this as you say to show they are just like others and are not conceited. But actually lately I've thought 'it really isn't wrong to be beautiful, nor wrong to shine' and I wished they wouldn't do it.

Comparing this to old footage of actresses or singers being interviewed it's quite different. I don't think years ago the icons of the day had to act humble when they had praise. They would be gracious yes, but it would be a gracious acceptance of the admiration. Would Elizabeth Taylor for example have pointed out her flaws ? I don't know...it's just a theory but you're right it does link to 15.6 in a way.

Edited to add - cross-posting - yes, you are absolutely correct. Graciousness is a good word. There is a difference between being gracious and being conceited, and I think we have somehow lost the art of graciousness . Someone once gave me the wonderful advice that a good way to handle a compliment is to simply say, "Thank you." If said correctly, with the right tone of voice, there's nothing more that's needed.

------------
[Original comment]

I mean, maybe sometimes people truly do feel humbled by good fortune or honors. It might depend on the circumstances. Say someone saves someone's life, but they feel like it's just because they were in the right place at the right time, or acted instinctively and it worked out well. But at the same time, they know that they're the same schmuck they were yesterday, and that's not going to change. I could see how they might feel humble in that but for the grace of God they could have been the victim instead.

I also wonder if the humility thing is a Pluto in Virgo construct that happens to resonate more in the U.S. than elsewhere. I don't know enough about the astrology of countries to tell.

I mean, maybe sometimes people truly do feel humbled by good fortune or honors. It might depend on the circumstances. Say someone saves someone's life, but they feel like it's just because they were in the right place at the right time, or acted instinctively and it worked out well. But at the same time, they know that they're the same schmuck they were yesterday, and that's not going to change. I could see how they might feel humble in that but for the grace of God they could have been the victim instead.

Click to expand...

yes I can see that...

In 'real life' I can see the distinctions but on here, except perhaps sometimes the language thing, I don't feel any distinction and many of you have brought me so much that clearly my own aussie mates cannot. Although there are a couple of aussies on here, who have helped me, of course. - Liss

lumme

lumme
/ˈlʌmɪ/
interjection
1.
(Brit) an exclamation of surprise or dismay
Word Origin
C19: alteration of Lord love me
http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/lumme

an antiquated phrase I have only ever heard Hilary use. That is it is a term no longer used by most people.

British English: hoarding; American English: billboard.

Throughout Monrovia there are huge advertising hoardings warning people of the dangers.
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/inside-ebola-hell-mirrorman-witnesses-4067533

British English: to shop; American English: to inform on or betray, esp to the police.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/dad-shops-xbox-addict-son-4071428

Trojina said:

an antiquated phrase I have only ever heard Hilary use. That is it is a term no longer used by most people.

Click to expand...

More class than blimey.

British English: faff; American English: worrying about details?

Ha ha, you've been reading the errors thread .

I took it to mean messing around, waffling, dilly-dallying, not getting on with it...Trojina will be along to clear it up I'm sure.

I use 'faff' to mean fuss, taking a long time over small piddly little details, as Lisa said.

'piddly = small and insignificant

Well, we were each half right - I said taking too long, and Pocossin said details. Neither of us quite got the "fussy" part right, though maybe that's what Pocossin meant by worrying.

Piddly is the same here.

UK: kagools (kagouls cagools cagouls kagoules cagoules); US: rain coats.

Rain, mud, kagools and empty beaches... It must be Bank Holiday weekend!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/index.html