Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom
Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).
My dad recommended that I go to HR but I hesitate to because I'm a bit concerned about a change in dynamic like you said. Last thing I want is for him to start resenting me, but something does need to change. I usually don't have a hard time laying down boundaries, but I'm not sure why I feel nervous this time. Doesn't matter though, I'm uncomfortable and I can't let him think I'm secretly into him, cause I had a situation last year where I thought someone was into me who wasn't and it really hurt. I'm kind of relieved you recommended against HR though because that did feel intense.On 3rd thought, did you already decide to go to HR before asking Yi? Or did you interpret 23.4 as a need to go to HR?
I'm curious what the damage is so I asked and got hex 39uc... hmm. Maybe it's commenting on my hesitation to lay down a boundary? Maybe I've been too slow to say something, and he has developed an idea that I'm interested too? I don't think my behavior really reflects that but I can't control someone else's perception.If he's doing it to you, so comfortably, then he's done it before.
Line 4 suggests the damage has been done here and it needs to be sorted out.
I don't know who WR is ? I've never seen this line translated that way before, it's not about a bed blanket.This is a very sensitive subject so I will write what I consider lines 4 is saying according to WR.
"A worn-out bed blanket hurts".
I think it's certainly a situation to guard against. It may feel easier not to go to HR but that's not a reason not to do it. Tolerating it can be allowing this undermining influence to go so far as to impact the whole job. That is if you tolerate it it looks like there'd be a 23.4 scenario, tolerating it is 23.4 and that is the harm.Line 4 is probably encouraging me to go to HR, and possibly even lay down a hard boundary to his face. I suspect the main + relating hex combination might even be implying looking for a different job too. Whatever yi is recommending, it seems drastic and a little harsh. Thanks in advance
It's not a good idea to base another question just on the idea 'there will be damage' that will just complicate things...it's clear what the harm/damage is it is in 23.4, you are in it right there, being undermined, losing one's place. This kind of flirting whilst looking harmless can end up being very undermining as the woman almost has no option to play along, gets entangled and then he pulls the rug out from under here or here he pulls the bed out, the resting place. That can end up you feeling so incomfortable you leave, I have seen that before.I'm curious what the damage is so I asked and got hex 39uc... hmm.
This is on the one hand seemingly low key but it is absolutely not okay. You are at work, he doesn't have the right to touch you, to stick things on you, he's not 3 years old he doesn't have to 'play' by sticking things on you. All this is very undermining to you long term and it goes on because women think 'oh it's harmless and I can't make a fuss' yes you can because this dick needs to treat you like a human being not an animal to pet!I know he's flirting because he comments positively on my appearance often, he stands way too close to me whenever he gets the chance, he makes (very) vaguely suggestive comments, and teases me by sticking stickers on my body or flicking my hat or what have you, kind of like an elementary school kid does when they have a crush.
He could start by treating her like she's human. If a man in his late 20s doesn't know he cannot just touch women at work maybe he's not fit to work at all. Why should she even have to tell him he can't touch her, he shouldn't be touching her anyway. Nor should he be commenting on hr appearance unless they are close and it's their way as friends but he's not a friend is he ? He is free to like her but not free to touch her, get close to her, stick things on her or talk about her looks. How could this be innocent. He knows the difference between touching and not touching I should think.Treat him like a human. He’s free to like you. If you don’t want him to touch you, tell him. It may be innocent. He may have no clue how you feel. He may be unaware of how he’s perceived.
That sounds a bit like saying 'don't complain or it will be worse for you' which is what we want to get away from isn't it. Women have had to do this at work for decades, it needs to change and it shouldn't be put on her as her responsibility. I get you are saying 'this is what the reality is' but it's not one to live with is it?From personal experience, I advise against going to HR unless he does something you wouldn’t know how to handle on your own. Bc “turning him in” will most likely have a more negative impact on you than him. At worst, they fire him. Do you want that? At best, they talk to him and put it in his file. How do you think that will affect your exchanges with him? Or your other coworkers?
Actually stickers and hair flipping is bad enough already. It's not what a woman should have to experience at work unless she's really okay with it and the guy is a friend etc. Otherwise no, of course not, he shouldn't be doing that. He's not 5 years old. I can't see him a poor little boy who doesn't know he can't stick things on women.HR exists not to protect the employee, but the company. I only advise going to them if you know no other way to stand up for yourself. Or his behavior becomes dangerous and more serious than stickers and hair flipping. It may be overkill at this point.
HR is there to protect women from sexism or at least should be. I realise it falls short of the ideal but how can she not give away her power if he is sticking things on her ...she just had it taken from her. It is a disempowering act on his part and he should know better as a grown man and it is abusive.I learned that the best practice is to set boundaries early. That’s your job, not HR’s job. Don’t give away your power or sovereignty. And if that doesn’t work, then go to them bc you don’t know what else to do. So let it be a last resort.
Hi, Troyina, I´m Spanish, and I use a translation of Richard Wilhem (W.R) in my languageI don't know who WR is ? I've never seen this line translated that way before, it's not about a bed blanket.
I think it's certainly a situation to guard against. It may feel easier not to go to HR but that's not a reason not to do it. Tolerating it can be allowing this undermining influence to go so far as to impact the whole job. That is if you tolerate it it looks like there'd be a 23.4 scenario, tolerating it is 23.4 and that is the harm.
It's not a good idea to base another question just on the idea 'there will be damage' that will just complicate things...it's clear what the harm/damage is it is in 23.4, you are in it right there, being undermined, losing one's place. This kind of flirting whilst looking harmless can end up being very undermining as the woman almost has no option to play along, gets entangled and then he pulls the rug out from under here or here he pulls the bed out, the resting place. That can end up you feeling so incomfortable you leave, I have seen that before.
This is on the one hand seemingly low key but it is absolutely not okay. You are at work, he doesn't have the right to touch you, to stick things on you, he's not 3 years old he doesn't have to 'play' by sticking things on you. All this is very undermining to you long term and it goes on because women think 'oh it's harmless and I can't make a fuss' yes you can because this dick needs to treat you like a human being not an animal to pet!
He could start by treating her like she's human. If a man in his late 20s doesn't know he cannot just touch women at work maybe he's not fit to work at all. Why should she even have to tell him he can't touch her, he shouldn't be touching her anyway. Nor should he be commenting on hr appearance unless they are close and it's their way as friends but he's not a friend is he ? He is free to like her but not free to touch her, get close to her, stick things on her or talk about her looks. How could this be innocent. He knows the difference between touching and not touching I should think.
That sounds a bit like saying 'don't complain or it will be worse for you' which is what we want to get away from isn't it. Women have had to do this at work for decades, it needs to change and it shouldn't be put on her as her responsibility. I get you are saying 'this is what the reality is' but it's not one to live with is it?
Actually stickers and hair flipping is bad enough already. It's not what a woman should have to experience at work unless she's really okay with it and the guy is a friend etc. Otherwise no, of course not, he shouldn't be doing that. He's not 5 years old. I can't see him a poor little boy who doesn't know he can't stick things on women.
HR is there to protect women from sexism or at least should be. I realise it falls short of the ideal but how can she not give away her power if he is sticking things on her ...she just had it taken from her. It is a disempowering act on his part and he should know better as a grown man and it is abusive.
Practically I guess you could just freeze him out instead but I don't think it's right, I think your dad is right about going to HR but it's up to you of course. Either way I would prioritize keeping your position simply because pressures like these can very much undermine your stability long term which is what the 23.4 is about.
This is what I meant by the damage is already done - His Inappropriateness!!What bugs me about this kind of situation, speaking from experience and observation is the woman being treated like this is in a lose lose bind. Even if she is treated as subhuman 'look I can just touch you whenever I want' she is meant to act just the right way and if she doesn't it's all down to her 'lack of boundaries'. It doesn't sound much on paper but if you are in an office with someone being too close, invading your space, sticking things on your and flicking your hair then that person is being incredibly inappropriate and he should know it.
I don't agree. This man is her boss not a puppy. This is not about him liking her like a schoolboy and just being to awkward to show it other than sticking things on her clothes. It's sexual harassment not some poor 14 year old not knowing how to show a girl he likes her. He is in a position of authority over her and he needs to be stopped not made excuses for. It does depend on what floranova wants/feels but I feel this is serious enough now to deal with now. It could be a lose lose situation because reporting it may make it too difficult to stay, saying something to him might make it hard or too stressful. However I think the 23.4 is saying it could also fall apart anyway even if not reported because of the undermining nature of the harassment and that is what it is.It is not okay though it sounds like he likes you and is making a mess of delivering that message.
Oh good grief argh. I don't know how I overlooked this. The omen in 23.4 is pitfall. I don't see how it could possibly mean do the most drastic thing.Hm, though...I'll let all that there, but on the other hand, if you read this as a very direct answer:
Question: "How should I handle this?"
Answer: "Strip it away as severely as possible by advancing it as far as you can."
That could mean the HR solution. You asked Yi for advice, so take it as advice.
I really appreciate you, trojina! Being a woman really is a nightmare a lot of the time. It can be dangerous to lay down boundaries or reject men, but it's also dangerous to not do so. There's no pleasant or easy way for this to play out. I'm not terribly attached to my job though, I work in a grocery store for $16 an hour so it's not like it would be a big loss if I did leave. Honestly, given how lenient he's been with me in terms of attendance and being on time (life has been rough) I could see him deciding to become strict with me if he doesn't get what he wants.... maybe I should start looking around for something else. It wouldn't necessarily be me tucking my tail since I wasn't really trying that hard to hold onto the job anyway, and I'm not getting anything out of it I can't find somewhere else. What do you think?Also don't underestimate long term consequences of this kind of thing for females. It can really knock a person back, being messed with emotionally, making it harder to go to work, even affecting long term prospects and mental health.
I don't think floranova should have to face him,( he is her boss) and challenge him, why should she. Nor do I think him not appearing dangerous has anything to do with it, it's not about that. How can she challenge her boss anyway, it's not an equal power situation.
If her father says to go to HR I think perhaps he is right. I don't understand some of these replies they seem along the lines of 'don't cause trouble, he can't help it, he likes you'.....that's not the point. Sarah said
I don't agree. This man is her boss not a puppy. This is not about him liking her like a schoolboy and just being to awkward to show it other than sticking things on her clothes. It's sexual harassment not some poor 14 year old not knowing how to show a girl he likes her. He is in a position of authority over her and he needs to be stopped not made excuses for. It does depend on what floranova wants/feels but I feel this is serious enough now to deal with now. It could be a lose lose situation because reporting it may make it too difficult to stay, saying something to him might make it hard or too stressful. However I think the 23.4 is saying it could also fall apart anyway even if not reported because of the undermining nature of the harassment and that is what it is.
It looks to me a completely regressive situation, women shouldn't have to deal with that anymore it should be a thing of the past. Don't forget he is her boss so there is no excuse, he's not just a co worker which would be bad enough.
I don't care about the job but I worry whether it's proportionate to cause him to potentially lose his job. Last year I had a situation where I misinterpreted someone's friendly actions as romantic interest so I have to wonder if I'm unknowingly doing that to him... I suffered a lot from that situation and I don't want to be a hypocrite and punish this guy just in case I've accidentally given off the wrong signals, you know?This is what I meant by the damage is already done - His Inappropriateness!!
Why are you letting him get away with it.
Tell HR and wherever the chips fall, they do. Is this a dream job or can you do better for yourself?
I asked the suggested question and got 28.2.5.6 > 56. I don't know if I like that answer.... and line 2 made me gag a little given the context lol.If it were me, I think I might ask another question or two - just because it's a serious situation (maybe for you, too), so the firmer the ground, the better. I at least am not sure what angle Yi's coming from as I said up above. (Not that that matters, of course.)
Maybe just something like, "What if I go right to HR?" Very focussed.
Bingo. Our perceptions aren’t always clear. No need to start a fire. Just casually tell him if he touches you that you dislike being touched. I’ve done it. I had a man touch my hair and I simply told him not to. I didn’t go to HR. He was shocked and super apologetic when he realized I don’t like it.I just don't want to make this dude's life fall apart just in case I did something that could be construed as flirting, cause I've been on the other end of that.
Perhaps it’s reflecting your inner conflict. I get this hex a lot for my own issue with whatever it is.I also asked the other day if he's any threat to me, and got 6.2.5 > 35... line 2 sounds like he's more likely to give up or possibly suggesting that I give up and line 5 seems to be saying I should bring someone else into the matter, but I don't know if HR is the right option. I hate this 🫠
All of this: yes. I like the “bored” interpretation too.Here's what he's doing / what the situation is (28.2.5), and if you go to HR, here's what would happen (28.6), and what do you think about that?"
I like 53.5 too, especially with boundaries in the background (52). He needs to be reminded they exist.
In my country I think it is he who would be given a 'casual' reprimand because he should be reprimanded by his boss. It is something to take seriously, not something a woman ought to have to handle totally by herself.Just casually tell him if he touches you that you dislike being touched. I’ve done it.
I sent you a DM.I don't care about the job but I worry whether it's proportionate to cause him to potentially lose his job. Last year I had a situation where I misinterpreted someone's friendly actions as romantic interest so I have to wonder if I'm unknowingly doing that to him... I suffered a lot from that situation and I don't want to be a hypocrite and punish this guy just in case I've accidentally given off the wrong signals, you know?
Clarity,
Office 17622,
PO Box 6945,
London.
W1A 6US
United Kingdom
Phone/ Voicemail:
+44 (0)20 3287 3053 (UK)
+1 (561) 459-4758 (US).