foot injury: 54.1.2.3.5 and 31.

[elizabeth]

How can I best address the injury to my foot?

Hex. 54, lines 1,2,3 and 5. And hex. 31.

I have had a serious foot injury that I've tried treating with little to no success the past 4 months. The last doctor I went to I trusted, and now the foot is worse. I would like to know the best path of action from here on out as the injury isn't better and time wears on.

I have trouble seeing how hex 54 relates to health issues at all, as it is so centered on marriage and relationships. 31 looks hopeful (to take a maiden brings good fortune) although this has nothing to do (again) with relationships. Does anyone have insights on how the relationship lines in hex 54 can relate to health issues?

 

[Trojina]

Right so we moved right along from the 'life path' question then and on to feet

 

[elizabeth]

Yes, I did. What about it is confusing?

 

[Tohpol]

Yes, I did. What about it is confusing?

Your inability to have the good grace to answer the last thread before immediately jumping to another and expecting to be spoon-fed again. That's what is confusing. As you well know.

Topal

 

[diamanda]

Strange answer... I'll give it a go.

54 - "Undertakings bring misfortune". "transitory" = perhaps meaning initial rest?
54:1 - "A lame man who is able to tread" - some movement is restored.
54:2 - "A one-eyed man who is able to see", this brings to mind 10:3, "A one-eyed
man is able to see, A lame man is able to tread". 54:2 also says "The perseverance
of a solitary man furthers". Your injury kept you away from much social activity,
but the advice was to persevere. Or perhaps you felt lonely and without help.
54:3 - this definitely speaks about a position which harms your self-esteem.
It's a secondary position, maybe your self-confidence is dented because of the
injury? The position is not satisfactory. It may be warning you to look after your
self esteem. Or it might mean that the injury will leave a scar or something, and
thus you will feel that one of your feet is not as good-looking as the other..? Far
fetched, i know, but the thought came to mind.
54:5 - this speaks of freedom from vanity, and good fortune.

31 reassures you of the good outcome, and soon. It advises rest and receptivity.
And it also reassures you that your pulling power will still be intact..? Well, that's
always good to know!

 

[elizabeth]

As you well know.

Hi Topal,
No I was not aware there were (unwritten) rules about the order in which we reply to our own threads or the requirement to do so at all or each time there is a new post. I felt unduly attacked on that thread and thus did not (do not) think it deserved further attention. The implication made by the response(s) was that I was asking foolish questions. Fine. If that is what people think, that is their choice. I dont come to this forum to fool around and waste time. I don't get the idea that others do (for the most part) either. I felt someone was making light of a serious inquiry. I am still interested in other responses to that thread.

I dont understand why I am being essentially attacked for posting it, either.

++



Diamanda, MANY THANKS for replying. I like your interpretation as it actually gives me some additional ideas.

If the general message of 54 is undertakings bring misfortune -- hard to know if that means undertaking cure (seeking cure) vs undertaking a normal lifestyle (ignoring injury), just "living with it", walking on it, and do more damage. (This is the question I ask myself daily anyway). However the lines I guess from experience should be the focus so here we go:

Line 1 movement restored. Curious if there's a timeframe on this bc the issue is about movement, I have permanent damage to the articular cartilage (apparently) and so the cure would BE to restore movement fully but that has not happened yet.

LIne 2: yes it has impeded social activity (any activity, mostly physical though). Yes i've felt alone bc have not found decent or helpful treatment. What has been suggested has been dangerous in most cases (risking further permanent damage).

Line 3:. Very accurate. Has been a huge mental scar [as a former ballet dancer] to not be able to use/move my foot as I used to; but now to not even use it as a normal (non-active, non-flexible) human being when I cannot even walk on it normally.

Line 5. Freedom from vanity implies to me "You dont care how it looks." No, I don't, but I care how it *works*. Hmm... maybe freedom from vanity in terms of how it is cured or where (??) Good fortune implies healing.... Is this like finding a cure? (the other option would be coming to terms with a crippled foot for life..ouch.)

31 sounds good. (What is pulling power though?)

Too bad jesed is not around as he could probably peg the lines to months and give me an idea of where line 1 stands..am curious about the restoring movement issue as that is only a dream at this point.

Again Diamanda many thanks .

 

[Trojina]

Confused why anyone would post a thread with a query, get responses, completely ignore those responses and start another thread with another query. It happens reasonably often here but i can't say I understand it as a behaviour. Thats what I find confusing.

 

[elizabeth]

Trojan, I'm sorry if you think I have been rude. That hasn't been my intention and I don't think i have been. I can only reiterate what I've already said. I appreciate the people who are willing to engage in discussion on these forum threads -- any of them.

++

Diamanda, I popped on bc something else you wrote struck me. the "Lame man will tread" phrase. I"m not sure if that is meant as a prophetic type of thing (you will be cured), or if it means despite injury you function. (well, obviously). Perseverance (in treatment? in enduring pain?) furthers... It's hard to pull concrete steps from that but your reference to 10:3...you have something there. I will let it simmer.

 

[Tohpol]

Hi Topal,
No I was not aware there were (unwritten) rules about the order in which we reply to our own threads or the requirement to do so at all or each time there is a new post. I felt unduly attacked on that thread and thus did not (do not) think it deserved further attention. The implication made by the response(s) was that I was asking foolish questions. Fine. If that is what people think, that is their choice. I dont come to this forum to fool around and waste time. I don't get the idea that others do (for the most part) either. I felt someone was making light of a serious inquiry. I am still interested in other responses to that thread.
I dont understand why I am being essentially attacked for posting it, either.

Elizabeth, no one was attacking you. No one who responded to that thread was/is the slightest bit interested in attacking people. I think we all have better things to do. It would also imply we take fiendish delight in making Elizabeth feel bad! It's interesting you would see it in that way. Could you not be reacting and creating implications that simply weren't there? We all do it at times when we feel threatened, even if that threat is illusory. If our ego gets "scratched" it gives us an opportunity for reflection. Or conversely, we react and jump to conclusions. But have you actually thought you MAY not be seeing something? Is your I Ching interpretation as good as your self knowledge and vice versa? Are they linked?

Anyway, I do wish you well with your injury and I hope it HEALS for you.

Topal

 

[Trojina]

Agree with Topal and also on reflection I think rather than an insult or not taking you seriously the comments there to the contrary reflect that it is time for you to engage with your own reading more because it seems/feels to me the Yi is actually speaking to you in a way that somehow shows you aren't needing intermediaries so much with interpretation even if you think you do. That answer from Yi there was very direct ..talking to you...you didn't need us i think. Isn't it more complimentary than insulting to be told you're going beyond the level where you need to rely on supports alot ? Surely its disempowering to be encouraged to believe you will always need help with interpreting. I thought it was a lovely reassuring answer that didn't need much explaining and as i said very direct to you, which made me feel you'd really connected with the Yi...but maybe didn't know it, trust it, or take time to absorb it, before thinking others would know better than you about it.

 

[diamanda]

I don't like taking part in such 'arguing', but i will say something here as an
exception. The exception is that i like and respect all of you people, and i
don't think anybody is wrong here as such. I too did find that Elizabeth was
somewhat covertly attacked in the other thread, a bit told off, for not 'seeing
what's under her nose', that seemed to be the idea. I know the intentions of
the people who said that were good. Sometimes we have to be a bit harsh
with someone, to help them help themselves. I do believe the motivation
was good. But i also believe this was not the right occasion to apply that,
because it happens many times, to all of us i believe, to be so very much
emotionally involved in our own readings (sometimes, not always), that we
just cannot see it, even if it's right there. And then we ask someone, and
that someone says "oh, it's abc", and we're like "doh... of course, thanks!".
Topal, Trojan, and whoever else, i so much know why you said what you
said, but you must also have had moments like that, surely..? As im also
sure Elizabeth has had moments to be just a bit strict with others, to help
them see and help themselves. Oh well. There, that's what i wanted to say.

To come back to the question though. Out of curiosity i tried the Huang
method someone told me about once, as i've found it to be very accurate
and very illuminating every single time i've tried it, and i've found it works
especially well with many changing lines. From that you get the extra info
of the following lines:

40:2 - deliverance, kills 3 foxes, ie 3 cunning entities.
16:3 - do not hesitate, do not look upwards.
62:5 - still no rain; shoot and hit the one in cave.

I get the impression that you should not rely on doctors promising stuff to
you, but go for some sort of self-help solution. What will help you will perhaps
be to shoot one in a 'cave', well maybe what is meant here is look online for
forums/message-boards for people who had the same problem, and how they
got over it. Anyway this is the impression i get. 'Persevere' as in don't give
up, i can see hope there, so, in one way or another, you will end up with a
solution you're happy with.

 

[elizabeth]

Isn't it more complimentary than insulting to be told you're going beyond the level where you need to rely on supports alot ?

hi Topal/Trojan,

Yes - it is. And that thought occurred to me last night, are they really saying that I am now "too wise" (or too whatever) to need the help of other interpretations?

I was however and still am a bit peeved by that answer from the Yi. Bc while it may have spoken directly to me, I didn't get the kind of answer I was hoping for. (and I know it does this, tells us what we need not what we want to know, etc). But still. My aim in asking the question was more "which area of my life path do I need to work on"-- I expected the Yi to point out something, be it career or health or family or friends or hobbies. Instead I get a generic "kindness is its own reward muah ha ha." Ok. Sure, yes, that is TRUE -- it's not that it isn't true -- but that doesnt speak to a life PATH per se. I mean, I dont know anyone deceased who has gotten awards for kindness, know what I mean? I dont see that as a *path* per se. A character trait, yes, a path -- no.

And I will say I very often get readings where I am thinking about 1 concrete issue and it addresses another concrete issue going on in my life. That was not what I asked about but is clearly what it is "telling" me.

So - *huge exhalation* - I now *see* what was going on and again my apologies if I was in the wrong at any point. I have to just say, sometimes it is lonely "at the top" and sometimes you want to discuss things with another human being - comaraderie and whatnot. And I hope we can continue that on the forum in some form or another.

At ANY rate ... Diamanda thanks for your intermediary comments/efforts. To the others, thanks for being honest with me .

Now back to this reading.

Working in reverse order: "Shoot one in the cave". To me that conjures up a single solution, very narrow, but very targeted. Like you said maybe finding someone else like me with this and do an individual approach (no more generic injections from clueless drs EVER!) It says do not hesitate, so I have to keep trying to address this, OK.

And the 3 cunning entities. "Cunning" = not trustworthy? THe foxes get me every time. Deliverance implies moving past something bad. *Killing* 3 foxes, also, destroying 3 bad or threatening things. (who/what are they??) Sigh. I will keep searching.

[p.s. I have in the past used online forums but without exception the people I've met have all been 30 yrs older than me and had surgery (and usu they are not very active)! I really see surgery as a last resort but this darned situation is so unevolved in medical terms. I've learned more than I *ever* wanted to know about the anatomy of the leg and repercussions in upper leg joints when something goes wrong in the foot and you step awkwardly each day... And yet the problem remains unsolved.]

 

[Trojina]

hi Topal/Trojan,

Yes - it is. And that thought occurred to me last night, are they really saying that I am now "too wise" (or too whatever) to need the help of other interpretations?

Not exactly, everyone likes help with interpretations from time to time and actually i did give you my genuine interpretation on that thread. But prior to that 2 people had urged you to think over the answer for yourself on this occasion, and these were 2 wise people...there must be somehing in that eh ? And it was IMO a lovely direct answer...and i think you were being urged to think it through for yourself because perhaps it was a very important answer that would be more of a gift to you if you reached its meanings yourself. Perhaps in that instance feeding you the meaning wasn't the most helpful thing to do. Thats where i felt Mykeys comments were coming from. You'd received a beautiful gift of an answer ..maybe they wanted you to unwrap it yourself ..perhaps unwrapping a gift for someone spoils it a little ?

I was however and still am a bit peeved by that answer from the Yi. Bc while it may have spoken directly to me, I didn't get the kind of answer I was hoping for. (and I know it does this, tells us what we need not what we want to know, etc). But still. My aim in asking the question was more "which area of my life path do I need to work on"-- I expected the Yi to point out something, be it career or health or family or friends or hobbies. Instead I get a generic "kindness is its own reward muah ha ha." Ok. Sure, yes, that is TRUE -- it's not that it isn't true -- but that doesnt speak to a life PATH per se. I mean, I dont know anyone deceased who has gotten awards for kindness, know what I mean? I dont see that as a *path* per se. A character trait, yes, a path -- no.

Your answer said IMO something along the lines of 'You are thinking of gain and loss, how best you can gain advantage but you don't need to worry about these things. You are doing fine. If your heart stays good you have nothing to worry over". The Yi is actually pointing out to you the values you've internalised, that you have to struggle to gain advantage in life, thats what our culture tells us etc etc...and now theres the New Age vocabulary, ill thought out, borrowed and plundered from each and every religion to suit itself and comes up with the term 'life path' which seems eerily to be reminiscent of some kind of spiritual career path. What alot of the new age thinking has done is taken good old puritan work ethic capitalist materialist values and sprinkle them with a nice sugary coating of spirituality...and your question unwittingly seemed to me to buy into those values and it seemed to me (though i am bias obviously ) the Yi didn't play ball with those values...and you don't like that. Perhaps you wanted it to say you must go and do A, B or C or whatever..but instead it says all you have to do is go on and live your life and be not so concerned with gain and loss and more concerned with having a kind heart lol . What you said which I underlined I find hard to understand. I don't think the Yi is talking of kindness as simply being pleasant, more of a spiritual value striving for the good in the world whereever you are. From what I understand and have read this is the only value that counts after death (or ever ?) really...and we are sorely duped soon after birth that its the least important thing and money and careers and marriages and even clothes and ...are all more important. Actually thats a bit of a rant but why i liked your answer was it seemed to say your're doing perfectly fine and already satisy all that is required of you, just stay good hearted in all the areas of life you mention...family, work, friends, making your kind heart the centre of the directing of all these is your life path. I suspect its all of our paths. As the old saying goes something like noone ever dies regretting they didn't spend more time at work most regrets are over what we did to others and ourselves.

 

[elizabeth]

Wow.

OK, a lot to digest there. I see now that I really *really* was not *seeing* that message in the other thread, neither from the Yi nor from the wise respondents on the thread. Why I couldn't or didn't see it, I am not sure. I'm dealing with a lot right now though, a lot of pressure and confusion (international move, threats in the workplace/office, health issues, living situation unclear, financial situation in the air). There's not a lot of breathing room, maybe that is why.

perhaps unwrapping a gift for someone spoils it a little ?

Yes. And point taken. But I apparently couldn't untie the ribbon!

What alot of the new age thinking has done is taken good old puritan work ethic capitalist materialist values and sprinkle them with a nice sugary coating of spirituality...and your question unwittingly seemed to me to buy into those values and it seemed to me (though i am bias obviously ) the Yi didn't play ball with those values...and you don't like that.

I didn't realize that about borrowing from capitalistic approaches -- you're right though. And I certainly am the LAST person to support that way of life. I *left* it behind five years ago in favor of self fulfillment at the expense of creature comforts (as many on the board know).

But to further refine, well, for example, I'm a freelance writer. Within that "bubble" of freelance writing there are LOTS of nuances. What you write about and when and where it is published. For some (idiotic) reason I thought the Yi (if it were to choose to address the writing part of my life path) would point out something more specific -- embrace bigger challenges, let the little people go -- who knows, but some sort of metaphorical advice along those lines. Obviously, it didn't do so.

I know your phrase well (the last line), and I not only agree with it, but I try to live by it too. I guess this is another case of the Yi Ching as Mirror.

One other point, not to get too philosophical about it. But the answer the Yi gave -- "you're doing fine, stay good hearted, that's all that counts in the end" -- sort of seems to DISCOUNT the idea that life fulfillment is important. Sort of like, well you can do what you're told, get the boring desk job and die internally but come home to hot showers and a toaster. OR you can choose to struggle and pursue a dream that gives you a sense of esteem and self worth and fulfillment, but in the end NEITHER Of those matter. Or am I way off on that point?

 

[Trojina]

But to further refine, well, for example, I'm a freelance writer. Within that "bubble" of freelance writing there are LOTS of nuances. What you write about and when and where it is published. For some (idiotic) reason I thought the Yi (if it were to choose to address the writing part of my life path) would point out something more specific -- embrace bigger challenges, let the little people go -- who knows, but some sort of metaphorical advice along those lines. Obviously, it didn't do so.

I know your phrase well (the last line), and I not only agree with it, but I try to live by it too. I guess this is another case of the Yi Ching as Mirror.

One other point, not to get too philosophical about it. But the answer the Yi gave -- "you're doing fine, stay good hearted, that's all that counts in the end" -- sort of seems to DISCOUNT the idea that life fulfillment is important. Sort of like, well you can do what you're told, get the boring desk job and die internally but come home to hot showers and a toaster. OR you can choose to struggle and pursue a dream that gives you a sense of esteem and self worth and fulfillment, but in the end NEITHER Of those matter. Or am I way off on that point?

Well if honouring, loving and being kind to yourself is at least as important as being so to others..and if part of that is fulfilling oneself in ones work then it is in a way an act of kindness/honour to the self to follow the work one loves.. So I'd see fulfillment as on the same continuum as kindness really but am aware the word 'kindness' is becoming inadequate...(wonder what the actual Chinese translation is). The beauty of the answer i felt was that you need not even doubt your own existing qualities of benevolence, integrity, kindness, they will carry you through without any necessity for 'schemes' of any kind. You were hoping perhaps to be told 'drop small people' you said and so on...but somewhere in the cosmos your integrity already has more power than you think perhaps. I'd just say if was a very good omen for the path you are already on...if you continue with 'kindness as your virtue'.. If you made a material sacrifice to follow your longings then that seems to me on the same continuum as having a kind heart. For the heart of the situation of you mattered more to you than other things

Thinking of whether it matters or not if one doesn't fulfill personal potential but is good to others..well many many people find themselves in situations where it has seemed they have had to release personal dreams to care for others, esp women (more in the past) with young children, elderly relatives to care for, husbands with families to provide for etc etc. I guess i can't say how much that matters, in each and every case its a personal choice I suppose but i do think these days we realise more we owe ourselves at least as much as we owe others and hopefully we can do both.

 

[Tohpol]

Hi Elizabeth,

Nothing much to add except to say yeah it sure is lonely "at the top" in every sense of the word. From one (one-time) freelance writer to another, I wish you strength and faith as you navigate through all those pressures. If you can come through this period I'm sure you'll be the stronger for it. Thanks for coming back on this and sharing - appreciate it.

Take care,

Topal

 

[charly]

... Hex. 54, lines 1,2,3 and 5. And hex. 31...
I have trouble seeing how hex 54 relates to health issues at all, as it is so centered on marriage and relationships...

Elizabeth:

You have been given so good advices that maybe this post sounds you something superflous.

I believe that 54 1,2,3,5 → 31 is targeted directly to your consult:

You'r consulting about injury at the foot, wich line is the first, and in the first line is written

THE LAME CAN WALK. TO PROCEED IS LUCKY.​

But begining with the first, see an almost literal rendering:

H.54:
RETURNING GIRL.
inconstant girl, say The Fortune

TO GO BOLDY IS UNLUCKY.
do not hurry

NO FAR IS PROFITABLE.
do no exaggerate

54.1
RETURNING GIRL AS CONCUBINE
sometimes fortune is a damned fortune

LAME / CRIPPLED ABLE TO TREAD
even wounded at the foot one can walk
the lame is the consultant that doesn't know how to behave
we don't know how to behave but we behave as we can

TO ATTACK IS LUCKY
go, move yourself


54.2
ONE-EYED ABLE TO LOOK
blind men were often diviners, persons that can foresee
maybe doctors, specialists

PROFITABLE DIVINATION OF SECLUDED-MAN
profitable to consult with an hermit → natural or alternative healer (?)


54.3
RETURNING GIRL AS SLAVE.
damned fortune

WRONG SIDE UP: RETURNING AS CONCUBINE.
the coin can fall wrong side up, you'r warned

54.6
... THE MOON ALMOST FULL: HOPE OF FORTUNE.
just the time, there is hope of good luck

H.31:
ALL / MOUVEMENT
all the best, good move

FEAST. PROFITABLE OMEN.
enjoy, perspectives are profitable

CATCH THE GIRL.
catch the opportunity like a mudable girl → the fortune, by the hair.

LUCKY
it will be fortunate
​

Not about marriage or relations, but about being crippled, fortune, opportunity and how to behave.

Yours,

Charly

 

[elizabeth]

Thanks Charly. I don't think that your post was superfluous at all, in fact it is very helpful. If i understood correctly, line 1 implies move forward (find treatment); line 2, seek alternative means of healing; line 3 --not sure, a warning of sorts?; and I got line 5 in the reading but I think you accidentally pasted line 6 in the post.

Hex 31 "move." (that's ironic, given a lame foot!) but i guess it means the same thing, seek treatment, move forward, dont just laze around and dont give up on trying to find a way to heal the foot (?)

 

[charly]

... I got line 5 in the reading but I think you accidentally pasted line 6 in the post.

Hex 31 "move." (that's ironic, given a lame foot!) but i guess it means the same thing, seek treatment, move forward ...

Elizabeth:
I mistakenly put 54.6 but the message was from 54.5 that in Wilhelm / Baynes version ends so:

The moon that is nearly full brings good fortune.

I believe that it's a promise.

Maybe you have to look for a second or even a third specialized oppinion and maybe to do a consult with an alternative healer. If there is a chance and you look for it you can achieve good results.

But do not make desperate movements, do not run exaggerated risks, you has to be convinced.

Best wishes,

Charly

 

[elizabeth]

Thanks Charly, especially for the hope .

 

[charly]

Thanks Charly, especially for the hope .

It's written in the YI !

Might you to keep us informed about news?

Yours,

Charly

 

[mary f]

Well, I'll rephrase since I had read only the first page of the thread: be patient, be calm.
Your time is not the cosmos timing. You're just too anxious.
Take care.

 

[elizabeth]

Hi Charly,

Yes I will keep you (all) informed. I'll try to check back in a month or two with any progress and post again on this thread.

Thanks to all who replied .