I Ching said DECREASE

[uongshay]

I ask "How do I move on?"
My relationship of 3 years failed. I'm in a rut and have been for a while now. I needed advice on how to move on and what can I do to move on. I got:

10.4.5 > 41

10: "You tread upon the tail of the tiger. Not perceiving you as a threat, the startled tiger does not bite."
I take this as, you're in a dangerous/bad situation. Be careful.

.4: "He shows humble hesitation and breathless caution, yet still resolutely takes a necessary step on the tail of the tiger."
I take this as, take a step forward.

.5: "Though fully aware of the danger that lies on the narrow path ahead, the man is fully commited to move forward.The future is uncertain."
I take this as, commit to moving on... OR maybe don't?

RESULT IS DECREASE.

Why on earth? Why would moving on ever result in a decrease?

 

[Ncantabile]

Maybe you don't need to move on just yet, you may not be prepared for it.

I would try asking for "What I'm at this moment" and "What I need now"

 

[Trojina]

It doesn't result in decrease. 41 as the relating hexagram can be the entire context and backdrop to the question, it is not 'the result'. So in a context of decrease (41) you move on exceedingly carefully (10) and you may doubt you will make it somehow (10.4). You will of course but perhaps be prepared for a few thrills and spills along the way (10.5). In 10.5 one can almost be in situations one is not prepared for so one needs to be whole hearted about taking the risk. Maybe this relationship ending is a risky thing for you. There's no room to be faint hearted you have to be fully engaged in making a new emotional life with all the risks that might involve. If you want to move on you can't 'play it safe'. It seems to me that in order to find fulfilment emotionally or move forward you need to take some risks with your heart.

 

[Trojina]

And here is one of Hilary's blog posts on the topic of the tragedy of the belief that the relating hexagram is absolutely 'the result'

http://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2013/06/01/the-old-resulting-hexagram-conundrum/


I personally think the relating hexagram is fairly fluid in how it might be read. I feel the more change lines there are the more active the second hexagram is, so for me it can recede with just one line but gather more presence the more the primary hexagram 'tips' towards it. On occasion I think it does show aspects of the future or aspects of the 'result' but not in a linear way as in 'if you do the primary hexagram the second hexagram is what will happen'. In your reading I would think 41 is what you have just experienced or are experiencing, the decrease of loss of the relationship. It looks like more a productive loss however than a terribly traumatic one. In 41 the loss is a sacrifice for the sake of a better life.

As it says in the blog though the important thing to know is that both hexagrams, the primary and the relating hexagram will be present right now in the situation. The 'now' contains the past, present and future. The 41 is with you right now, it's not a future destination.

 

[diamanda]

Hi uongshay,

How do I move on?
I needed advice on how to move on and what can I do to move on. I got:
10.4.5 > 41

Your goal, moving on, i.e. completely getting her out of your life, is symbolised by 41, loss.
So in order to get there, you need what lines 10.4 and 10.5 describe.

10.4 describes "treading on eggshells", being very careful with someone.
I think this describes what you've been doing so far with her, trying to approach carefully.
10.5 in my experience describes someone angry and cruel - the way she treated you perhaps.
So, the only way for you to move on, is to see that this is the only option with her - fear and anger.
Once you fully realise this, you'll realise this is a lost case, and you'll stop wasting your time on her.

 

[uongshay]

Hi Trojina,

She was my best friend, my family, my everything. I suppose the risk is losing all of that. I've accepted the idea of losing a girlfriend but I don't want to lose my friend. I have been trying to hang on to the friendship (playing it safe) because I do love her so very much. Its been incredibility hard. She makes it so hard. Maybe she and I don't have mutual feelings. Your interpretation makes a lot of sense.

Also, thank you for clarifying the 'result' thing!

 

[uongshay]

Hi Diamanda,
You are right, she's been incredibly cruel and angry (for whatever reason). I have been nothing to kind to her. I don't know where she is accumulating her anger from. But after she yells, she always end up apologizing and saying the kindest things about me. I don't know why ever since we broke up she loses her temper and act as if she hates me (yell, curse, blame, etc), as if I had done something terrible to her (I did not).

I have been careful of her FEELINGS. Because she's been so angry, I nurture her feelings like a baby. Obviously, nothing works with her. Somehow, someway, she gets angry and mean.

Like my respond to Trojina, she was my best friend.

Well.. this is sad. I held her hand and went through so much with her. She forgot it all.
Thanks for your reply

 

[diamanda]

Uongshay, I have been in a similar position to her in the past. I felt anger, and it was because a) I had stopped desiring my partner, so I felt repulsed, and b) because I still liked him as a person, and felt guilty.

On the other hand, I have also been in your position, being rejected by someone who didn't desire me anymore. And so I totally understand how heartbroken you feel. I wish there was something I could say to help you here, but there isn't, sadly it just takes time. My only advice would be, the sooner you find someone new, the sooner you will get over her.

The fact that you were also friends is secondary - you two were a couple (with friendly aspects). You are not a couple anymore, so the friendship part is also gone for now. In my experience, it is very possible that you can again be friends with each other in the future, but it can take years - and a complete lack of any of you being in love with the other. There can't be "friendship" when one of the two is in love.

 

[uongshay]

I absolutely understand what you are saying Diamanda. I watched her drift away. I felt her slip away for months. She was always too busy and too tired to spend time with me. Whenever she had time, she had no desire to be with me. She insisted she needed to relieve stress by going out. I knew she was gone.

Actually, I was the one to end the relationship. When you spend so much time with someone. When you know them inside and out. You know when they change. And I knew. Sometimes I reacted. Sometimes I was upset by her standoffish, by her choices, by being less than everyone in her life. And because of that, she blamed me, saying I was the one who pushed her away. I never said anything. To be honest, I never call her out on anything. Months later, she admitted that she had changed. I didn't blame her. I thanked her for being honest and being brave enough to admit it.

People change. I get it. I met her when she had 1 friend and no job. Two years later, she had a lot of things going on for her. Got a job, made new friends, collected a handful of admirers, etc haha. Different situations can influence choices and priorities. Now, I could sit and read a book and it would still intensely annoy her.

Having been in her situation, what did you want from your partner?
Having been in my situation, what do you suggest I should do?

 

[Trojina]

Hi Trojina,

She was my best friend, my family, my everything. I suppose the risk is losing all of that. I've accepted the idea of losing a girlfriend but I don't want to lose my friend. I have been trying to hang on to the friendship (playing it safe) because I do love her so very much. Its been incredibility hard. She makes it so hard. Maybe she and I don't have mutual feelings. Your interpretation makes a lot of sense.

Also, thank you for clarifying the 'result' thing!

If you are scared of letting her go then that is the risk you have to take yes. You actually cannot be friends with someone immediately after a break up, at least it's very unusual. To be friends after a break up it would have had to have been a very mutual decision...but even then I think people need space from each other after ending a relationship or they cannot move on.

I don't know why ever since we broke up she loses her temper and act as if she hates me (yell, curse, blame, etc), as if I had done something terrible to her (I did not).

When I read this I thought if you have broken up why is she still there with you losing her temper ? Also I don't think you have realistic expectations here. You may be confusing her. If you finished with her when she didn't want you to then of course she will be upset with you, it's only natural. You didn't intend to do anything terrible to her but what happened does feel terrible to her obviously. I think perhaps you need to take responsibility for this now. If you ended the relationship and she didn't want to end it you can't be friends, at least not until some time has passed, usually quite a long time. I'm seeing it from her perspective and it looks like you want it both ways. You finished with her but say you love her and want her as a friend. That will be a very painful contradiction for her. You can be 'friends' in the sense you aim to bear one another no ill will but you can't be friends as in hanging out together after you have just been in an intense personal relationship. It won't work and she would find it terribly difficult and hence get upset.

So yes I think you need to take a risk in stepping out by yourself, separating properly from her and accepting this loss. If you cannot do that because you want her then you would have to go back to her. I think you have to make a clear choice here and also decide what you really want because I'm not sure you are clear about if you really want it to be over and she will sense that.

 

[diamanda]

Perhaps another reason for her anger is that it was you who ended it.
Obviously she already wanted it to end, but maybe only when she had already found someone else.
Showing you her anger constantly is not flattering for her character...

Having been in her situation, what did you want from your partner?
Having been in my situation, what do you suggest I should do?

I didn't want anything particular from my partner, I just felt bad and wanted to find a new one.
When I was in your position, I stopped contact. Very painful, but the quickest way out. It helps to focus your efforts towards finding someone new.

 

[rosada]

The Image of 41 advises controlling anger and decreasing desires. As a response to your question, "How to move on?" I see the IC advising you that you must Decrease your involvement with your ex at least so that you are not reacting like a lover. If you can be around her as a friend without arousing your passion (the tiger) for her well and good. However, as 10.4 sounds like someone begging for friendship while on the other hand 10.5 sounds like someone in control of their desires, perhaps you are being warned it may be very tricky to walk that fine line.

 

[uongshay]

Trojina, I hear you. You are right, she didn't want to break up and I didn't understand why. At that time, I was hopeful. I attempted to salvage my relationship. I asked her what she needed. I dedicated myself to adjusting to her needs. I refrained from calling her. I hardly texted her. I tried to not ask specific questions like (who were you with, what did you do, etc). Rather, I would ask "How was your day?" and leave it at that. All of those things I did because she felt she was unfree. Months went by, she hardly texted, hardly called. Even sadder than that, I hear about her life through her friends (parties she attended, things she posted on social media (I also refrain from all kinds of social media because I wanted her to feel "free" to do whatever she wanted without feeling like I watch over her shoulders). Needless to say, I was increasingly upset. I practically begged for her time. In my perspective, she no longer needed/wanted me. That's the reason why I didn't understand why the break up angered her.

My head is clouded and has been for awhile. I tried my best to see things from her perspective. I spent a lot of time asking myself was I being considerate and understanding of my girlfriend? I wondered if I was letting my emotions get the best of me. I wondered if it was my fault. I still think about it. These things still linger on my mind. So yes, I absolutely understand that there is also her perspective of the story and understand if she is hurt.

I don't know if I have the courage to separate properly from her but I will certainly try.

 

[uongshay]

Diamanda, I do agree that the breakup might have stirred up some anger. I also agree that she was no longer interested in me. Honestly, I never wanted to accept that she was waiting to find someone else but it certainly crossed my mind. It crossed my mind that she was waiting to find a solid "admirer" who was willing to pick up where I left off. I don't want to make any assumptions but it's hard to stray from negative thoughts in such a poor situation. If she is happier elsewhere, I won't blame her for not choosing me. I will certainly leave her alone.

 

[uongshay]

Hi Rosada, I find that involvement always stir up all kinds of emotions for me. As other members have suggested, my best option might be to cut involvement all together.

 

[bradford]

On Decrease, you need to be thinking more broadly than just the title.
It doesn't predict decrease. It tells you how to do more with less.

 

[canislulu]

Maybe you don't need to move on just yet, you may not be prepared for it.

I would try asking for "What I'm at this moment" and "What I need now"

I haven't had time to read the details of this thread. But I like Ncantabile's advise of asking "What" --- perhaps not instead of "How" but in addition to how. If uongshay has decided to move on and wants advise on "how" that is a good question. But asking "What time is it for Uongshay?" could give more general advise that may also be helpful. Does Yi think it is "time to move on" or some other "time"?

 

[Windrell]

Dear friend uongshay, you asked "how do I move on?" Hex10, 4,5<41:
I start with hex41/decrease, it's obvious, cut off all involvement!
Hex10, line 4:"he shows humble hesitation and breathless caution" WOW my friend everything you have written up to now is exactly THAT!
Ok, let's go to the next step, line5: "narrow path ahead, the man fully committed to moving forward"
BECOME A TIGER! EXPRESS YOUR ANGER, YOUR FRUSTRATION, ANYTHING YOU FEEL!!
Anger liberates! Be wild, for goodness sake! Brake FREE!
Stop being a sheep, a victim!